We Wasted $50K on Google Ads So You Don't Have To (2019) • Hacker News Board

Re: We Wasted $50K on Google Ads So You Don't Have To (2019)

#131

Post by throwaheyy » Fri, Jan 24, 2020, 9:45 PM UTC

colechristensen wrote: post #89

ryguytilidie wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do recruiting consulting and it blows my mind how every time I ask a startup how they differentiate from other startups and what specific advantages they want me to discuss, they give me a bunch of meaningless phrases. Its like founders are being taught a different language that they think provides value but makes no fucking sense.

The emperor has no clothes... there is a skill in speaking in an optimistic way using a series of intentionally vague words which smart people feel bad about not understanding so they just pretend they do and think positively about a product because for the life of them they could not articulate why the pitch/business/product didn't have any value. There's nothing to argue against because "I don't know what you're ta…

I have a term for this phenomenon — the ‘Endo factor’. Credit to the geniuses at Theranos.

Re: We Wasted $50K on Google Ads So You Don't Have To (2019)

#132

Post by ryandrake » Fri, Jan 24, 2020, 10:12 PM UTC

TeMPOraL wrote: post #71

ses1984 wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the target audience has business problems not file system problems. File system as a service doesn't tell me what business problems can be solved with this.

I think the immediate target audience are still technical people. Business people dealing with business problems indeed don't think about stuff like this. But the tech people that solve business problems for business people - they absolutely do. And they're the ones that select tools and design architectures for the solution.

You know how E-mail scams are always riddled with typos and grammar mistakes? A theory is that this is a deliberate way to filter out the people too smart/cyncial to fall for the scam. "By sending an initial email that's obvious in its shortcomings, the scammers are isolating the most gullible targets. If you trash their email, that's fine. They don't want you, someone from whom there's virtually no chance of receiving any money. They want people who, faced with a ridiculous email, still don't recognize its illegitimacy." [1]

When you say your service offers a cloud-based solution for delivering orchestrated micro-services powered by AI and ML, you're not targeting technical people who know this is bullshit. You're not even after business people with a real problem to solve. You're trying to isolate out-of-their-element execs with more budget than brains, who are impressed by jargon they don't understand, and who have a KPI to "undertake synergistic partnerships with hip technical solutions providers."

1: https://www.businessinsider.com/why-nigerian-scam-emails-are...

Re: We Wasted $50K on Google Ads So You Don't Have To (2019)

#133

Post by MR4D » Fri, Jan 24, 2020, 10:19 PM UTC

shripadk wrote: post #43

Left a comment on the IndieHackers page. Keeping a copy here for those who aren't reading the comments section. I have noticed this a lot in various websites I have helped in ad campaigns. Their biggest problem is their landing page. Just like this article uses lots of jargons to explain simple concepts, their landing page reflects the same. For those of you wanting to know more about landing page optimization just w…

I don't argue with your statement, but I found the summary at the end to be quite good:

$50K of lessons learned, summarized for you Let’s recap our lessons learned:

Narrow down your extended keyword set and focus on the keyword groups you have polished content and landing pages for, especially when you have a complex product.

Use an awareness ladder to inform keyword segmentation by purchase stage but revisit it often to validate and adjust.

Do not use the same landing pages for different steps of your awareness ladder.

Do not wait for leads to become paid users to decide on the quality of paid ads campaigns: focus on quick metrics and tailor experiments to one step of your funnel at a time.

Take a test-and-learn approach with small budgets to quickly fine-tune campaigns, focusing on page quality and clickthrough rates.

Run tests to optimize page content, which will reduce your cost per click.

Once you find your winner, you’re ready to go all-in. Now’s the time to pass it off to an agency to scale things up, if you are contracting out campaign management.

Re: We Wasted $50K on Google Ads So You Don't Have To (2019)

#134

Post by lbj » Fri, Jan 24, 2020, 10:23 PM UTC

With a solid post mortem like that, its not entirely lost. But with Adwords we're doing it to ourselves, drives bids up to a level where profitability becomes very difficult.

Re: We Wasted $50K on Google Ads So You Don't Have To (2019)

#135

Post by megablast » Fri, Jan 24, 2020, 10:40 PM UTC

ryguytilidie wrote: post #83

TeMPOraL wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Don't get too fancy with your taglines. People don't have time to understand what you are saying. People don't like fancy terminologies except for what is popular. It's worse than that. And it's my pet peeve about many startup landing pages these days. It's not like people don't have time to understand - there's nothing there to understand ! "Full stack adaptive delivery" is a near-meaningless phrase. It can be con…

I do recruiting consulting and it blows my mind how every time I ask a startup how they differentiate from other startups and what specific advantages they want me to discuss, they give me a bunch of meaningless phrases. Its like founders are being taught a different language that they think provides value but makes no fucking sense.

> they give me a bunch of meaningless phrases.

Because you are asking a meaningless question. Firstly, they are no experts on their competitors. Secondly, how can anyone even be, unless they have used all of them for a long time? Who can do that comparison??

Re: We Wasted $50K on Google Ads So You Don't Have To (2019)

#136

Post by xmprt » Fri, Jan 24, 2020, 10:42 PM UTC

ses1984 wrote: post #55

shripadk wrote: post #43

Left a comment on the IndieHackers page. Keeping a copy here for those who aren't reading the comments section. I have noticed this a lot in various websites I have helped in ad campaigns. Their biggest problem is their landing page. Just like this article uses lots of jargons to explain simple concepts, their landing page reflects the same. For those of you wanting to know more about landing page optimization just w…

On the other hand, if I saw "file system as a service" I would also bounce immediately becuase who needs that? I have a file system, it comes included in every/any os that matters. How does filesystem as a service help me?

You don't need a "filesystem as a service" but if you were one of the few people who did and you saw "full stack adaptive delivery" there's a big chance you're not going to read any further.

Let's say 50% of people actually read past the tagline. People like you might read a bit further and realize they don't need it anyway. People who do need it might not read further though and you'd lose that sale.

Re: We Wasted $50K on Google Ads So You Don't Have To (2019)

#137

Post by cosmodisk » Fri, Jan 24, 2020, 10:56 PM UTC

ryguytilidie wrote: post #83

TeMPOraL wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Don't get too fancy with your taglines. People don't have time to understand what you are saying. People don't like fancy terminologies except for what is popular. It's worse than that. And it's my pet peeve about many startup landing pages these days. It's not like people don't have time to understand - there's nothing there to understand ! "Full stack adaptive delivery" is a near-meaningless phrase. It can be con…

I do recruiting consulting and it blows my mind how every time I ask a startup how they differentiate from other startups and what specific advantages they want me to discuss, they give me a bunch of meaningless phrases. Its like founders are being taught a different language that they think provides value but makes no fucking sense.

LinkedIn is full of this shit. Depending on what people one follows or has in contacts, it's just too esy to forget there's anything else but 'thought leaders', 'thinkers in cheaf', 'harmony executors', 'power multiplier' and so on. Our office is next to a managed kitchen,one of those that cook food for restaurants on Deliveroo or Uber Eats. It's a kitchen. If you'd look at the owner's LinkedIn profile, you could probably say he's the next Elon Musk. You have a few managed kitchens, that's it.You are not a visionary,come on,man. Eventually others start copying.

Re: We Wasted $50K on Google Ads So You Don't Have To (2019)

#138

Post by cosmodisk » Fri, Jan 24, 2020, 11:06 PM UTC

colechristensen wrote: post #89

ryguytilidie wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do recruiting consulting and it blows my mind how every time I ask a startup how they differentiate from other startups and what specific advantages they want me to discuss, they give me a bunch of meaningless phrases. Its like founders are being taught a different language that they think provides value but makes no fucking sense.

The emperor has no clothes... there is a skill in speaking in an optimistic way using a series of intentionally vague words which smart people feel bad about not understanding so they just pretend they do and think positively about a product because for the life of them they could not articulate why the pitch/business/product didn't have any value. There's nothing to argue against because "I don't know what you're ta…

A few weeks ago had a call from a saleswoman,after multiple failed attempts ( she called a few people in the company until finally someone transferred across) she managed to talk to me. I get a fair share of emails,calls and LinkedIn messages because of my title- everybody is trying to sell. So I thought 'screw this, let's see what she's got to say'. After her intro, and me asking a number of questions,I was still not sure what she was selling ( something in the cloud). Started with some storage solutions and ended with some security analytics. So it's not the CEOs of these companies, it's the sales reps as well. How can ever buy anything if I have no clue what it is.

Re: We Wasted $50K on Google Ads So You Don't Have To (2019)

#139

Post by the_cat_kittles » Fri, Jan 24, 2020, 11:09 PM UTC

its just... absolutely insane to me... that anyone would not feel completely useless "trimming keywords" and conducting research to optimize an ad buy. people who do this- have you ever considered what this is doing to your mental state?

Re: We Wasted $50K on Google Ads So You Don't Have To (2019)

#140

Post by aledalgrande » Fri, Jan 24, 2020, 11:13 PM UTC

trimboffle wrote: post #38

michaelbuckbee wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like this a really uncharitable reading of the article. This is a real business that has built itself up from nothing to $100,000 per month in revenue (which is important as it means they aren't just burning VC cash in random acts of marketing) and they're speaking in precise terms about specific actions they've taken and the results they've gotten. I've no doubt that if you're unfamiliar with marketing that t…

Michael .... it’s really bad writing. You can’t say “hey ordinary person I’ll save you wasting $50k on AdWords” then instantly drop straight deep into the most arcane of mumbled, cryptic, faded rune digital marketing magic speak. Refer to the comment below from HN user 83457 who explains same but in English.

I am _not_ a marketer and I did not find this cryptic. If you've at all ever been involved in startups, you will know most terms.