Hiroyuki Nishimura, founder of 2channel, has taken ownership of 4chan • Hacker News Board

Re: Hiroyuki Nishimura, founder of 2channel, has taken ownership of 4chan

#181

Post by eropple » Mon, Sep 21, 2015, 6:22 PM UTC

exstudent2 wrote: post #176

TazeTSchnitzel wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You missed the part where that was a complete fabrication. Zoe Quinn didn't sleep with game reviewers, and even if she did, those supposed articles never materialised.

Here's Kotaku EIC Stephen Totilo admitting to Kotaku's ethical failures re: GamerGate. https://archive.is/4Tp9N#selection-7679.0-7679.603 He's downplaying it but the failures to disclose personal ties DID exist in many cases. He also references other ethical failings from Kotaku. None of this would have come to light without GamerGate. They regularly make references to pre-existing relationships now. Note that this i…

Those goalposts are heavy, aren't they? I mean, that's interesting, but it's completely unrelated to anything related to the coordinated harassment campaign aimed at Zoe Quinn. So what's your point, exactly?

Don't get me wrong: I love you guys. You have made "SJW" a desirable thing to be. I'm just not big on this whole dishonesty kick.

Re: Hiroyuki Nishimura, founder of 2channel, has taken ownership of 4chan

#182

Post by Nadya » Mon, Sep 21, 2015, 6:26 PM UTC

TazeTSchnitzel wrote: post #161

Karunamon wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tens of thousands, involved in a scheme? No, of course not, and I have no doubt that a lot of people liked it. That was a subjective judgement on my part - I think it's low effort nonsense. Here's the thing - would those tens of thousands of people have seen it in the first place if Hernandez hadn't talked up her friend on Kotaku? Would that niche of a title have wound up on the site at all if not for the personal co…

> I think it's low effort nonsense. Have you ever actually made a video game yourself, or written a piece of literature? Do you appreciate the effort this actually takes? > Here's the thing - would those tens of thousands of people have seen it in the first place if Hernandez hadn't talked up her friend on Kotaku? Sure. For one thing, Quinn had at least that many Twitter followers. It's a game, also, that covers ment…

\\Edit

I got DQ mixed up with another Twine game I had heard of at the time. This post can be more or less disregarded. See: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10254524

\\End Edit

>Have you ever actually made a video game yourself, or written a piece of literature? Do you appreciate the effort this actually takes?

Using the same tool ZQ used to make her game - it's literally 5-15 minutes online. The effort was next to nil.

http://twinery.org/

As someone who has actually worked on creating even a simplistic Zelda-clone, you're fooling yourself if you think it took any real amount of effort.

>written a piece of literature

The entirety of Depression Quest reads like simplistic hipster angst. Similar to "Will You Save Your Son", except at least WYSYS has some self awareness and was meant to mock this type of storytelling: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSm1Rn7Prcs

Maybe an hours' total of work for a low quality Twine game using a script written during a lunch break.

I think it's generous to even call it "low effort".

Re: Hiroyuki Nishimura, founder of 2channel, has taken ownership of 4chan

#183

Post by shubhamjain » Mon, Sep 21, 2015, 6:28 PM UTC

jnbiche wrote: post #174

fjxjduxich wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wasn't aware that they made a Fundamentals of Engineering certification exam for web developers.

First, just as a point of fact, WhatsApp is mostly mobile development and network engineering messaging systems, not web development. Disciplines that one would normally classify under "software engineering". Second, you appear to be confusing Fundamentals of Engineering exams and Principles of Engineering exams. There is no Fundamentals of Engineering exam for any engineering discipline, including structural, electr…

I am sorry but I still don't get what OP was referring to?

Re: Hiroyuki Nishimura, founder of 2channel, has taken ownership of 4chan

#184

Post by exstudent2 » Mon, Sep 21, 2015, 6:30 PM UTC

eropple wrote: post #181

exstudent2 wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's Kotaku EIC Stephen Totilo admitting to Kotaku's ethical failures re: GamerGate. https://archive.is/4Tp9N#selection-7679.0-7679.603 He's downplaying it but the failures to disclose personal ties DID exist in many cases. He also references other ethical failings from Kotaku. None of this would have come to light without GamerGate. They regularly make references to pre-existing relationships now. Note that this i…

Those goalposts are heavy, aren't they? I mean, that's interesting, but it's completely unrelated to anything related to the coordinated harassment campaign aimed at Zoe Quinn. So what's your point, exactly? Don't get me wrong: I love you guys. You have made "SJW" a desirable thing to be. I'm just not big on this whole dishonesty kick.

> it's completely unrelated to anything related to the coordinated harassment campaign aimed at Zoe Quinn.

That is my point. GamerGate isn't about harassment, it's about media, censorship, journalism, centralized vs. decentralized control and a bunch of other stuff.

Re: Hiroyuki Nishimura, founder of 2channel, has taken ownership of 4chan

#185

Post by epmatsw » Mon, Sep 21, 2015, 6:37 PM UTC

shubhamjain wrote: post #183

jnbiche wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

First, just as a point of fact, WhatsApp is mostly mobile development and network engineering messaging systems, not web development. Disciplines that one would normally classify under "software engineering". Second, you appear to be confusing Fundamentals of Engineering exams and Principles of Engineering exams. There is no Fundamentals of Engineering exam for any engineering discipline, including structural, electr…

I am sorry but I still don't get what OP was referring to?

I think that he was trying to be pedantic about the use of the word "engineer" in the context of software development.

Re: Hiroyuki Nishimura, founder of 2channel, has taken ownership of 4chan

#186

Post by TazeTSchnitzel » Mon, Sep 21, 2015, 6:41 PM UTC

Nadya wrote: post #182

TazeTSchnitzel wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I think it's low effort nonsense. Have you ever actually made a video game yourself, or written a piece of literature? Do you appreciate the effort this actually takes? > Here's the thing - would those tens of thousands of people have seen it in the first place if Hernandez hadn't talked up her friend on Kotaku? Sure. For one thing, Quinn had at least that many Twitter followers. It's a game, also, that covers ment…

\\Edit I got DQ mixed up with another Twine game I had heard of at the time. This post can be more or less disregarded. See: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10254524 \\End Edit >Have you ever actually made a video game yourself, or written a piece of literature? Do you appreciate the effort this actually takes? Using the same tool ZQ used to make her game - it's literally 5-15 minutes online. The effort was next…

> Using the same tool ZQ used to make her game - it's literally 5-15 minutes online. The effort was next to nil.

Writing something the length of Depression Quest, creating graphics, mapping out the story, quality assurance testing, composing music... this does not take 5 to 15 minutes. It is not nil effort.

If you think it's so easy, please, go ahead and recreate Depression Quest from scratch in 15 minutes.

Re: Hiroyuki Nishimura, founder of 2channel, has taken ownership of 4chan

#187

Post by dang » Mon, Sep 21, 2015, 6:42 PM UTC

ceedan wrote: post #118

halviti wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your statement makes the assumption that paying bills is the goal.

"Your statement makes the assumption that paying bills is the goal." Sure seems like it is, since -- you know -- he just sold 4chan. Thanks for your cute little contrarian comment, though. It was very stimulating.

> Thanks for your cute little

Please don't.

Re: Hiroyuki Nishimura, founder of 2channel, has taken ownership of 4chan

#188

Post by pa5tabear » Mon, Sep 21, 2015, 6:48 PM UTC

shubhamjain wrote: post #183

jnbiche wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

First, just as a point of fact, WhatsApp is mostly mobile development and network engineering messaging systems, not web development. Disciplines that one would normally classify under "software engineering". Second, you appear to be confusing Fundamentals of Engineering exams and Principles of Engineering exams. There is no Fundamentals of Engineering exam for any engineering discipline, including structural, electr…

I am sorry but I still don't get what OP was referring to?

It's a test that university graduates in the traditional engineering disciplines (civil, mechanical, etc.) usually take in the USA. After 5 years of work experience, you take another test, then your state's licensing board gives you a stamp and the credential "Professional Engineer" (P.E.). You can then take on liability for project documents that you stamp, so you charge clients/employers more money.

It's mainly useful if you work for a consulting company.

Re: Hiroyuki Nishimura, founder of 2channel, has taken ownership of 4chan

#189

Post by eropple » Mon, Sep 21, 2015, 6:56 PM UTC

exstudent2 wrote: post #184

eropple wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those goalposts are heavy, aren't they? I mean, that's interesting, but it's completely unrelated to anything related to the coordinated harassment campaign aimed at Zoe Quinn. So what's your point, exactly? Don't get me wrong: I love you guys. You have made "SJW" a desirable thing to be. I'm just not big on this whole dishonesty kick.

> it's completely unrelated to anything related to the coordinated harassment campaign aimed at Zoe Quinn. That is my point. GamerGate isn't about harassment, it's about media, censorship, journalism, centralized vs. decentralized control and a bunch of other stuff.

No, it's not. Don't get me wrong: I am certain that you believe that. I am not calling you a liar. But you're wrong. The core of GamerGate is the same bunch of misogynistic tools who have been around for years, occasionally manifesting into a herpetic flare-up somewhere or other before going away again for a while. (They didn't come from 4chan, but they incubated there.) Guys like Milo Yiannopolous don't give a shit about video games, they give a shit about hurting women, and you are useful by proxy. The rhetoric about ethics-in-journalism-etcetera-etcetera sounds nice, and in it you and I can find a bunch to agree with. But it doesn't matter. Because the actions are what matter, and the actions are fucking reprehensible. Please don't insult my intelligence with false equivalencies and but-but-but-both-sides because but-but-but-both-sides is not true. None of the misogynistic toolbags have been chased from their homes, none of them have been confronted with credible threats to their lives and their families. It has not happened. The notion that it has is fictional at its core.

The reason GamerGate functionally evaporated as quickly as it showed up, aside from particularly die-hard members of the useful-idiot troupe, is because most of your fellows went away once Stephen Colbert made fun of you. There's a reason why the influential string-pullers have been saying things like "give up and try again next year". Because they don't care about what you care about. The social credibility went away, and as soon as the social credibility went away that hard core couldn't do what they wanted to do with your help.

In the process of supporting their movement in the hopes that you get something out of it, you are hurting the defenseless. I hope you stop.

Re: Hiroyuki Nishimura, founder of 2channel, has taken ownership of 4chan

#190

Post by exstudent2 » Mon, Sep 21, 2015, 7:11 PM UTC

eropple wrote: post #189

exstudent2 wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it's completely unrelated to anything related to the coordinated harassment campaign aimed at Zoe Quinn. That is my point. GamerGate isn't about harassment, it's about media, censorship, journalism, centralized vs. decentralized control and a bunch of other stuff.

No, it's not. Don't get me wrong: I am certain that you believe that. I am not calling you a liar. But you're wrong. The core of GamerGate is the same bunch of misogynistic tools who have been around for years, occasionally manifesting into a herpetic flare-up somewhere or other before going away again for a while. (They didn't come from 4chan, but they incubated there.) Guys like Milo Yiannopolous don't give a shit…

I think you're conflating hurting women and fighting feminism. They are not the same thing. I'm not a feminist but that doesn't mean I'm a misogynist. It just means I don't agree with the tactics and politics employed by feminists (as a political group). I can't speak for everyone in GG, but I think my opinion is shared with others.

> None of the misogynistic toolbags have been chased from their homes, none of them have been confronted with credible threats to their lives and their families. It has not happened. The notion that it has is fictional at its core.

No one has had this happen to them. No one has been arrested on either side of GamerGate. There's no "credible threat" to anyone involved. The fiction you say exists on GG is evident in your own argument as well. No one is credibly being threatened.