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In Defense of the Midwest

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Re: In Defense of the Midwest

#171

Post by empthought »

klipt wrote: post #36
rdtsc wrote: post #7

Ah but it is not a defense of Midwest as a workplace. It is a defense of the Midwest as a living place and effectively working on the West cost, and by implication, getting a West coast salary. If you can do this arangement, it is not bad, agreed. However I found tech jobs wise Ohio was a shithole. The number of available jobs, the salaries, the expectations were just not there when I was looking. Like he said, the p…

> If you can do this arangement, it is not bad, agreed. I'd say it's a pretty great arrangement ... but probably difficult to pull off. Which means you're screwed if you lose your job. Doubly screwed if you already have a mortgage in place-that's-good-to-live-but-not-to-work.

You can pay for a mortgage in place-that's-good-to-live-but-not-to-work on a third of the West Coast salary needed.

Re: In Defense of the Midwest

#172

Post by AnimalMuppet »

msutherl wrote: post #24

(1) Cleveland gets all the Broadway shows once they go off Broadway, but at about half the cost, (2) We have great music here, including the world-renowned Cleveland Jazz Orchestra, and tons of bands come through, (3) We have some great sports teams (hi, OSU) and a ton of great sports fans (hi, Browns fans), (4) We have great food at very affordable prices Yes, exactly. As someone who lives in New York, this is the v…

Whatever floats your boat. You're into art and culture; NYC is a good scene for you. But if you're into something else...

How far is it from New York (City) to a good trout stream? Air that you can't see? A mountain peak above 10,000 feet? Powder skiing? (Yes, I know, those things aren't Midwest either, exactly.)

Re: In Defense of the Midwest

#173

Post by aros »

chaostheory wrote: post #123
bglazer wrote: post #9

I live in Memphis TN and I've found that comments on HN towards the middle of the US are skewed negative. Perhaps I have a bias for remembering negative comments. Nonetheless, I find this attitude perplexing from the HN crowd. I understand the value of physical proximity to lots of other like minded, smart people. However, I would have thought that the tech crowd would be the first to decry the inefficiencies of havi…

I lived in the South longer than I've lived in the Bay Area and I can tell you why I feel that the Bay Area's culture is better for technology (this goes for the midwest as well). In many places like the South (and Mid-West), most people tend to say variants of "Why?", "That's stupid", "That's crazy"; when you tell them what ridiculous, nonsensical or seemingly useless thing you want to build. Here in Bay Area more p…

  In many places like the South (and Mid-West), most people tend to say variants of "Why?", "That's stupid", "That's crazy"

  Here in Bay Area more people say, "Why not? That sounds fun."
Do you have any evidence to support this?

Re: In Defense of the Midwest

#174

Post by wtbob »

forrestthewoods wrote: post #46

You don't need to defend the midwest. Most people outside of San Francisco couldn't give less of a shit about San Francisco. The three primary smells of SF are urine, human feces, and weed. I think Seattle folk are becoming increasingly hostile to the idea of moving down there. Some dream of it of course, but I think they're decreasing in number. Google and Facebook are expanding up here because there's so much talen…

> Most people outside of San Francisco couldn't give less of a shit about San Francisco. The three primary smells of SF are urine, human feces, and weed.

I remember the first time I visited San Francisco: I was so excited to visit a city I'd heard so much about. There's a bar there which is supposed to be even better than one of my local ones; I arrived and discovered that a) it sold no food; b) the prices were double; c) the selection was worse; d) it stank of urine.

That entire city was a colossal let-down. I was so glad to return home. Maybe I should have had lower expectations?

Re: In Defense of the Midwest

#175

Post by AnimalMuppet »

zhte415 wrote: post #162
re_todd wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm tempted to move to a cheaper city inland, but I've heard horror stories of people trying to get to work when it snows. Is it extremely difficult to get to work in the winter?

Another part of the world, but where snow sometimes happens. Utilities stay up - water, electricity, internet. It is not a big deal. People work from home and understand this; those that must go to work arrive late and go home early, this is understood too. Just have a padded coat.

And good tires. And a snow scraper in your car.

Re: In Defense of the Midwest

#176

Post by AnimalMuppet »

BrandonM wrote: post #35
puls wrote: post #11

Carnegie Mellon is absolutely in the midwest. Pennsylvania is a big state.

I agree. I grew up in Ohio, and to me, Pittsburgh and the rest of western PA is part of the Midwest. It has the same farmland/steel-town culture that Ohio does. Obviously Philadelphia is not, so I would argue that the dividing line is somewhere in the middle of the state.

Well, see, this kind of depends on your definition of "Midwest". I grew up a fair distance west of Denver, and to me, the dividing line between East and Midwest is Chicago. The "real" west begins at Denver. This neatly divides the country into approximately thirds.

But to say that Ohio and western PA are "Midwest" because they're west of the Appalachians... bah. You easterners need to get out more. And if you think steel town culture makes you part of the Midwest, well... come west of Chicago and look around. You don't see many steel towns out here.

I mean, I suppose that's the labels that you grew up on, and it's how the locals label themselves, so on that level it's hard to argue with. But anything that includes "West" as part of the name (or even "Mid") that includes Pittsburgh... look at a map of the country, and then explain to me how that makes any sense at all.

Re: In Defense of the Midwest

#177

Post by lkrubner »

wwweston wrote: post #69
lkrubner wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your view of this is exactly backwards. To get an accurate view of what is happening, start with the assumption that all computer programming can be done remotely, from China or India. Now ask yourself, what kind of computer programming can not be done remotely? The kind that needs constant face-to-face contact, especially to maintain the relationship links between investors and engineers via a CEO. Those jobs need t…

> start with the assumption that all computer programming can be done remotely, from China or India. Now ask yourself, what kind of computer programming can not be done remotely? Just about any kind of software development can be done remotely, really. It's really a function of the skills possessed by everyone involved in a distributed team vs the obstacles distribution may or may not present (and there's different d…

You have defined the problem out of existence. Is that what you meant to do? If the middle of the country is full of great investors and great programmers and great customers and great CEOs then why are we even having this conversation? Why would anyone feel the need to write an essay like the one above? Why does the MidWest need defending? According to you, everything is already perfect.

Re: In Defense of the Midwest

#178

Post by msutherl »

autarch wrote: post #161
msutherl wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, if your tastes line up with mainstream cultural production, you're probably all set wherever you live. I happen to find it odd that people are interested in recapitulating the same music from the 18th and 19th century over and over again irrespective of what happened in music in the past 100 years (from serial music to minimalism, spectralism, post-minimalism, Wandelweiser, whatever, not to mention electronic…

Actually, I only like 20th century music or newer for the most part. I think our local orchestras and chamber ensembles do a pretty good job of including new music. There are also new music ensembles here. More would be good for my tastes, but it's enough to satisfy my interests. I just don't think I'd go to a new music concert every week even if I did live in NYC. Did you miss the part of my comment where I mentione…

Sorry for making assumptions here – point taken.

Re: In Defense of the Midwest

#179

Post by msutherl »

hueving wrote: post #127
msutherl wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Artists, musicians, artisans, chefs, writers, cultural institutions, etc. producing new, non-derivative cultural products that address current issues, articulate forward-thinking ideas, or otherwise awaken, expand, deepen, and question our understanding of and relationship with the world and all its myriad facets.

And what important forward thinking ideas have exclusively come from NY recently? Skinny jeans?

I should have said "perspectives." The production of ideas operates differently post-internet and isn't so geographically specific. If you want to talk about trends in art, music, fashion, etc., then I could list quite a few.

Re: In Defense of the Midwest

#180

Post by dirtae »

jdg wrote: post #14

There is a huge difference between founding a startup in the midwest and being an engineer in the midwest. I believe that gets lost in a lot of the rhetoric from both sides. I love hiring engineers in the midwest. Consistently great work ethics, etc, etc. On the other hand, if you're an entrepreneur, you don't live in SF and you're building a consumer internet startup, you're fucked. Primarily because your access to…

Yik Yak is a consumer Internet startup that just raised $61 million, and is based in Atlanta, GA:

http://techcrunch.com/2014/12/02/yik-yaks-new-funding-round-...

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