Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

In Defense of the Midwest

ntietz.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

111–120 of 182 posts

Re: In Defense of the Midwest

#111

Post by msutherl »

the_cat_kittles wrote: post #47
msutherl wrote: post #24

(1) Cleveland gets all the Broadway shows once they go off Broadway, but at about half the cost, (2) We have great music here, including the world-renowned Cleveland Jazz Orchestra, and tons of bands come through, (3) We have some great sports teams (hi, OSU) and a ton of great sports fans (hi, Browns fans), (4) We have great food at very affordable prices Yes, exactly. As someone who lives in New York, this is the v…

what is your idea of culture?

Artists, musicians, artisans, chefs, writers, cultural institutions, etc. producing new, non-derivative cultural products that address current issues, articulate forward-thinking ideas, or otherwise awaken, expand, deepen, and question our understanding of and relationship with the world and all its myriad facets.

Re: In Defense of the Midwest

#112

Post by justin66 »

ggreer wrote: post #44

I think the main reason the author prefers the midwest is because he was raised there. Property values and migration flows attest to people generally preferring the coasts. I've lived in a lot of places: The UK, Alabama, Illinois (for a short time), Guam, Washington, New York, and California. Not having a home town, I think I'm better positioned to evaluate these places. My least favorite region is the south, followe…

> Not having a home town, I think I'm better positioned to evaluate these places. My least favorite region is the south, followed closely by the midwest. The reason is simple: overt racism.

I'm not saying you're wrong but it's worth noting that the black population has been increasing in the south for a while due to migration. It's an interesting trend.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/25/us/25south.html?pagewanted...

Re: In Defense of the Midwest

#113

Post by eli_gottlieb »

ggreer wrote: post #44

I think the main reason the author prefers the midwest is because he was raised there. Property values and migration flows attest to people generally preferring the coasts. I've lived in a lot of places: The UK, Alabama, Illinois (for a short time), Guam, Washington, New York, and California. Not having a home town, I think I'm better positioned to evaluate these places. My least favorite region is the south, followe…

>Property values and migration flows attest to people generally preferring the coasts.

Actually, migration flows show people preferring the Sun Belt, despite the lower salaries and productivity rates. The coasts simply can't build housing fast enough to both accept migrants and maintain their own native-born populations.

Re: In Defense of the Midwest

#114

Post by the_cat_kittles »

msutherl wrote: post #111
the_cat_kittles wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

what is your idea of culture?

Artists, musicians, artisans, chefs, writers, cultural institutions, etc. producing new, non-derivative cultural products that address current issues, articulate forward-thinking ideas, or otherwise awaken, expand, deepen, and question our understanding of and relationship with the world and all its myriad facets.

what about all the stuff that has been created since the dawn of time up to this point? crap?

Re: In Defense of the Midwest

#115

Post by Ollinson »

nostromo wrote: post #90
msutherl wrote: post #24

(1) Cleveland gets all the Broadway shows once they go off Broadway, but at about half the cost, (2) We have great music here, including the world-renowned Cleveland Jazz Orchestra, and tons of bands come through, (3) We have some great sports teams (hi, OSU) and a ton of great sports fans (hi, Browns fans), (4) We have great food at very affordable prices Yes, exactly. As someone who lives in New York, this is the v…

New York does have a great arts scene; but unless you're an artist, it'll always be peripheral to your day to day life. Day to day life in New York is dreary. By American standards it's a filthy city. It smells and will always smell because trash is collected on the sidewalk. It manages to be both too hot and too cold. On summer days, a blanket of pollution hangs in the city air. The waterways are toxic after rainfal…

The subway makes the culture in NYC different than almost any other major city in the US.

If you lived in NYC maybe you understand. In other cities you can get around with public transportation, in NYC it's unquestionably the way to get around by everyone from day laborers to movie stars.

Also, your narrative of grittiness is very different than the other popular narrative, that NYC is now "disney" full of tourists, cops and wealthy transplants.

The simple fact remains that people want to be here in NYC despite whatever criticism.

Re: In Defense of the Midwest

#116

Post by hirsin »

msutherl wrote: post #89
autarch wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This afternoon I just went to see a new opera that premiered yesterday at the Minnesota Opera Company (The Manchurian Candidate). I hardly feel deprived living in Minneapolis with the The Minnesota Orchestra, The Minnesota Opera, The St. Paul Chamber Orchestra, The Schubert Club, and a dozen other ensembles I'm forgetting. And that's just classical music, which is what I'm interested in. If you're into live theater t…

Right, if your tastes line up with mainstream cultural production, you're probably all set wherever you live. I happen to find it odd that people are interested in recapitulating the same music from the 18th and 19th century over and over again irrespective of what happened in music in the past 100 years (from serial music to minimalism, spectralism, post-minimalism, Wandelweiser, whatever, not to mention electronic…

> if your tastes line up with mainstream cultural production, you're probably all set wherever you live.

Up to a point, and then you're selling Cleveland short. The points on Broadway and the Orchestra both bear repeating - literally world-class in both regards, at half (or less!) the ticket price. On the hipster/contemporary side of things, I was spoiled for choice as a student in Cleveland - fantastic craft beer (I prefer it over most on the West Coast), concert venues like the Grog Shop[0] that rival most places in Seattle, and Ohio City (Cleveland suburb) is nigh indistinguishable from any other yuppie district over here (well, until you look at the prices).

In fact, the only thing that sticks out as missing is the lack of good clubs and an LGBT district, although Cleveland did just host the Gay Games last year. I'll echo other comments here - if someone offered me a 5% pay cut to move to Cleveland, I'd actually give it some thought.

0. http://www.grogshop.gs/

Re: In Defense of the Midwest

#118

Post by jessedhillon »

wwweston wrote: post #69
lkrubner wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your view of this is exactly backwards. To get an accurate view of what is happening, start with the assumption that all computer programming can be done remotely, from China or India. Now ask yourself, what kind of computer programming can not be done remotely? The kind that needs constant face-to-face contact, especially to maintain the relationship links between investors and engineers via a CEO. Those jobs need t…

> start with the assumption that all computer programming can be done remotely, from China or India. Now ask yourself, what kind of computer programming can not be done remotely? Just about any kind of software development can be done remotely, really. It's really a function of the skills possessed by everyone involved in a distributed team vs the obstacles distribution may or may not present (and there's different d…

...though sometimes they strangely don't all want to invest in a slick social deals pyramid or revenue-free chat app or whatever else is hot at the moment...

You can't argue with returns, and "slick" VC returns trump Smallville's every day of the week.

Re: In Defense of the Midwest

#119

Post by turbostyler »

micro-ram wrote: post #8
larrywright wrote: post #3

As a fellow Midwesterner, I say "Amen". I live halfway between Chicago and St. Louis - a two hour drive in either direction. We've got everything we need, including great schools and tons of dining and entertainment options. I own a 2500 square foot house that will be completely paid for in 10 years, and my mortgage is ~$700/month. I've been to both coasts and many large cities in the US and abroad. I'd still rather…

Agreed. Hi neighbor. Have 200mbit fiber now. Getting gigabit fiber in a few days. Welcome to Central Illinois. NO TRAFFIC!

If the two best things I could say about my city were fast internet and no traffic, I'd kill myself - or move, I guess.

Re: In Defense of the Midwest

#120

Post by STRML »

Ollinson wrote: post #115
nostromo wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

New York does have a great arts scene; but unless you're an artist, it'll always be peripheral to your day to day life. Day to day life in New York is dreary. By American standards it's a filthy city. It smells and will always smell because trash is collected on the sidewalk. It manages to be both too hot and too cold. On summer days, a blanket of pollution hangs in the city air. The waterways are toxic after rainfal…

The subway makes the culture in NYC different than almost any other major city in the US. If you lived in NYC maybe you understand. In other cities you can get around with public transportation, in NYC it's unquestionably the way to get around by everyone from day laborers to movie stars. Also, your narrative of grittiness is very different than the other popular narrative, that NYC is now "disney" full of tourists,…

Have you been to other cities with underground metro lines? The NYC subway is the dirtiest, noisiest, most claustrophobic metro system I've ever used; it even gives London a run for its money.

There are other great cities out there. Many of them do things differently, and do quite well at it. Try Hong Kong or Singapore's underground, or in Europe, Vienna's - even the ones in China are cleaner and easier to navigate.

I agree with nostromo. A day in New York is a day endlessly pushing against roadblocks, those roadblocks being people, traffic, delays, dirt, bad neighborhoods, long commutes, noise, expensive living, expensive eating... and all of that just to live in your tiny box and think that you're a part of it all.

I'll take small to medium-size towns any day, over that.

Post reply on HN