Lee Kuan Yew's Singapore Story (2023) • Hacker News Board

Re: Lee Kuan Yew's Singapore Story (2023)

#171

Post by rrvsh » Sat, Jun 06, 2026, 12:10 AM UTC

Pay08 wrote: post #27

roenxi wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have no idea and probably not, but it is a bit more complex than that. There isn't any particular rule saying that the only functional democratic model is multi-party democracy. One could imagine a successful democratic model with one party allowing diverse internal factions, for example. It is really hard to get a read on China, but their success raises some interesting questions of how exactly their internal part…

From what I've read (and this may very well be outdated), Singapore is generally democratic, but the PAP does such a good job of running the country that people don't vote for other parties.

That's largely PAP propaganda. The sentiment on the ground is divided into these groups:

1. (an increasingly smaller portion) The PAP has done this well thus far and brought us to the first world 2. (a large portion) The PAP has too much power and can silence all its opposition - I don't want to suffer the consequences it has historically delivered upon its detractors by voting against them 3. (an increasingly larger portion) The PAP is good but it has too much power and has been allowed to engage in rampant authoritarianism and ivory tower bullshit - the opposition politicians would do a better job 4. The PAP is unequivocally bad and should never be in power (due to their historic actions like underpaying the Malay population for their land, operation Coldstore, etc.)

Additionally, the government blatantly engages in any tactics they can to get more votes, with documented widespread gerrymandering, holding snap election dates right after major PAP wins to capitalised on increased positive sentiment without giving opposition parties time to prepare, silencing/deplatforming opposition politicians, and enacting laws that prevent anyone but their chosen caste to be elected to positions of power

Re: Lee Kuan Yew's Singapore Story (2023)

#172

Post by rrvsh » Sat, Jun 06, 2026, 12:16 AM UTC

shellfishgene wrote: post #39

seanlinmt wrote: post #7

Singapore is a strange outlier among successful democratic countries. There's always stories that are untold. For example, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lim_Chin_Siong?wprov=sfla1 Operation Spectrum untracing the conspiracy' https://share.google/2mRpZk3RGaYUKCRXS

"Over the following decades, Lee built a strong government that was backed by a competent and virtually corruption-free civil service..." This part of the history, only mentioned in this one sentence, is the most interesting and relevant for other countries, and is really what sets Singapore apart from other countries in the region.

The corruption is not as blatant as you will see in other nations, and it works to make people believe the lie that its not corrupt, as you can see in the other thread in the replies to your comment.

The way corruption manifests in Singapore is legally and baked into the system - we are a city smaller than NYC but have _five_ mayors, none of which an average citizen can name or even have heard of having a mayor. Party politicians sit on the boards or occupy high C-suite positions of major companies and collect salary from all of them. Government politicians and high-ranking civil servants enjoy the best quality of life possible in Singapore, funded by taxpayer dollars, and barely have to do any work for it once they are in the position due to the single party system and only having to vote along party lines to keep it.

Re: Lee Kuan Yew's Singapore Story (2023)

#173

Post by nerdsniper » Sat, Jun 06, 2026, 12:34 AM UTC

rrvsh wrote: post #167

nerdsniper wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did I misread your thesis? It seemed like your strongest argument is “survival must be earned” and your most immediate claim to this is that “Singapore avoids multiculturalism.” And then you kind of go on to imply that because they avoid being multicultural they instead are detail oriented and technically competent. A lack of multiculturalism seems…like a very very nonsensical claim to make about Singapore. Its one o…

It is not nonsensical in the slightest. The government does their best to maintain a monoculture while promoting the farce of multiculturalism, because a monoculture facilitates easier economic growth which is the overall aim of the government rather than cultural development. Multiculturalism is essentially pacification because obviously this is unpopular

So you're saying what?

1) The countries that are less multicultural than Singapore are more technical?

2) The countries that are more multicultural than Singapore are less technical?

3) The diversity of foods, religions, ethnic backgrounds, and economic backgrounds in Singapore celebrated here [0] is completely fake?

0: https://www.sg101.gov.sg/society/multicultural/

Re: Lee Kuan Yew's Singapore Story (2023)

#174

Post by defrost » Sat, Jun 06, 2026, 12:41 AM UTC

nerdsniper wrote: post #173

rrvsh wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is not nonsensical in the slightest. The government does their best to maintain a monoculture while promoting the farce of multiculturalism, because a monoculture facilitates easier economic growth which is the overall aim of the government rather than cultural development. Multiculturalism is essentially pacification because obviously this is unpopular

So you're saying what? 1) The countries that are less multicultural than Singapore are more technical? 2) The countries that are more multicultural than Singapore are less technical? 3) The diversity of foods, religions, ethnic backgrounds, and economic backgrounds in Singapore celebrated here [0] is completely fake? 0: https://www.sg101.gov.sg/society/multicultural/

> Where every citizen is equal, regardless of race, language or religion

Citizen is a pretty key word there - things are pretty okay for most citizens, damn fine for the elite, and rosy for the well heeled ex-pats and foreign STEM workers.

There's an underside of non citizen day workers that stream back and forth, and a deeper layer of hell for indentured "lesser" Asians of the region that are looked down upon and struggle.

Re: Lee Kuan Yew's Singapore Story (2023)

#175

Post by BirdieNZ » Sat, Jun 06, 2026, 1:04 AM UTC

arjie wrote: post #71

andrewstuart wrote: post #2

"I could not ask their sons to fight and die for the properties of the wealthy: Lee Kuan Yew" "I resolved to enable every household to own its own home. If we were going to get the people to take National Service seriously, I could not ask their sons to fight and die for the properties of the wealthy. We worked out a personal savings scheme that allowed them to own an apartment painlessly through instalments over 20…

It’s a pretty good policy: Singapore owns most land and therefore you lose the rent-seeking ability on land. So all homes are leasehold apartments and the government can develop places either by right or by using repurchase agreements with substitution. A unique setup that works given their constraints. In the worst case, you get to hold your apartment 99 years and then the government can take it all back to redevelo…

It's basically one way to implement Georgism, and is a standout real world example of why land ownership policies are very important.

Re: Lee Kuan Yew's Singapore Story (2023)

#176

Post by freewestpapua » Sat, Jun 06, 2026, 1:44 AM UTC

teleforce wrote: post #151

freewestpapua wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Naturally they inter-married, Earlier you claimed 'originally settled by Malays' now you're saying Malays inter-married with the actual indigenous population. That's like saying European Americans inter-married with actual native population and therefore European Americans are now the first peoples in America. I'm unsure if it is worth discussing further with someone that would manipulate facts in this way. I'll al…

>Earlier you claimed 'originally settled by Malays' now you're saying Malays inter-married with the actual indigenous population. I said what you have quoted of me previously: "The people who originally settled in the Malay Archipelago several thousands years ago were successful maritime explorers." >you started talking about 'land grab by Chinese immigrants in Singapore' which is unrelated to the claims you original…

> "The people who originally settled in the Malay Archipelago several thousands years ago were successful maritime explorers."

You are again attempting to claim that 'Malays' or perhaps you're trying to imply 'Austronesians' are the first people to populate Phillipines, Malaysia, Indonesia, Papua. I think it isn't possible to have a useful conversation if you are repeating that falsehood. That's the exact equivalent of claiming 'the people who who originally settled the Americas were succesful maritime explorers' in an attempt to convince everyone that Europeans and Native Americans are now the same thing.

I have to remind you again since you refuse to acknowledge the issue. What is happening in West Papua is horrific. It is what 'Malays'/Austronesians have done repeatedly (to different extents) throughout South East Asia and Oceania and the world has let it happen because Melanesian lives don't even make the front page when one of us got skinned alive by 'Malay' settlers. [1]

[1] https://www.hrw.org/the-day-in-human-rights/2024/04/02

Re: Lee Kuan Yew's Singapore Story (2023)

#177

Post by rayiner » Sat, Jun 06, 2026, 2:04 AM UTC

teleforce wrote: post #165

RivieraKid wrote: post #110

I've recently went into a rabbit hole of learning about Singapore. It's fascinating that you can transform a developing country into a country that's almost on the level of Switzerland in 60 years. I wonder what's the responsibility of various factors behind their success. Is it mainly the people? Strategic location? Great governance and policies?

> I wonder what's the responsibility of various factors behind their success. Is it mainly the people? Strategic location? Great governance and policies? It's mainly its strategic location and it's always been the the busiest maritime route chokepoint since recorded history between east and west, specifically between India and China two of the most populous nations in the world. It sit right at the tip of the Strait…

> Essentially, you must have be a bone-headed to screw up Singapore

The place that is now Singapore had less than 1,000 people when Raffles got there. So what happened?

There’s lots of places with strategic locations or natural resources or such advantages. The U.S. has the largest contiguous stretch of fertile land connected to one of the largest navigable river systems in the world. But the north american indians did essentially nothing with it. It’s not easy to make a modern civilization out of even a favorable geographical situation.

Re: Lee Kuan Yew's Singapore Story (2023)

#178

Post by rayiner » Sat, Jun 06, 2026, 2:11 AM UTC

rrvsh wrote: post #166

teleforce wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I wonder what's the responsibility of various factors behind their success. Is it mainly the people? Strategic location? Great governance and policies? It's mainly its strategic location and it's always been the the busiest maritime route chokepoint since recorded history between east and west, specifically between India and China two of the most populous nations in the world. It sit right at the tip of the Strait…

The reason for your last point is that Singaporeans are taught in school that we were nothing but a fishing village until first colonialism (and Chinese immigrants) arrived and turned us into a major port, then the PAP (Lee Kuan Yew's party) turned us into a first world nation. It's really propaganda, and of course you wouldn't bother looking up information that you were taught to see as truth when you were a young c…

Many post-colonial societies (Arabs, Indians, etc.) puff up their supposed past wealth and success, but that’s the real propaganda. Even when these countries were on important trade routes or whatever, the per-capita GDP of these places never went much above the subsistence level. High estimates of the per-capita GDP of the Roman Empire have it at around half of modern India. These societies were very poor in pre-colonial times.

Re: Lee Kuan Yew's Singapore Story (2023)

#179

Post by [deleted] » Sat, Jun 06, 2026, 2:13 AM UTC

nerdsniper wrote: post #173

rrvsh wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is not nonsensical in the slightest. The government does their best to maintain a monoculture while promoting the farce of multiculturalism, because a monoculture facilitates easier economic growth which is the overall aim of the government rather than cultural development. Multiculturalism is essentially pacification because obviously this is unpopular

So you're saying what? 1) The countries that are less multicultural than Singapore are more technical? 2) The countries that are more multicultural than Singapore are less technical? 3) The diversity of foods, religions, ethnic backgrounds, and economic backgrounds in Singapore celebrated here [0] is completely fake? 0: https://www.sg101.gov.sg/society/multicultural/

[deleted]

Re: Lee Kuan Yew's Singapore Story (2023)

#180

Post by rayiner » Sat, Jun 06, 2026, 2:21 AM UTC

nerdsniper wrote: post #161

kardianos wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lee had a dedication to results, not ideology. Survival is not right; survival must be earned. They explicitly avoid multi-culturalsim and groom technically competent, detail oriented bureaucrats and politicians. In other words, they view reality as real and consequential, and they do what works and take the next step.

Did I misread your thesis? It seemed like your strongest argument is “survival must be earned” and your most immediate claim to this is that “Singapore avoids multiculturalism.” And then you kind of go on to imply that because they avoid being multicultural they instead are detail oriented and technically competent. A lack of multiculturalism seems…like a very very nonsensical claim to make about Singapore. Its one o…

> Its one of the most celebrated intersectional cities merging the identities of three different major regions

The Chinese population share in Singapore is similar to the white population share in Nebraska (75%). And Singapore has maintained the same 75% Chinese supermajority since 1960, despite Malays having about double the total fertility rate of Chinese since the 1980s.