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IRIS²: The EU’s Response to Musk’s Starlink

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Re: IRIS²: The EU’s Response to Musk’s Starlink

#171

Post by peterfirefly »

lispm wrote: post #153
peterfirefly wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I love trains -- but planes are usually a better solution than high-speed trains. They will be an even better solution when we have small electric jets, especially for inter-European flights. Do you think the first practical electric jet will come from a subsidized EU development plan -- or from a VP funded US company?

> but planes are usually a better solution than high-speed trains I was traveling this week with both, an Airbus from Lufthansa and high-speed trains from Siemens.

And which one was taxed and which one was subsidized?

Re: IRIS²: The EU’s Response to Musk’s Starlink

#172

Post by amm »

viraptor wrote: post #156
amm wrote: post #121

Too little, too expensive, too late? Once again the EU is playing catch up with last gen tech. Starlink is almost 10 years old - conceptually even older. Iridium has been around for over 25 years. If the EU was serious, it should have invested proactively in next gen satellite direct to device tech that is around the corner in the US. AST SpaceMobile is close to starting commercial activity for satellite based 5G tha…

> too expensive What's your source for good cost of launching satellite communication networks? Would you like to show us the reasoning here? > it should have invested proactively in next gen satellite direct to device tech If the current one works - why would they? For defence usage, reliable is better than next gen usually. (Something something next gen F35 still not usable) > I wonder where cost competitive launch…

> What's your source for good cost of launching satellite communication networks?

- falcon 9 - $2700/kg

- falcon heavy - $1400/kg

- ariane 5 - $9000/kg

> If the current one works - why would they?

This is just low quality flame bait. If any of the before-mentioned (US) companies succeed commercially long-term, they will transform world-wide internet access especially in less developed countries.

For clarification: as a European citizen, I want the EU to stay competitive in the space tech sector.

Re: IRIS²: The EU’s Response to Musk’s Starlink

#173

Post by TheLoafOfBread »

frankreyes wrote: post #132
RedShift1 wrote: post #30

I don't like putting more junk into LEO than we absolutely have to because it disrupts our space telescopes (which the EU has also invested over 1 billion euro in). I much rather have the funding go to improving land based internet infrastructure.

The whole point of Starlink is that it's economically unfeasible to reach everywhere. Specially in rural areas, neither cables, fiber optics or 5G will make it. Keep wasting money in Europe.

If there is a point to bring electricity into a village, then there is a point to bring there also a fiber.

Re: IRIS²: The EU’s Response to Musk’s Starlink

#174

Post by TheLoafOfBread »

concordDance wrote: post #44

Does it annoy anyone else that the title says "Musk's Starlink"? Yes, it was his idea and he is the main driving force and owns half of the company, but any project like this is a collaborative effort between tens of thousands of people.

Larry Ellison's Java

Re: IRIS²: The EU’s Response to Musk’s Starlink

#175

Post by peterfirefly »

sschueller wrote: post #168
peterfirefly wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The mRNA vaccine also came out of the "EU". Why did BioNTech have to partner up with American Pfizer to get anywhere with their (groundbreaking!) technology? Why did we give the Americans the secret sauce? > Rampent capitalism causes people to suffer and die. Ill-informed but strongly held attitudes like that are a big problem in the EU. There would be a lot fewer people on Earth and they would suffer a lot more if…

I am not saying no capitalism, I am saying regulation is good. Such as in no child labor[1] and enforced safety standards[2], which yes, slows down innovation but safe lives. Sadly most regulations are made in blood. No regulations are fine and dandy unless you are one of the first 346 to die from Boeing's MAX disaster until the "market corrects itself". Even the EU has been complaining how expensive it is to run rai…

Paper routes and other forms of light work are good for children.

The bad kinds of child labour disappear as poverty disappears. No need for any hard regulation there.

I actually looked at the reported workplace safety violations and the reported workplace accidents for Tesla a couple of years ago to see whether the reporting was biased against Tesla or not -- turns out it was. It still is.

Re: IRIS²: The EU’s Response to Musk’s Starlink

#176

Post by defrost »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #142
WithinReason wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are not visible to people when the satellites are in the shadow of the Earth (at night)

> are not visible to people when the satellites are in the shadow of the Earth (at night) Night is altitude dependent. Satellites can be in sunlight while the ground below is pitch black. (That said, I find the complaints about visual pollution silly.)

Out of interest, where do you live on the light polltion map [1], Bortle scale [2]?

Do you have any sense of what you're missing out on or how bright and distracting tens of thousands of LEO sats glinting in the sun are, or to what degree they mess up long exposure visible astronomy shots, or the noise they make for radio astronomy?

I have no issue believing that you find "complaints about visual pollution silly" .. I'm guessing that would be because it has zero impact on you.

[1] https://www.lightpollutionmap.info/

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bortle_scale

Re: IRIS²: The EU’s Response to Musk’s Starlink

#177

Post by T-A »

gizmo wrote: post #166
arlort wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, don't know why they posted Renew's page instead of the official press release but here they are: https://defence-industry-space.ec.europa.eu/adoption-europea... https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/STATEM...

> IRIS² will be a constellation at the cutting edge of technology, to give Europe a lead, for example in quantum encryption. It will therefore be a vector of innovation. Quantum encryption?? Can anybody explain how this is related to satellites?

https://www.forbes.com/sites/arthurherman/2022/10/20/the-qua...

Re: IRIS²: The EU’s Response to Musk’s Starlink

#178

Post by justeleblanc »

inglor_cz wrote: post #109
justeleblanc wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A company is a success only if its market is the whole world, or at the very least covers the USA where most of HN's users live? That's an interesting take.

And a pretty mainstream one. One of the niceties of software is that it scales quite easily and that if it really solves an important problem, it can grow explosively all over the world, where people do have the same problem that needs solving. Specializing in a niche corner of the market can be called a success, but a cunning dwarf is still a dwarf. For one, it lacks the necessary capital to invest into something mo…

None of the listed examples were purely software. You can't build a website that store health data about patients and scale it to the whole world and its dizzying regulatory variations overnight. You can't setup a shop for second-hand electronics that serves the whole world overnight. Etc.

Re: IRIS²: The EU’s Response to Musk’s Starlink

#179

Post by lispm »

peterfirefly wrote: post #171
lispm wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but planes are usually a better solution than high-speed trains I was traveling this week with both, an Airbus from Lufthansa and high-speed trains from Siemens.

And which one was taxed and which one was subsidized?

Both? Good and broad infrastructure is expensive. I was using a new plane with onboard Internet, two modern airports, three modern high-speed trains, three large train stations, driving through a clean and nice landscape. My local train line in my home town is fully digitalized and prepared for autonomous trains. Plus I made a stop in a town where Carl Friedrich Gauß was born in 1777, which was inspiring.

Re: IRIS²: The EU’s Response to Musk’s Starlink

#180

Post by usrusr »

Ambolia wrote: post #137
inglor_cz wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

True, but we were speaking about Germany's ability to pull economic growth specifically. Italy won't be saving European economic growth anytime soon, possibly ever, even though I actually love Italy.

Italian economy wasn't so bad until they joined the euro. The northern part still has decent industry even now.

But has it really been only the now-absent lira rollercoaster that kept the economy afloat? I'm far from convinced that an independent currency would have been a decisive advantage in dealing with the economic challenges of the recent decades, they might even be in a worse position without the euro (not speculating that they would, just refusing to take the other outcome as a given)
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