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Meta fires a software engineer two days after he relocated from India to Canada

businessinsider.com

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Re: Meta fires a software engineer two days after he relocated from India to Canada

#161

Post by londons_explore »

mduggles wrote: post #66

I'm horrified by so many of the comments here that seem to lack even the most basic of human decency. Allow me to fill people in for those who have never uprooted your life and moved across the world for a job. It is a massive commitment on the part of the employee, where you sell the majority of your earthly possessions, property, cars, etc. Then you go through an immigration process which even if its handled by FAA…

Simple solution: Only agree to relocate if your contract guarantees you employment for at least X months... Or a termination payment of Y dollars if employment lasts less than X months.

Anyone who moves across the world for an employer without getting a term like that in writing simply is naive - and we shouldn't offer them sympathy after the fact. It's like someone having their house flooded when they deliberately decided not to get flood insurance... Like, you knew the risk you were taking on...

Re: Meta fires a software engineer two days after he relocated from India to Canada

#162

Post by IanCal »

kypro wrote: post #125
mduggles wrote: post #66

I'm horrified by so many of the comments here that seem to lack even the most basic of human decency. Allow me to fill people in for those who have never uprooted your life and moved across the world for a job. It is a massive commitment on the part of the employee, where you sell the majority of your earthly possessions, property, cars, etc. Then you go through an immigration process which even if its handled by FAA…

I do agree, but I guess I'm not sure what the solution is here? Large layoffs in large orgs are generally done at a team level rather than an individual level. So presumably this individual's entire team no longer exists. So out of respect for them relocating do you then try to reposition them in the company somehow? And what about all the people who didn't relocate but may have recently left stable job for an opport…

> Do you keep them for 3 months just to be nice then proceed with the layoff anyway? I'm not sure that's much better...

Much better than days of notice.

The solutions seem pretty simple to me, contractually required notice periods. My last job I had either a two or three month notice period, I can't quite remember. For those coming over on visas, you could have an initial notice period that's longer.

> I think maybe the best thing to do here is just to give good severance packages?

Missing in this for the case of visas is about how long you're allowed to stay in the country without a job. A notice period should mean you're still employed, so that adds to any grace period around a visa.

> You'd inevitably just end up protecting certain types of crappy situations (recently located) over other types of crappy situations (family member just died).

Maybe, yeah. But protecting some people rather than none is an improvement, particularly when some cases are extremely easy to identify and may make a much larger proportion of people affected significantly.

Re: Meta fires a software engineer two days after he relocated from India to Canada

#163

Post by imperfect_blue »

vintagedave wrote: post #130
mduggles wrote: post #66

I'm horrified by so many of the comments here that seem to lack even the most basic of human decency. Allow me to fill people in for those who have never uprooted your life and moved across the world for a job. It is a massive commitment on the part of the employee, where you sell the majority of your earthly possessions, property, cars, etc. Then you go through an immigration process which even if its handled by FAA…

> so many of the comments here that seem to lack even the most basic of human decency Reading them, so am I. There is no sign of empathy: that understanding of another individual, the ability to put oneself in someone else's shoes, that is fundamental to a healthy society and (IMO) personal integrity. I read a comment a few years ago that no-one thinks of themselves as a bad person. To yourself, you are always okay.…

No post body was provided.

Re: Meta fires a software engineer two days after he relocated from India to Canada

#164

Post by sethammons »

mytailorisrich wrote: post #128
arrrg wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do you think there is nothing wrong with a company doing that? Ethically? Legally?

Why should there be anything 'wrong' with laying off someone who has just joined, whether they've relocated or not? When companies decide on large re-orgs, whole teams, departments, business unit can go. That's just the way it is. Relocating is no protection against being laid off, be it legally or ethically. Companies can show empathy and that they care by providing support, as said.

It feels like a bait and switch, which is unethical.

Re: Meta fires a software engineer two days after he relocated from India to Canada

#165

Post by newsclues »

svet_0 wrote: post #156
newsclues wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why call out Elon when this situation was Zuckerberg?

Elon hate is strong on this site

It’s like the Trump hate, irrational and all encompassing.

Re: Meta fires a software engineer two days after he relocated from India to Canada

#166

Post by goodpoint »

kypro wrote: post #125
mduggles wrote: post #66

I'm horrified by so many of the comments here that seem to lack even the most basic of human decency. Allow me to fill people in for those who have never uprooted your life and moved across the world for a job. It is a massive commitment on the part of the employee, where you sell the majority of your earthly possessions, property, cars, etc. Then you go through an immigration process which even if its handled by FAA…

I do agree, but I guess I'm not sure what the solution is here? Large layoffs in large orgs are generally done at a team level rather than an individual level. So presumably this individual's entire team no longer exists. So out of respect for them relocating do you then try to reposition them in the company somehow? And what about all the people who didn't relocate but may have recently left stable job for an opport…

> I'm not sure what the solution is here?

> Maybe I'm missing something here.

Maybe look at how it's done in pretty much every other developed country in the world? Employees have notice periods and extra safety margins around visas.

(Of course not in USA)

Re: Meta fires a software engineer two days after he relocated from India to Canada

#167

Post by saddist0 »

lzooz wrote: post #135
mduggles wrote: post #66

I'm horrified by so many of the comments here that seem to lack even the most basic of human decency. Allow me to fill people in for those who have never uprooted your life and moved across the world for a job. It is a massive commitment on the part of the employee, where you sell the majority of your earthly possessions, property, cars, etc. Then you go through an immigration process which even if its handled by FAA…

Quoted post unavailable.

First of all, he isn't "living" but on a timer against VISA expiration.

I also think that you are under-estimating the luxurious and easy lifestyle which one can enjoy while living in India. (and what he tried to give up for migrating)

I know some of the top talents who decided to never migrate, because of better helping hands, supporting community and families, easy cabs/transportation to easy payments. And it is just improving over time...

Re: Meta fires a software engineer two days after he relocated from India to Canada

#169

Post by senko »

byroot wrote: post #40
senko wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He uprooted his life, moved across the globe, then got laid off and is likely facing a prospect of having to leave Canada (not familiar with work visa types there). This sucks, and the fact "it was bound to happen" (which is incorrect, it's not a law of nature) does not absolve Meta.

> is likely facing a prospect of having to leave Canada (not familiar with work visa types there) Unless it changed in the last few years, Canadian work permits allow you to continue to reside in the country for the duration of their validity, even if you lose your employment. The vast majority of them are tied to an employer though, so even if you find another job, you need to go through the process again, which tak…

> Canadian work permits allow you to continue to reside in the country [...] majority of them are tied to an employer though.

I understand there must be some rationale behind this, but from an outside viewpoint it's quite bizarre. The incentives are exactly opposite of what one would expect (either move out or become productive member of the society as easily as possible).

Re: Meta fires a software engineer two days after he relocated from India to Canada

#170

Post by zelphirkalt »

Apparently Facebook (oh, wait, it is Meta now, how could I forget) cares about employees as human beings as little as it cares of its useds as human beings. Good to have these kind of things surface and brought to attention. Some counterweight against the rose-colored glasses, through which many people see Face...Meta.

Working for FB/Meta is a questionable choice in itself, though.

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