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Antiqua et Nova: Note on the relationship between AI and human intelligence

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Re: Antiqua et Nova: Note on the relationship between AI and human intelligence

#151

Post by throw0101c »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #143
throw0101c wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Before technology we lived in feudalism. There exists the possibility we have technology and feudalism. It also depends on how you define "technology": was/is the plough "technology"? The bow and arrow? Blacksmithing forge? Anvil? Water wheels? The wheel? The stirrup?

> There exists the possibility we have technology and feudalism There exists the possibility of many things. The Pope made an appeal to empiricism. In our timeline, industrialisation brought forth a burst in democracy and the downfall of feudalism.

> In our timeline, industrialisation brought forth a burst in democracy and the downfall of feudalism.

Not everywhere:

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Industrialization_in_the_Sovie...

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Leap_Forward

It should also be noted that the Industrial Revolution occurred in the early 1800s:

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Industrial_Revolution

Democracy was already around by then:

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parliament_of_the_United_Kingd...

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Revolution

I think it is more accurate to say the the presence of democracy was part of the environment that allowed industrialization to occur. It was (e.g.) UK acts of Parliament that developed canals and later railroads:

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_British_canal_s...

Re: Antiqua et Nova: Note on the relationship between AI and human intelligence

#153

Post by jplusequalt »

bbqfog wrote: post #85
vindex10 wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 73. However, if AI is used not to enhance but to replace the relationship between patients and healthcare providers—leaving patients to interact with a machine rather than a human being—it would reduce a crucially important human relational structure to a centralized, impersonal, and unequal framework. Instead of encouraging solidarity with the sick and suffering, such applications of AI would risk worsening the lo…

I actually would rather interact with a "robot" doctor. Most doctors I've dealt with have been snide, judgmental, rushed and arrogant. I actually don't feel like I'm getting the best treatment possible, but I would trust AI to not have prejudices or meta-influences (like being "proud" to be an upper class doctor).

It sounds like your issues with doctors is that they lack basic human compassion, yet you want to replace them with "robots" who are incapable of compassion whatsoever?

Re: Antiqua et Nova: Note on the relationship between AI and human intelligence

#154

Post by GreenWatermelon »

XCSme wrote: post #136
simonw wrote: post #19

I enjoyed this bit - great use of the word "idolatry": ---- 104. Technology offers remarkable tools to oversee and develop the world's resources. However, in some cases, humanity is increasingly ceding control of these resources to machines. Within some circles of scientists and futurists, there is optimism about the potential of artificial general intelligence (AGI), a hypothetical form of AI that would match or sur…

I agree with most of it, but saying that holism doesn't exist is weird. Also, humans have definitely created things that are better, at least in some aspects, than humans. Cars are faster than humans. Even AI-specific, AI chess engines are a lot stronger than any human alive, even then all humans combined.

And a calculator is faster than all humans combined at doing arithmetic, but I don't consider it more intelligent than an ant hive.

Everyone now uses intelligence to mean whateva ChatGPT can do, but all those language models combined don't even show 1/10th of my Cat's intelligence.

Re: Antiqua et Nova: Note on the relationship between AI and human intelligence

#155

Post by wil421 »

belter wrote: post #49
simonw wrote: post #19

I enjoyed this bit - great use of the word "idolatry": ---- 104. Technology offers remarkable tools to oversee and develop the world's resources. However, in some cases, humanity is increasingly ceding control of these resources to machines. Within some circles of scientists and futurists, there is optimism about the potential of artificial general intelligence (AGI), a hypothetical form of AI that would match or sur…

This just give me an idea for a Scifi short story, where a industrial society worships a just and fair god, that is nothing more than a lost AI driven probe, from a more advanced civilization a few parsec away...

Sounds like Star Trek the motion picture.

Voyager 6 is lost in a black hole, is upgraded by an alien race of machines, and obtains sentience. Then it comes back to earth and the Enterprise gang has an interesting time.

Re: Antiqua et Nova: Note on the relationship between AI and human intelligence

#156

Post by grahamj »

nyokodo wrote: post #80
rotexo wrote: post #48

I liked the simple observation in point 35: 'as Pope Francis observes, “the very use of the word ‘intelligence’” in connection with AI “can prove misleading”[69] and risks overlooking what is most precious in the human person.' I was texting my buddy that the proper acronym could be ABNECUI (Almost, But Not Entirely, Completely Unlike Intelligence, to rip something from Douglas Adams). At a more profound level, I rea…

> How could they know? I can’t speak for any religious leader but in terms of Catholic leadership: because in many matters God spoke through the Prophets and then He came down and told us directly which is preserved in Holy Scripture and Sacred Tradition (2 Thessalonians 2:15-17), and the Holy Spirit guides the Church (John 14:26) and does so through the prime ministerial office of the Pope the successor of Peter (Ma…

Books are written by people. It’s humans all the way down.

Re: Antiqua et Nova: Note on the relationship between AI and human intelligence

#158

Post by CamperBob2 »

simonw wrote: post #19

I enjoyed this bit - great use of the word "idolatry": ---- 104. Technology offers remarkable tools to oversee and develop the world's resources. However, in some cases, humanity is increasingly ceding control of these resources to machines. Within some circles of scientists and futurists, there is optimism about the potential of artificial general intelligence (AGI), a hypothetical form of AI that would match or sur…

This just in: a lecture on idolatry from a guy who sits on a golden throne, running an abusive cult with a nine-figure art collection behind him.

Re: Antiqua et Nova: Note on the relationship between AI and human intelligence

#159

Post by rotexo »

throw0101c wrote: post #106
rotexo wrote: post #48

I liked the simple observation in point 35: 'as Pope Francis observes, “the very use of the word ‘intelligence’” in connection with AI “can prove misleading”[69] and risks overlooking what is most precious in the human person.' I was texting my buddy that the proper acronym could be ABNECUI (Almost, But Not Entirely, Completely Unlike Intelligence, to rip something from Douglas Adams). At a more profound level, I rea…

> it always feels paradoxical when leaders wax poetic about the mystery of God and then say 'so here is what God thinks you should do.' How could they know? Perhaps we were told it: > "Teacher, which commandment in the law is the greatest?" He [Jesus] said to him, "'You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind.' This is the greatest and first commandment. And a…

Yes, I recognize that these are articles of deeply-held faith. I am open to the idea of God, I am open to the idea that God is fundamentally mysterious and beyond our mortal understanding. I simply feel that I always have to exercise skepticism regarding the words of religious institutions, though, because it seems to me that power-hungry individuals could use legitimate teachings as a camouflage for their immoral selfish impulses. Though maybe some institutions can effectively guard themselves against this, selecting people truly committed to God for leadership (I find myself likely to believe, for instance, that Pope Francis in particular is truly committed to God via the humans around him).

I guess all of the doubts are a reminder for me to focus on other humans with love. That is the part of the Bible's teachings (or the teachings of other religions) that are accessible to my experience.

Re: Antiqua et Nova: Note on the relationship between AI and human intelligence

#160

Post by JumpCrisscross »

throw0101c wrote: post #151
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There exists the possibility we have technology and feudalism There exists the possibility of many things. The Pope made an appeal to empiricism. In our timeline, industrialisation brought forth a burst in democracy and the downfall of feudalism.

> In our timeline, industrialisation brought forth a burst in democracy and the downfall of feudalism. Not everywhere: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Industrialization_in_the_Sovie... * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Leap_Forward It should also be noted that the Industrial Revolution occurred in the early 1800s: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Industrial_Revolution Democracy was already around by then: * https:…

> Democracy was already around by then

Democracy was around millennia ago. The frequency of democracy increased after industrialisation, in part due to its effects on the middle class. Britain and America’s democracies expanded because of it; Europe’s finally found purchase and, in the post-colonial era, so did other continents.

> the presence of democracy was part of the environment that allowed industrialization to occur

Probably not [1].

[1] https://acoup.blog/2022/08/26/collections-why-no-roman-indus...

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