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Current RNA vaccines protect against worrying coronavirus variants

nature.com

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Re: Current RNA vaccines protect against worrying coronavirus variants

#151

Post by [deleted] »

selcuka wrote: post #73
cmckn wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The vaccines target specific (and multiple) regions of the spike protein, so a given mutation of the protein is not likely to make a vaccine null and void (hence the current success of the vaccines against variants). A "natural" COVID infection could lead to similar protection, or less; but it's not likely that a natural infection gives you some kind of AAA protection. Being infected can also hurt you, after all. The…

So are mRNA vaccines are more effective than conventional (i.e. dead virus) vaccines and natural immunity because they target a smaller set of proteins, effectively telling the immune system exactly which protein to produce antibodies for?

[deleted]

Re: Current RNA vaccines protect against worrying coronavirus variants

#152

Post by toast0 »

loxias wrote: post #82
reedjosh wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> WTF? Why? You have a free, safe, live-saving vaccine being offered to you! Why would you not take it?? People have real distrust of the system that produced the vaccine and even distrust of the media that purports this disease is so deadly. I know from your perspective scepticism is hard to understand, but it's not that God tells me science is fake or anything so outlandish. I genuinely don't trust the corporations…

> People have real distrust of the system that produced the vaccine and even distrust of the media that purports this disease is so deadly. WHY??? Why do they distrust the vaccine?? Anything? Any possible reason? It's probably the safest vaccine ever made. I. DON'T. GET. IT. Do others not hear the ambulances? Do they not see the overflow from the hospitals? Are the dead bodies some sort of elaborate deep fake?? Has t…

> WHY??? Why do they distrust the vaccine?? Anything? Any possible reason? It's probably the safest vaccine ever made. I. DON'T. GET. IT.

I'm getting my 2nd shot this week, but both mRNA and modified adenovirus vaccines have never been used for mass vaccinations before. The history of medicine is litered with interventions that were seen as totally safe and wonderful and lead to terrible consequences after some time. Push towards massive adoption of an intervention sets off my alarm bells.

All that said, personally, it seems the unknown long term risks of vaccination outweigh the more or less known risks of covid both on an individual level (I don't want to get it) and a community level (I'd rather like community spread to stop, so I can go back to being a hermit by choice); but if community spread wasn't happening near me, I would be happier not trying new medicine within a year of development.

Re: Current RNA vaccines protect against worrying coronavirus variants

#153

Post by ma2rten »

georgeplusplus wrote: post #132
lamontcg wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"modest antibody evading capabilities“ This generally means that a pseudovirus built with the mutated spike escapes some monoclonal antibodies and has reduced neutralization titers against convalescent sera, which is fairly normal and doesn't add up to an escape mutation. When it mutates enough to form an actual escape mutation that will probably come at a cost to the virus for transmissibility/virulence/viral load b…

I’m curious, what is your education background in? Do you have some sort of medical education or this is a regurgitation of some sources you’ve read as a hobbyist? I ask this because you seem to talk from a place of authority and fact and i respect that but typically thought of Ycomb as a place comp sci folks usually congregate.

I've been reading HN for over a decade and I've seen comments from people with a huge variety of backgrounds. Many people switch fields later in life or they might just be interested in technology/startups.

Re: Current RNA vaccines protect against worrying coronavirus variants

#154

Post by adrianN »

chitowneats wrote: post #147
bawolff wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Blood clots happen at a rate of something like 1 in 100,000 people, the trial had something like 20,000 people getting the vaccine in it. Statistically its not surprising it wasn't caught. That the risk is probably not equally distributed just furthers that. For the trial to pick up the blood clots, it would probably have to administer the vaccine to at least half a million people if not more (and you would need othe…

Many of us have preexisting immunity. For that population, the marginal benefit of vaccination is zero. People should be informed about the risks.

People are informed about the risks.

Re: Current RNA vaccines protect against worrying coronavirus variants

#155

Post by randomsearch »

killingtime74 wrote: post #140
georgeplusplus wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m curious, what is your education background in? Do you have some sort of medical education or this is a regurgitation of some sources you’ve read as a hobbyist? I ask this because you seem to talk from a place of authority and fact and i respect that but typically thought of Ycomb as a place comp sci folks usually congregate.

Maybe you should ask for sources instead. Authority is the wrong thing to trust in science

Authority is constantly used as an effective source of trust in science.

Re: Current RNA vaccines protect against worrying coronavirus variants

#156

Post by prox »

lamontcg wrote: post #61
vmception wrote: post #33

I literally saw the opposite headline about Pzifer versus a strain in India today The actual article said "modest antibody evading capabilities“ I hate that the internet has become this way

"modest antibody evading capabilities“ This generally means that a pseudovirus built with the mutated spike escapes some monoclonal antibodies and has reduced neutralization titers against convalescent sera, which is fairly normal and doesn't add up to an escape mutation. When it mutates enough to form an actual escape mutation that will probably come at a cost to the virus for transmissibility/virulence/viral load b…

In a r/askscience , there was a report that they are also working on a surface identifying vaccine, which doesn’t mutate (as much?), instead based on the spike protein. They didn’t earlier because it takes a longer time to develop and is harder.

Re: Current RNA vaccines protect against worrying coronavirus variants

#157

Post by cmckn »

tialaramex wrote: post #70
cmckn wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The vaccines target specific (and multiple) regions of the spike protein, so a given mutation of the protein is not likely to make a vaccine null and void (hence the current success of the vaccines against variants). A "natural" COVID infection could lead to similar protection, or less; but it's not likely that a natural infection gives you some kind of AAA protection. Being infected can also hurt you, after all. The…

It's not quite no downside. It may be inconvenient (especially if you live in a country where you can't necessarily get time off work to seek medical treatment) and you're quite likely to have a sore arm. Some people experience fever, headaches, or other annoying symptoms for a day or even longer. I had a powerful craving for a kebab, at like 0400 when all the kebab shops are closed, maybe a coincidence, but maybe no…

I totally take your point, but frankly, I’m not interested in convincing someone who would avoid the vax because of the (minor, very manageable) side effects. I’ll let the public health folks tackle that one ;)

I honestly hoped I had more side effects! You know you’re not getting sick, so a mild fever? Kind of a perverse pleasure.

Re: Current RNA vaccines protect against worrying coronavirus variants

#159

Post by miked85 »

loxias wrote: post #88
dnautics wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I advocate getting vaccinated (I am myself) but if people don't want to put foreign substances into their bodies, we should respect their choices, especially since the long-term risk profile is unknown (we are pretty sure it's safe, but who can know?)

> we should respect their choices Honestly, why should I do that? I would if their choices only affected themselves. People have a right to control their own destiny. But their choices affect me, and, more importantly, those I care about. So no, I don't respect anyone's "choice" to be an unvaccinated asshole, increasing the chance that people I care about will die. I don't respect the "choice" to aide a foreign micro…

> But their choices affect me

If you and your family get vaccinated, how do their choices affect you?

Re: Current RNA vaccines protect against worrying coronavirus variants

#160

Post by DeliriumTrigger »

reedjosh wrote: post #94
garmaine wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Go to your local hospital and see for yourself how deadly the disease is.

I can't just walk in. That said I know several people that have had it. Some elderly with existing conditions. Worst case was my aunt who got pneumonia from it. She's in her mid sixties and diabetic. She was in the hospital for a week. Was in the emergency room with my son a few months back, not overflowing or anything, but I wasn't there to track Covid cases.

In Germany they showed the whole shift of an covid nurse on tv. They really should show something similar in every country. Gives you a lot of perspective.
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