Why Lichess will always be free • Hacker News Board

Re: Why Lichess will always be free

#151

Post by sokoloff » Fri, Apr 23, 2021, 8:50 AM UTC

laurowyn wrote: post #134

deallocator wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the correct analogy would be that there's a corner in the screen where advertisement is playing constantly while whatever show you're watching runs. Obviously the advertisement is going to distract you from time to time, and you won't have your full attention on the show.

Is forcibly breaking away from the content you want to watch every 10 minutes to show ads not distracting? or the 2 minutes of repeated content from before the break to remind you what was happening before you got distracted by the ads not also distracting? Have you ever watched a show with the ads removed and seen how much of it is actually repeated just because of ad placements? Just because it's not on screen the…

That is a huge part of why TiVo was so transformative when it came out.

“We’ll be back in......and we’re back.”

Re: Why Lichess will always be free

#152

Post by Stratoscope » Fri, Apr 23, 2021, 8:52 AM UTC

vishnugupta wrote: post #111

Stratoscope wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Ads are an attack on our attention. That may well be true, but let me tell you a story. I recently got into binge watching some old TV shows I enjoyed as a kid, like What's My Line and a few others. But most of the YouTube copies have the commercials stripped out! The few videos that have the old commercials are a blast. The Remington Rand Univac Electronic Brain. The Remington Rand Shaver! And as we all know, 9 ou…

I too look back at old ads with fondness and reminisce about the simple times of late 80s and early 90s. However when I recollect how I felt at that time about those ads it's no different from today. The fondness that I associate with those ads are because they are a window to a world that was simpler and in someways beautiful. Do I miss those times? Somewhat. Do I want those days back? Probably not, because for me (…

Indeed, for me that would be the late 1950s. Times were simpler in some ways, not so much in others.

Our house was one of the first built in the neighborhood. The house being built next door after we moved in had one feature we didn't have: a bomb shelter!

So we made that our neighborhood clubhouse. It was a place where all the kids could hang out. We brought cookies and snacks and prepared for survival.

And when nothing bad ended up happening, and the new owners moved in and kicked us out, we were just happy that the world hadn't ended!

Re: Why Lichess will always be free

#153

Post by not1ofU » Fri, Apr 23, 2021, 8:55 AM UTC

ZephyrBlu wrote: post #65

acjacobson wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would argue he already does. The entire point of "fuck you" money is that you are no longer beholden to someone else - it is not so much defined by the overall amount, but by the freedom it can buy you. He gets to work on what he loves doing every day doing it exactly the way he wants.

My definition of FU money is that you have enough money to be secure no matter what. I think he would still rely on the month to month or year to year income rather than being completely secure.

The joy of FU money https://thedeepdish.org/fuck-you-money/

Re: Why Lichess will always be free

#154

Post by dagurp » Fri, Apr 23, 2021, 8:56 AM UTC

xorfish wrote: post #83

ridiculous_fish wrote: post #49

There is Wikipedia, then lichess. Thank you.

I would add https://ourworldindata.org to that list

The first thing I notice on this site is a banner telling me that I will be tracked unless I opt out. This isn't even GDPR compliant.

Re: Why Lichess will always be free

#155

Post by fionnohGoDeo » Fri, Apr 23, 2021, 8:59 AM UTC

de6u99er wrote: post #37

matsemann wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like the developer/founder should have a higher salary. $58k a year for running a site with millions of games per day.. deserves more. Is it because they don't get enough donations? Or saving the extra money for growth/buffer? (edit: originally posted this as a top level comment but felt it fit better here) Edit2: just checked. I've spent 11 whole days playing chess there (and not sure if that only counts game…

I recall an AMA on Reddit, where the founder said he is perfectly fune with his salary as long as LiChess stays free and he can continue doing what he loves.

Here's the AMA: https://old.reddit.com/r/chess/comments/mpasyl/i_started_lic...

And the answer in question: https://old.reddit.com/r/chess/comments/mpasyl/i_started_lic...

"That's my salary before income taxes. I think it's about right.

Could I make more by selling my skills to the highest bidder? Probably.

Would I be happier? Hell no.

The way I see it, that's a lot money for a job I can do at my own rhythm from the comfort of my home. And instead of bosses or clients, I work for an awesome community."

Re: Why Lichess will always be free

#156

Post by amadvance » Fri, Apr 23, 2021, 9:00 AM UTC

bscphil wrote: post #125

sillysaurusx wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They don't have to be. Let me do some advertising right now. Daniel Naroditsky's twitch stream is amazing. Go watch 'em https://www.twitch.tv/gmnaroditsky (If you're into chess, you almost certainly already know about him.) He also gets into feuds with Hikaru and won't shut up about him for some reason nowadays, and is constantly on a soapbox, but whatever. The chess is fun to watch. Now, if you saw a banner ad for t…

> Now, if you saw a banner ad for that on lichess, would you really feel awful about it? Frankly, yes. Lichess is such a relief because I know it's a place I can go without someone trying to sell me something.

Did you donated to it ? Because this is possible only with donations.

I did, but if at some point they will have to add some ad, I won't consider that awful if done in the right way.

Re: Why Lichess will always be free

#157

Post by MauranKilom » Fri, Apr 23, 2021, 9:00 AM UTC

blowski wrote: post #93

jhrmnn wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The reason I’ve felt a strong distaste for ads since being a teenager is that ultimately they rob me of, or try to mess with, my free choice

Almost all human interaction is in some way trying to persuade you to choose something that you might otherwise not. When I ask my wife "Shall we play a board game?" I'm in some way doing the same thing. That's not evil. Advertising is not inherently evil. When it becomes evil is when it intentionally tries to deceive us, capture and processe insane amounts of information about us, and influence the display of inform…

Right, but the game theory there is pretty obvious: The better an ad is at "hacking" your mind and exploiting human characteristics, the more money it makes. Which naturally leads to this insane spiral of increasingly manipulative and insidious ads.

If your single purpose in life was to play board games with your wife, you would probably also observe these tendencies in your questions.

Re: Why Lichess will always be free

#158

Post by sokoloff » Fri, Apr 23, 2021, 9:03 AM UTC

op03 wrote: post #44

ZephyrBlu wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is basically saying that "build it and they will come" works, but we know that's a fallacy.

Wikipedia, Linux, Blender, Firefox are all what?

I could have sworn I’ve seen ads for Firefox. I know I’ve seen ads in Firefox, some placed by Mozilla, but I could have sworn I’ve seen ads for Firefox not in Firefox. (This is nearly impossible to Google for due to all the hits for ad-blockers.)

Mozilla spends 10s of millions every year on “advertising and promotion” per their financial statements, though they have other things to advertise about than just Firefox.

Re: Why Lichess will always be free

#159

Post by wright08 » Fri, Apr 23, 2021, 9:03 AM UTC

DoryMinh wrote: post #140

n_f wrote: post #75

lichess > chess.com

Why do you prefer lichess to chess.com?

Chess.com is super bloated, slow to load, and hard to navigate. There's so much noise on the screen compared to playing on lichess. Features are paywalled. For example if I want to know how the top players are responding to a certain sequence of moves, I can just see that on lichess. Also weird stuff is locked like using your own computer to analyze games. Also if you haven't been to the site for awhile you get a lovely modal again asking you for money. It's not that getting paid for services is bad, it's just awful when there's a better quality free service.

Re: Why Lichess will always be free

#160

Post by greyman » Fri, Apr 23, 2021, 9:05 AM UTC

n_f wrote: post #75

lichess > chess.com

I use both, but what is chess.com better at is that they have grandmasters there you can learn from. That's the advantage of the commercial model - you can use the money to push things to a higher level. But overall I am on lichess more, since I can play crazyhouse against the computer there. :-)