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Why Lichess will always be free

lichess.org

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Re: Why Lichess will always be free

#131

Post by mpol »

lame-robot-hoax wrote: post #84
komali2 wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure but they wouldn't do that, as it doesn't seem to be something that would further their stated goal: > to promote and encourage the teaching and practice of the game of chess and its variants".

I’d argue ads for chess sets actually would do exactly that.

And in the case of chess books, an advertorial is quite different from a good review. I very much enjoy reading a good review on a chess book, with all the good things and bad things. With an advertorial the language is quite different and it is very hard to get informed well about what you really get when you buy the book. With honest critique, I very much enjoy reading about the bad parts, and if they are not bad for me, or just a nuance, it might be a really good book for me. Only an honest review can give me that.

So no, an advertorial for a book does not do anything for me.

Re: Why Lichess will always be free

#132

Post by iSnow »

matsemann wrote: post #30
laydn wrote: post #7

Cost breakdown here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Si3PMUJGR9KrpE5lngSk... I hope OVH would donate some compute/machines to lichess. It would help lichess a lot financially. It would be good publicity for OVH and I think it would be a drop in the ocean on their balance sheet.

I feel like the developer/founder should have a higher salary. $58k a year for running a site with millions of games per day.. deserves more. Is it because they don't get enough donations? Or saving the extra money for growth/buffer? (edit: originally posted this as a top level comment but felt it fit better here) Edit2: just checked. I've spent 11 whole days playing chess there (and not sure if that only counts game…

Gross avg. wage in France is $42700[1] if calculated with 12 months and no variable benefits. Mean would be more interesting, but I don't seem to easily find it.

It might sound weirdly low for someone in IT in the USA, but first, not everyone commands FAANG sales, and second, wages in the EU are comparatively low. With some seniority, you can rise to $100k relatively easily, but you have to sell your soul to either some consulting company or old Fortune-500 industries.

So could be the dev takes an above-avg wage which would be around junior to semi experienced level developer and just does what they want to do: build a chess community.

EDIT: I don't fully understand the tax part, but if the nonprofit also pays his taxes and he goes out with $54k net, he's doing very, very well for an EU country. I've just reached that level give or take and I have lots of seniority in a really profitable old economy country. If I would be gunning higher, I'd have to do consulting or go the people management track.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_European_countries_by_...

Re: Why Lichess will always be free

#133

Post by motiejus »

pull_my_finger wrote: post #6

> There is absolutely nothing positive about advertisements on websites from the perspective of their users. They eat up valuable screen space and bandwidth for something that nobody wants to see. They often manipulate and misinform. They have even been the source of security vulnerabilities many times in the past. While I share the loathing of modern Ads as a service or whatever the technical name for giving Google/…

Lwn.net does this right: the ads are non-intrusive, and are designed for the audience. Most frequently - hosting or datacenter space.

Re: Why Lichess will always be free

#134

Post by laurowyn »

deallocator wrote: post #94
topicseed wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would you say the same about free TV's ads coming mid-program? Or newspapers you actually buy that still contain ads? How would such a trade be done upfront in your opinion? In a way, you are the one coming to PLATFORM (site, newspaper, TV program), so don't come back maybe, but don't tell PLATFORM whether they can out a distracting vase at the entrance, or ads on the sidebar, or a distracting ticker at the bottom of…

I think the correct analogy would be that there's a corner in the screen where advertisement is playing constantly while whatever show you're watching runs. Obviously the advertisement is going to distract you from time to time, and you won't have your full attention on the show.

Is forcibly breaking away from the content you want to watch every 10 minutes to show ads not distracting? or the 2 minutes of repeated content from before the break to remind you what was happening before you got distracted by the ads not also distracting? Have you ever watched a show with the ads removed and seen how much of it is actually repeated just because of ad placements?

Just because it's not on screen the entire time doesn't mean it isn't a distraction. TV ad breaks are one of the best methods for producers - guaranteed impressions, broad audiences, official metrics, etc. - whilst also being the worst for consumers. An hour of my time set aside for watching something I enjoy now contains 20 minutes of content I don't care about at all, and cannot skip/bypass if not interested, and the 40 minutes of content is closer to 30 because of repeated content either side of ad breaks.

Re: Why Lichess will always be free

#135

Post by sillysaurusx »

bscphil wrote: post #125
sillysaurusx wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They don't have to be. Let me do some advertising right now. Daniel Naroditsky's twitch stream is amazing. Go watch 'em https://www.twitch.tv/gmnaroditsky (If you're into chess, you almost certainly already know about him.) He also gets into feuds with Hikaru and won't shut up about him for some reason nowadays, and is constantly on a soapbox, but whatever. The chess is fun to watch. Now, if you saw a banner ad for t…

> Now, if you saw a banner ad for that on lichess, would you really feel awful about it? Frankly, yes. Lichess is such a relief because I know it's a place I can go without someone trying to sell me something.

Fair!

Re: Why Lichess will always be free

#136

Post by ZephyrBlu »

hinkley wrote: post #126
ZephyrBlu wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not. It's not about having more money to spend, but having enough to be permanently secure. The founder could have FU money, still draw a ~50k/yr salary and keep their spending at the same level. The only difference is that if circumstances change the founder is still secure instead.

If I could wave a wand and give you enough money to quit tomorrow, what would you do with yourself? What if your best friend were already doing his thing? Would you feel the urge to send me to talk to him, or is he good?

I don't know what you second line means, but I would continue working. Possibly reduced hours, but still working.

Re: Why Lichess will always be free

#138

Post by beberlei »

lmm wrote: post #81
beberlei wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is going to sting but an early version was built on PHP and Symfony framework :)

Interesting, nowadays they're known as one of the big open-source Scala products.

yes, I believe it was at a hackathon in 2010/2011 when during an off-topic discussion with Thibault he mentioned moving to Scala. So very long time ago :)

Re: Why Lichess will always be free

#139

Post by surfsvammel »

pull_my_finger wrote: post #6

> There is absolutely nothing positive about advertisements on websites from the perspective of their users. They eat up valuable screen space and bandwidth for something that nobody wants to see. They often manipulate and misinform. They have even been the source of security vulnerabilities many times in the past. While I share the loathing of modern Ads as a service or whatever the technical name for giving Google/…

I believe what they are saying is that money is not the goal, the goal is the spread chess, and having ads does not contribute to that goal. That’s it.

I find it quiet strange, that we are living in a world where ads are so ubiquitous that a site is explaining why they don’t have ads, rather than webpages that use ads explain why they do.

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