Selective enforcement of the law, is not in effect decriminalizing.
In effect, Seattle is decriminalizing the use of hard drugs
151–160 of 501 posts
Re: In effect, Seattle is decriminalizing the use of hard drugs
#152Earlier quoted context omitted.
Supervised consumption sites would go a long way toward fixing the needle problem.
Observation to the contrary: availability of toilets does not fix "shitting on the streets" problem in SF.
Availability of toilets barely fixed the problem of urinating and defecating on the floor of the restroom in an office I used to work.
Re: In effect, Seattle is decriminalizing the use of hard drugs
#153Earlier quoted context omitted.
When people say things like this, I do have to wonder if they've ever lived in a city before. Seattle's crime rate, like most American cities, has been steadily declining since the 1980s. There is just a certain amount of crime and drug use that will always exist in the big city. No amount of 'tough on crime' policing will make it go away.
When people write responses like this I wonder if they’ve ever been to New York City. We don’t really have comparable problems. For me visiting LA, SF or Seattle is jaw dropping. I totally reject this idea that these situations are just inevitable.
Or Tokyo, for that matter. That's about as urban as you can get on Earth, with none of the 'grittiness' that so many West coast city-dwellers seem to think is inherent to cities. And in a comparable democracy, no less.
Re: In effect, Seattle is decriminalizing the use of hard drugs
#154Re: In effect, Seattle is decriminalizing the use of hard drugs
#155Earlier quoted context omitted.
Supervised consumption sites would go a long way toward fixing the needle problem.
We have safe injection sites up here in Vancouver, you still find used needles lying around everywhere, depending where you go, only you also find the small saline packs and disposable spoons from the injection sites lying around with the used needles. The police don't really seem to care. I've watched a couple of officers find a small pile of used needles at one of the skytrain stations, they laughed to each other s…
Police just follow the lead of politicians.
Seattle Police ignore just about everything except active shooters. Even emergency calls about homeless brandishing knives in broad daylight are ignored. (If someone does get stabbed, the police will show.)
Seattle politicians have shown that they have no interest in keeping violent people off the streets, so the police don't waste their time with it.
Re: In effect, Seattle is decriminalizing the use of hard drugs
#156Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yeah I mean, without statistics his anecdotes are meaningless. It's a common thing to complain here in Seattle, but having lived in the Midwest for most of my life I know what true violence looks like and feels like. I don't hear guns every night like I did in KC. There aren't 600 murders a year like in Chicago. I'm not saying Seattle is perfect but I've never felt safer. And I live in the Central District, which is…
It wasn’t this bad in the 90s or 80s, when crime was higher everywhere else. Relatively speaking, Seattle is worse off than it was before, which is a bit sad for the non transplants.
Exactly this. Transplants are part of the problem though - they’ve brought their political culture/voting habits/policies with them, and are ruining a formerly effectively managed city without asking why it was attractive to move here in the first place.
Re: In effect, Seattle is decriminalizing the use of hard drugs
#157Earlier quoted context omitted.
Oh sorry, they actually can do something; in fact they've caught-and-released this guy three times before finally saying "Maybe he is dangerous": https://www.seattlepi.com/local/crime/article/Charge-Man-att... But I'm not holding my breath for them to actually put him away, given their past decisions to not separate him from the public.
From that article: > Charges for the first three assaults were dismissed by the City of Seattle because of mental health concerns, prosecutors said in the charging papers. Jesus, WTF? If he is attacking people because of mental illness, why isn't he locked up in a mental hospital? "Sorry, you attacked people but you're crazy, so have a nice day!" And why is trying to throw someone off an overpass charged with assault…
https://mynorthwest.com/1315319/seattle-jonathan-james-wilso...?
"An individual cannot legally be prosecuted in the criminal justice system if they are not competent because they will not be able to assist in their own defense. When a Mental Health Evaluation determines that an individual is not competent, prosecutors may move for competency restoration. In the three Seattle Municipal Court cases involving Mr. Wilson, the prosecutor did not request competency restoration."
competency restoration is putting a defendant in hospital pending return of competency: https://www.treatmentadvocacycenter.org/fixing-the-system/fe...
> And why is trying to throw someone off an overpass charged with assault and not with attempted murder?
"The filed charge is Attempted Assault in the First Degree. That crime requires proof of intent to inflict great bodily harm. Attempted Murder in the Second Degree would require proof of intent to actually cause death. Because these are “attempted” crimes, the critical difference between them is the defendant’s actual intent. We are aware from indications in prior case dockets that the defendant has a history of mental health issues. Given that history, the fact that we are early in the investigation, and that the victim thankfully suffered only minor injuries, we chose to file the case conservatively. We can always consider adding Attempted Murder as the case proceeds towards trial. "
The short of it is that society mentally ill criminals are in the middle of a justice system that requires mental health, and a mental health system that refuses to hold people by force, and isn't funded to its expensive needs. It's one of the many logical inconsistencies of law, and the cost of emphasizing compassion over general safety.
Before you say "emphasize safety more", realize that this leads to giving the State a long leash to use on citizens who might not be mentally nor criminal, but merely accused as such by the state.
In short, this is why we can't have nice things. The risk of harm from a mentally ill person on a bridge is the price society pays for not being able to field a trustworthy government.
Re: In effect, Seattle is decriminalizing the use of hard drugs
#158Earlier quoted context omitted.
Wars can also be ended by surrender, which Vancouver BC did. I understand Seattle’s approach has been similar: Grant de facto immunity to homeless people committing petty crime, stop all police enforcement of drug laws, and shame everyone who dares to complain.
Seattle, Portland, and Vancouver are remarkably similar in their problems and approaches to solutions. It really feels like a PNW/BC cultural thing.
And it's all following in the footsteps of SF. Lets make our cities open-air asylums!
Re: In effect, Seattle is decriminalizing the use of hard drugs
#159... this is probably news to people actually living in Seattle. (Edit: the title was originally, "Seattle Has Figured Out How to End the War on Drugs") A place where meth heads attack people with pitchforks in the street a few days after being released from prison on a suspended sentence. https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/crime/man-accused-... Not to mention our random piles of used syringes, which are often…
When people say things like this, I do have to wonder if they've ever lived in a city before. Seattle's crime rate, like most American cities, has been steadily declining since the 1980s. There is just a certain amount of crime and drug use that will always exist in the big city. No amount of 'tough on crime' policing will make it go away.
Honest Q: how is crime rate measured? If police stopped enforcing laws against, say, shoplifting, and the rate of shoplifting did not change, would the crime rate go down?
Re: In effect, Seattle is decriminalizing the use of hard drugs
#160Earlier quoted context omitted.
Do you have any statistics to back that up (violence rate)? I don’t feel like anecdotes make for good conversation here.
They don't have statistics to back their position, this attitude of not working from the data we have is such an issue that it has become local satire in Seattle: http://theneedling.com/2019/02/05/magnolia-named-worlds-most...
> is such an issue
The needling is also not working from data...