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Could the eagles have flown Frodo into Mordor? (2000)

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Re: Could the eagles have flown Frodo into Mordor? (2000)

#141

Post by stcredzero »

ywgdana wrote: post #114
HaloZero wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It might also be that Crows do not recognize the hobbits as at threat to report? Hobbits are less known outside of their own realm and maybe the crows thought of them as just another wild animal?

It's too late for that argument by that point. Sauron (and Saruman) are aware of hobbits and that one of them has the ring -- hence the Nazgul showing up in the Shire even before Frodo gets on the road.

Yes, but you're assuming information flows flawlessly. Crows are pretty cantankerous and mischievous at times. I wonder how hard it would be to get them to sit and listen to descriptions of Hobbits. Also, maybe all humanoids look alike to them?

Re: Could the eagles have flown Frodo into Mordor? (2000)

#142

Post by stcredzero »

Shish2k wrote: post #70
jblz wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

See also: The NeverEnding Story

Heck, that one has a hole in the title, let alone the plot :P

You just hide out in the bathroom before the movie ends, then sneak back into the theater after 15 minutes or so.

Re: Could the eagles have flown Frodo into Mordor? (2000)

#143

Post by stcredzero »

meerita wrote: post #51

I still ask myself why Elrond didn't just push to the lava the human king when he refused to drop the ring. Knowing the pain, the evil of the matter, letting him go freely with the ring just made this story a bit silly.

If he only had a lightsaber to chop off his hand right then.

Re: Could the eagles have flown Frodo into Mordor? (2000)

#144

Post by talmand »

rijoja wrote: post #129
larrydag wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would also like to postulate the element of surprise. Sauron would never expect a weak, feeble creature like a Hobbit to be an adversary. But mostly I agree with your points.

Didn't Sauron know that the ring bearer was a hobbit?

Yes he did. Gollum told him so. That's how Sauron knew to look for the Ring in the Shire. After the Shire, almost all of Sauron's forces knew to look for Hobbits and to take them alive for questioning.

Re: Could the eagles have flown Frodo into Mordor? (2000)

#145

Post by Zimahl »

hugoc wrote: post #124
Zimahl wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there really a plan, though? I mean the 'Eagle Plan' seems much more viable than the 'Fellowship Plan'. The fellowship was so bad it even included a couple humans who were pre-disposed to the rings affects and, as such, didn't last too long.

The 'Fellowship Plan' was designed by committee, parties with vested interests, etc., what other outcome could be expected?

what other outcome could be expected?

Are you implying that all plans by committee are doomed to failure? :)

Re: Could the eagles have flown Frodo into Mordor? (2000)

#146

Post by talmand »

stcredzero wrote: post #138

> Not mentioned is my favorite objection, which is that Gwaihir, the Lord of the Eagles, is ... a being of great power, and as such should not be trusted carrying the One Ring, even indirectly. The corrupting strength of the Ring is clearly stronger as one approaches Mordor--Sam and Frodo both understand that wearing the Ring within Mordor would be catastrophic. In Tolkien's universe, power calls to power, and there…

Easy objection, Gwaihir could simply not go.

Re: Could the eagles have flown Frodo into Mordor? (2000)

#147

Post by talmand »

pyre wrote: post #62
bhauer wrote: post #35

I can't believe no one realizes the obvious: Gandalf's "Summon Eagles" spell has a very long cooldown, many decades in length. It was still on cooldown from his use in the Hobbit. The One Ring melting resets all cooldowns, so he decided to use it to pick the hobbits up for a return ride. Obviously.

"Summon Eagles" was used 3 times in LotR.

It has three charges that take decades to replenish.

Re: Could the eagles have flown Frodo into Mordor? (2000)

#148

Post by talmand »

fr0sty wrote: post #121
gambiting wrote: post #119

Reddit actually had a few good points against it: 1) Flying Nazguls, first and most obvious - and Sauron would know they are coming, being unoccupied with war with Gondor. 2) By skipping Rohan and successively Gondor, Aragorn never becomes a king, kingdom of humans still most likely falls. 3) Nobody solves the Saruman threat, so in the meantime he becomes more and more powerful - probably crafts his own ring or in an…

One nit-pick: The Peter Jackson film shows Saruman stabbed by Wormtongue before falling to his death from the top of Orthanc. Furthermore, I believe it is only included in the extended edition of The Two Towers (but I could be wrong on that point).

You are indeed correct. If memory serves, the actor (Christopher Lee) was upset, even lawsuit upset, about the cut from the theatrical version as its removal reduced his points on compensation.

Re: Could the eagles have flown Frodo into Mordor? (2000)

#149

Post by ebbv »

This is always the idea that people bring up but it's pretty obvious it wouldn't work.

Frodo and Sam and Gollum are able to sneak in on the ground. If they were flying in on an Eagle it would be obvious and easily spotted and instead of sneaking into Mt Doom you'd be having a battle on the steps of Mt Doom with only the eagles + whomever they could carry vs. all the forces of Mordor.

Anyone who brings this up as a serious flaw in LotR is being silly. The novel has flaws (and yes all 6 books are one novel) but failing to use the eagles is not one of them.

Re: Could the eagles have flown Frodo into Mordor? (2000)

#150

Post by gambiting »

fr0sty wrote: post #121
gambiting wrote: post #119

Reddit actually had a few good points against it: 1) Flying Nazguls, first and most obvious - and Sauron would know they are coming, being unoccupied with war with Gondor. 2) By skipping Rohan and successively Gondor, Aragorn never becomes a king, kingdom of humans still most likely falls. 3) Nobody solves the Saruman threat, so in the meantime he becomes more and more powerful - probably crafts his own ring or in an…

One nit-pick: The Peter Jackson film shows Saruman stabbed by Wormtongue before falling to his death from the top of Orthanc. Furthermore, I believe it is only included in the extended edition of The Two Towers (but I could be wrong on that point).

Yes, sorry, Legolas shot Wormtongue instead. Still wrong though. And yes, it's only included in the extended edition.

And that vision Sam sees in Galardiela's mirror is actually true - in the book, Shire WAS burning in the end, because Saruman almost destroyed it.

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