The Clean Network – United States Department of State • Hacker News Board

Re: The Clean Network – United States Department of State

#141

Post by resters » Mon, Aug 10, 2020, 6:49 PM UTC

A4ET8a8uTh0 wrote: post #108

ISL wrote: post #80

I have the same feeling about this as I did the announcement of the "Department of Homeland Security". The name sounded Soviet in origin, with only the exchange of "Homeland" in place of "Motherland". It reminded me of things my family had taught me didn't happen in the United States. "We call on all freedom-loving nations and companies to join the Clean Network." is a sentence straight out of an authoritarian playbo…

Yes. It is ridiculous how closely the language sounds to that of a dictatorial regime. The language is just so.. cringy. When I first read, I genuinely could not believe it was not onion or some weird caricature.

In some sense all governments are the same. Any government trying to create a great firewall will use the same kind of propagandistic, utopian-seeming verbiage and metaphors.

Re: The Clean Network – United States Department of State

#142

Post by lostmsu » Mon, Aug 10, 2020, 6:49 PM UTC

waihtis wrote: post #83

lostmsu wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it the devil we know though? Until the talks about TikTok started, I assumed nothing like this could ever happen in this country.

That's just how politics works in general, is it not? Big issues can underlie for ages and a single mass media event may trigger a big change.

The point stands: you don't know what mass media events are coming up, hence you don't know what the devil will do next.

Re: The Clean Network – United States Department of State

#143

Post by PaulAJ » Mon, Aug 10, 2020, 6:50 PM UTC

Follow the link in "Digital Trust Standards" to the "Criteria for Security and Trust in Telecommunications Networks and Services" (https://csis-website-prod.s3.amazonaws.com/s3fs-public/publi...). Political & Governance Criteria numbers 8 and 9 would seem to present problems for companies in the UK and US, both of which require suppliers to cooperate with the government in secret and unchallengeable ways.

Re: The Clean Network – United States Department of State

#144

Post by codemonkey-zeta » Mon, Aug 10, 2020, 6:50 PM UTC

mindslight wrote: post #120

codemonkey-zeta wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I laughed, but also ... yes? As a lover of liberty I would much rather just my own government (by which I am ostensibly represented) have the ability to infringe on that liberty than 2 governments. I would want to support regulations that protect myself and neighbors from the influence of those other infringers, no?

The actions required to shut out that second attacker are blunt tools that impinge upon your personal freedom far beyond their stated purpose. And since you still have that primary attacker, then you still have to defend against them anyway. The proper solutions to protect us from "China" are the same as the solutions to protect us from NSA - E2E encryption, P2P communication, decentralized namespaces, and making dat…

Can we realistically implement these in the near future? Will this not function as a stop-gap in the meantime while we do work on your (better) solution?

Re: The Clean Network – United States Department of State

#145

Post by dannyw » Mon, Aug 10, 2020, 6:51 PM UTC

ISL wrote: post #80

I have the same feeling about this as I did the announcement of the "Department of Homeland Security". The name sounded Soviet in origin, with only the exchange of "Homeland" in place of "Motherland". It reminded me of things my family had taught me didn't happen in the United States. "We call on all freedom-loving nations and companies to join the Clean Network." is a sentence straight out of an authoritarian playbo…

The Chinese has shown no interest in co-operating with the world. They are an enemy. What’s wrong with keeping them out of our internet when they have their own?

To put it another way; this is like allowing your enemy to design and manfacture your military jets.

Re: The Clean Network – United States Department of State

#146

Post by dekhn » Mon, Aug 10, 2020, 6:54 PM UTC

enraged_camel wrote: post #131

dekhn wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do administrators speed mail delivery?

Please don't argue in bad faith, and actually read the links provided. The issue here is that the current Postmaster General fired the administrators who were pushing back against the "optimizations" he is making and wants to make to USPS policies. The final goal is to privatize USPS, which has been a Republican dream since the Reagan era.

Yes, I read all articles about the USPS the day they are published across a wide range of journals.

However, I'm simply looking for a direct, factual claim that supports that these firings were directly intended to slow down mail delivery so as to cause problems during the forthcoming election. So far all the claims I've seen are indirect; further, the PG has explicitly said they are prepared to handle mail-in votes during the upcoming election.

It's entirely unclear whether firing administrators (rather than mail carriers and postal office workers, etc) has a direct effect on mail delivery rates and accuracy in the short-term.

Re: The Clean Network – United States Department of State

#147

Post by kube-system » Mon, Aug 10, 2020, 6:56 PM UTC

Loughla wrote: post #129

evan_ wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

in fact the best thing to do to fight the Great Firewall of China is to make it easier for the Chinese people to access the internet-at-large including sites hosted in the US. This program will do the opposite.

This is 100% the answer, and one thing I've never understood about many, many aspects of American life. If you want people to act a certain way, you incentivize that thing, not punish the opposite of the thing. You want people to stop doing drugs? Make programs designed to support them during the withdrawal process, provide counseling and other necessary supports, and make it free. You want people off of welfare? Pro…

Most people aren't philosophers or social scientists, and their understanding of criminal science is based on their personal experiences with crime and punishment or their casual suppositions. This is why a trusted and high quality education is essential for a strong democracy.

Re: The Clean Network – United States Department of State

#148

Post by sjs382 » Mon, Aug 10, 2020, 6:57 PM UTC

apazzolini wrote: post #132

supernova87a wrote: post #110

This really comes off as a hastily prepared political dig against China, when there are in addition so many other actors and countries trying to take advantage of poor security. The JPEGed giant logo at the top doesn't help... Other observations: -- "Remove untrusted applications from US mobile app stores": so, this would call for even tighter control by Apple, Google, over its app distribution and monopolies? -- Cle…

> The JPEGed giant logo It's almost like they ran it through jpegify.me on purpose as a joke, but really it's just another sign of the US's government technical incompetence.

The site uses WordPress and the post author decided to include a thumbnail, scaled up to regular size, rather than using the original: https://www.state.gov/wp-content/uploads/2020/08/CleanNetwor...

Re: The Clean Network – United States Department of State

#149

Post by gruez » Mon, Aug 10, 2020, 7:01 PM UTC

24gttghh wrote: post #140

zrail wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The key this year is to _personally drop off your ballot_ at an official drop point rather than mailing it in. USPS can and will deprioritize mail in ballots for the fall elections.

I do this anyways. Why would I pay postage to have something brought to a distribution center 20 miles away, wait a few days, then brought back to my town to get delivered to town hall when I can literally walk there and drop it off for free?

Because time is money? first class postage is only 55 cents, that's hard to beat from a dollars per hour spent perspective.

Re: The Clean Network – United States Department of State

#150

Post by nyxtom » Mon, Aug 10, 2020, 7:04 PM UTC

dannyw wrote: post #145

ISL wrote: post #80

I have the same feeling about this as I did the announcement of the "Department of Homeland Security". The name sounded Soviet in origin, with only the exchange of "Homeland" in place of "Motherland". It reminded me of things my family had taught me didn't happen in the United States. "We call on all freedom-loving nations and companies to join the Clean Network." is a sentence straight out of an authoritarian playbo…

The Chinese has shown no interest in co-operating with the world. They are an enemy. What’s wrong with keeping them out of our internet when they have their own? To put it another way; this is like allowing your enemy to design and manfacture your military jets.

But they do manufacture quite a bit else