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GLP-1 drugs linked to lower death rates in colon cancer patients

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Re: GLP-1 drugs linked to lower death rates in colon cancer patients

#131

Post by Cthulhu_ »

ecshafer wrote: post #10
bicx wrote: post #2

Maybe I'm just an aging cynic, but I'm waiting for the other shoe to drop when it comes to GLP-1s. There have been so many claims of positive benefits that it almost seems too good to be true. With them being so expensive, the producers have every incentive to upsell using any study they can get their hands or money on. If it's all upside, then I'm happy to be wrong.

GLP-1s have been peescribed for like 20 years, but have been limited more to diabetics and extreme cases. So there is pretty good data. Not to say there isnt going to be side effects in some population sample, but we need to compare that with obesity and diabetes (which is a very bad disease).

But also do long-term studies; one thing I gathered (anecdotal through the internet so take it with a grain of salt) is that people revert to their old habits when they stop taking it. Not always, of course, and I think using it should always be done with guidance of a dietician etc to make lifestyle adjustments if needs be, but it did imply that long term usage is a factor that needs to be considered.

Re: GLP-1 drugs linked to lower death rates in colon cancer patients

#132

Post by ACCount37 »

ck2 wrote: post #90
kube-system wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Compounded GLP-1s are still floating around in the US

if you saw the 60 Minutes on compounding pharmacies, which are completely unregulated and never inspected, and sometimes contaminate products out of lack of care/repercussions you'd never touch a compounded pharmacy product ever again people have died from contamination

People are straight up buying black market "research use only, not to be used in humans" GLP-1. Compounding pharmacies are reliable, safe and well regulated compared to that.

Clearly, there's an entire spectrum of tradeoffs between safety/shadiness, availability and price. I think that's a good thing.

Re: GLP-1 drugs linked to lower death rates in colon cancer patients

#133

Post by anovikov »

stavros wrote: post #41
jl6 wrote: post #22

> However, the study authors emphasize that more research is needed to confirm these mechanisms and determine whether the survival benefit observed in this real-world analysis represents a direct anti-cancer effect or an indirect result of improved metabolic health Given it’s an observational study, I would bet on the latter. It’s really hard to know you’ve controlled for all confounding factors, and there’s a strong…

Yeah, most GLP-1 benefits (or even adverse effects, like muscle loss) seem to be caused by the weight loss. We already knew obesity massively increases risk from a host of diseases, but GLP-1s are still treated with scepticism of the "oh but what about the side-effects we don't know about?!" variety?

Someone has to start a study where they give GLP-1 to skinny people and see what happens. Why it hasn't been done yet?

Re: GLP-1 drugs linked to lower death rates in colon cancer patients

#134

Post by p00dles »

jl6 wrote: post #22

> However, the study authors emphasize that more research is needed to confirm these mechanisms and determine whether the survival benefit observed in this real-world analysis represents a direct anti-cancer effect or an indirect result of improved metabolic health Given it’s an observational study, I would bet on the latter. It’s really hard to know you’ve controlled for all confounding factors, and there’s a strong…

Interesting that GLP-1s might have different effects on cancer _incidence_ vs. cancer _survival_.

A different study "GLP-1 Receptor Agonists and the Risk of Thyroid Cancer" was published in the Diabates Care journal in February 2023*

The conclusion of the 2023 study: "we found increased risk of all thyroid cancer and medullary thyroid cancer with use of GLP-1 RA, in particular after 1–3 years of treatment."

I wonder what the mechanistic hypothesis could be for GLP-1s increasing thyroid cancer _incidence_ (the probability of thyroid cancer occurring in patients taking GLP-1s) but increasing colon cancer _survival_ (the probability of surviving in patients taking GLP-1s who have colon cancer).

Of course there are numerous important differences across the studies (cancer type, France vs. USA data, etc.), I'm just curious about a why this might be the case.

*https://diabetesjournals.org/care/article-abstract/46/2/384/...

Re: GLP-1 drugs linked to lower death rates in colon cancer patients

#135

Post by InMice »

l5870uoo9y wrote: post #113
cyrusradfar wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed. I'm a big fan of intermittent and water fasting. Have seen things in my blood work that doctors would require me on meds to reverse. Outside of that, I can't speak to the positive impacts on my mood, and general ability to focus. The simplest solution to a lot of problems is consuming less with the assumption that, most of us (maybe not you), have a lot of spare energy sitting around. A lie that we don't unle…

There is no such thing as water fasting. I would characterize it as an eating disorder.

Of course. That's why the nobel prize in medicine in 2016 was awarded to a cell biolgoist studying cellular autophagy for over a decade. It must be why glucose is not an essential dietary macronutrient and our liver can synthesizie it endogenously from fats and proteins (it just felt like doing that one day and stored all those chemical pathways in our genes I guess). That must also be why ketones produced from our fat stores burn so cleanly with less reactive inflammatory byproducts. In fact the cells in our brain actually prefer ketones to glucose. There's no such as water fasting. It's just random chance that when the body is in a state of ketosis it suppresses ghrelen and other hunger hormones or that countless other chemical pathways (de)activate or change. That's right the body has absolutely no design or adaptation for scarcity of food. Water fasting is totally foreign to the human body, that's why whenever we study ancient cultures...we find they practiced purposeful fasting. There's just no such thing as water fasting, it must be a modern eating disorder.

There's no chance it has anything to do with the last few million years of our evolution. It has no benefit or relevance now.

Re: GLP-1 drugs linked to lower death rates in colon cancer patients

#136

Post by stavros »

anovikov wrote: post #133
stavros wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, most GLP-1 benefits (or even adverse effects, like muscle loss) seem to be caused by the weight loss. We already knew obesity massively increases risk from a host of diseases, but GLP-1s are still treated with scepticism of the "oh but what about the side-effects we don't know about?!" variety?

Someone has to start a study where they give GLP-1 to skinny people and see what happens. Why it hasn't been done yet?

Because they lose weight and it's too dangerous.

Re: GLP-1 drugs linked to lower death rates in colon cancer patients

#137

Post by anovikov »

stavros wrote: post #136
anovikov wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Someone has to start a study where they give GLP-1 to skinny people and see what happens. Why it hasn't been done yet?

Because they lose weight and it's too dangerous.

They won't, GLP-1 has almost no direct effect on skinny people. Many women with BMI around 22-23 are trying them to lose weight to match beauty standards and usually end up disappointed, not able to drop more than 1-2 kilos.

Re: GLP-1 drugs linked to lower death rates in colon cancer patients

#138

Post by ifwinterco »

itchyouch wrote: post #95
cyrusradfar wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed. I'm a big fan of intermittent and water fasting. Have seen things in my blood work that doctors would require me on meds to reverse. Outside of that, I can't speak to the positive impacts on my mood, and general ability to focus. The simplest solution to a lot of problems is consuming less with the assumption that, most of us (maybe not you), have a lot of spare energy sitting around. A lie that we don't unle…

An interesting FYI is a comment made by Peter Attia on his podcast. He had a patient with metabolic markers that were not improving and they had exhausted all the typical avenues. Presumably they were things like weight loss. They put the patient on GLP-1 but injected into the thighs (or butt, I don't recall) for the metabolic benefits without the hunger blunting effects. It seems like GLP1, even in skinny patients (…

It shouldn't make any difference where you pin it, it's systemic it just has to be administered subcutaneously because it's a peptide and it isn't orally active.

Don't listen to these YouTubers about health and fitness, most of them are clueless

Re: GLP-1 drugs linked to lower death rates in colon cancer patients

#139

Post by dfc »

stavros wrote: post #44
daedrdev wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

sure but it definitely makes carbs specifically disgusting in my case

I can confirm that. On GLP-1s (when they worked for me, anyway), I'd routinely think "pizza? Bleh, so fatty, I'd really like some chicken breast with roast potatoes instead right now".

You can confirm that GLP1s make "carbs specifically disgusting" and an example of this reaction is that you would have a desire to eat potatoes?

Re: GLP-1 drugs linked to lower death rates in colon cancer patients

#140

Post by l5870uoo9y »

InMice wrote: post #135
l5870uoo9y wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no such thing as water fasting. I would characterize it as an eating disorder.

Of course. That's why the nobel prize in medicine in 2016 was awarded to a cell biolgoist studying cellular autophagy for over a decade. It must be why glucose is not an essential dietary macronutrient and our liver can synthesizie it endogenously from fats and proteins (it just felt like doing that one day and stored all those chemical pathways in our genes I guess). That must also be why ketones produced from our f…

Took "water fasting" to mean fasting even without water, apparently it is the opposite.
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