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We are on the cusp of a disruption in food and agricultural production

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Re: We are on the cusp of a disruption in food and agricultural production

#131

Post by narag »

oAlbe wrote: post #110
salasrod wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Olive oil is not that good for you, and most importantly, it burns at really low temperatures, and ends up tasting horrible when it happens.

That's actually very incorrect and misleading. Olive oil, expecially extra virgin olive oil, can withstand higher temperatures than sunflower, peanut and the like. IIRC the smoke point for EVO is around 210C. You could literally fry in olive oil, it's just too expensive to do so.

You could literally fry in olive oil, it's just too expensive...

Depends on where you are. If in the USA, maybe it is, and be prepared for much worse: Mr. Trump is threatening with 25% minimum tariff for our oil. Funny that it's some kind of retaliation for Airbus, while Airbus finally will be spared. In the bright side, it should be even cheaper for us.

Re: We are on the cusp of a disruption in food and agricultural production

#132

Post by flush »

oAlbe wrote: post #110
salasrod wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Olive oil is not that good for you, and most importantly, it burns at really low temperatures, and ends up tasting horrible when it happens.

That's actually very incorrect and misleading. Olive oil, expecially extra virgin olive oil, can withstand higher temperatures than sunflower, peanut and the like. IIRC the smoke point for EVO is around 210C. You could literally fry in olive oil, it's just too expensive to do so.

Where are you getting your data from? I'm an avid cook and have always thought EVOO to be a low smoke point oil, especially compared to something like peanut oil.

I did a quick search and found this: https://www.seriouseats.com/2014/05/cooking-fats-101-whats-a...

which suggests that EVOO has a relatively low smoke point compared to sunflower and peanut oil.

I'm still open to other numbers though, since I'm not sure what study if any these numbers come from.

Re: We are on the cusp of a disruption in food and agricultural production

#133

Post by ianai »

rhacker wrote: post #124
ianai wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Marketing speak is almost always going to be dubiously credible. It definitely can be made more healthy than red meat in future revisions of the recipe. But it’s undoubtedly better for the planet than to be “raising” and killing cattle for red meat. You don’t need 660 gallons of water to make plants for 1 pound of beyond burger like you do for one pound ground chuck.

Well, and, technically, if the world can survive longer and have better water, because of a shift in how we make food, then yes, it's healthier for you too - even if you don't eat it!

Yeah, as a desert dweller, I’m not entirely happy with the farmers nearby using our already scarce and diminishing water to raise cattle.

Re: We are on the cusp of a disruption in food and agricultural production

#134

Post by hyperpallium »

Finally with Food-as-Software, world is eating the software.

The purpose of this article is food deregulation advocacy. If you thought unregulated sugar was bad, just wait.

I like the idea of returning pasture etc to forest and bush, but where will the raw materials for food manufacture be sourced?

Re: We are on the cusp of a disruption in food and agricultural production

#135

Post by lukeschlather »

alwayslearning0 wrote: post #85
mikro2nd wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I saw lots of talk about the meat industry, not a word about dairy. (Admittedly only read the executive summary.) I've seen quite a lot of this over the past year or two: Lots of "we're going to end cattle farming" when all they're really talking about is beef. Industrial dairy operations are horrible: carbon intensive, noisy smelly and cruel, but I don't see anyone claiming to have synthesized dairy replacements, an…

If anything, the large and fairly mature market of dairy replacement (soy almond milk etc) shows how crazy this article is on meat. I've been vegan myself, but to think just because the market now has an alternative to an animal product that everyone will stop using the animal product is crazy.

The dairy replacement market, while mature, doesn't do a very good job of competing directly with the dairy industry. Non-dairy milks cost easily twice what the dairy milks do.

It's not even possible to buy a gallon jug of soymilk. They simply don't exist.

Re: We are on the cusp of a disruption in food and agricultural production

#136

Post by cycrutchfield »

S_A_P wrote: post #112
carapace wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm too lazy at the moment to look up a link but fast food restaurants are already adopting these faux-beef burgers and people love them.

I’ve had the impossible whopper. It was fine. I didn’t hate it. I didn’t love it. I also probably won’t buy it again because there isn’t really any reason to.

How about if it cost half the price of the regular burger?

Re: We are on the cusp of a disruption in food and agricultural production

#137

Post by vfc1 »

scotch_drinker wrote: post #82

I guess we'll never learn from things like margarine and other lab invented foods. Beyond Meat is heavily dependent on seed oils which are terrible for us (expeller pressed canola oil is ingredient #2). Red Meat actually isn't unhealthy at the levels most people currently eat it. While it wouldn't surprise me if more people ate Beyond meat and its ilk in the future, it doesn't make it better for us and will likely ju…

Red meat is a likely carcinogen and processed meat is a known carcinogen.

Oils in general, even extra virgin olice oil are not health foods (which is a common misconception).

Beyond burguers are not healthy, they are junk food. Plant-based junk food, but still junk food.

If people are looking to learn how to eat healthy, the science say's its whole food plant-based. Don't eat plant extracts like oils, you need to eat the whole thing.

Eat peas and not pea protein isolate, eat olives and not olive oil. And so forth.

Just because something is plat-based does not make it healthy, Oreos are plant-based for example. Does anyone think they are healthy?

It's about the perception of the public on certain foods, that is very hard to break as its built on decades of conditioning via advertising and pop culture.

Re: We are on the cusp of a disruption in food and agricultural production

#138

Post by carapace »

WaltPurvis wrote: post #107
carapace wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm too lazy at the moment to look up a link but fast food restaurants are already adopting these faux-beef burgers and people love them.

That's not even technically an anecdote, let alone data, but here's a more accurate description of what's "already" happening: A vanishingly small fraction of fast-food restaurants are taking small steps to experiment with offering faux-beef burgers as an additional menu option for the small percentage of their customers who might want that.

In the cold light of morning...

Here we go: https://www.nbcnewyork.com/entertainment/the-scene/Plant-Bas...

> A number of fast-food chains have introduced plant-based meat alternatives in recent months, partnering with meatless companies Beyond Meat or Impossible Foods.

> They are reacting to consumers' increased appetite for those foods: from April 2018 to April 2019, the plant-based retail market has registered 11% growth, according to data published on the Plant Based Foods Association website.

- - - -

Or this: https://www.starherald.com/news/nation_world/impossible-burg...

> Impossible Burger debuted on store shelves earlier this month, immediately becoming the No. 1 product sold at some of America’s favorite grocery stores -- and remaining the top performer ever since.

> Since its Sept. 20 debut, Impossible Burger has remained the No. 1 packaged item at Gelson’s 27-unit chain. Since its launch, Gelson’s has sold more Impossible Burger than all types of ground beef from cows, based on both revenue and total number of pounds sold.

> “No one could have predicted this level of pent-up demand for Impossible Burger,” said John Bagan, Gelson’s Chief Merchandising Officer.

- - - -

I think we are at the base of the "hockey-stick" curve and that meatless meat is about to eat beef's lunch.

Re: We are on the cusp of a disruption in food and agricultural production

#139

Post by koboll »

salasrod wrote: post #94
mrfusion wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What’s wrong with oils though? And if canola is bad why can’t they switch it out for olive oil?

Olive oil is not that good for you, and most importantly, it burns at really low temperatures, and ends up tasting horrible when it happens.

Why respond with begging the question and then bringing up something totally irrelevant?

Olive oil doesn't have trans fat, is low in omega-6 (unlike seed oils), has a high ratio of monunsaturated fats to saturated and polyunsaturated fats, and has a bunch of vitamins and antioxidants as well. It's pretty much the healthiest fat in existence.

Re: We are on the cusp of a disruption in food and agricultural production

#140

Post by rcpt »

o_p wrote: post #20
rcpt wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> fair free market If we had that there wouldn't be so much meat in the first place. Currently, each year, American taxpayers subsidize the animal food system to the tune of $38 billion.

The problem with the free market is that mass starvation can perfectly be a market optimal, of all the things that are subsidized, food is the most important.

There are many ways to prevent starvation without heavily subsidizing animal agriculture.
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