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Anxiety Looks Different in Men

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Re: Anxiety Looks Different in Men

#121

Post by mattlutze »

klipt wrote: post #98
lazyasciiart wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Society has a serious attitude problem towards men and it is seriously damaging a huge number of people. As I understand it, this is what “toxic masculinity” is supposed to mean.

That just sounds like misandry. Society has an attitude problem with women in some respects too, but people just call it misogyny, not "toxic femininity" or whatever. Being consistent with terminology is sadly underrated.

Misandry is the state of being predisposed or prejudiced against men.

Toxic masculinity is stereotypical or reductive modes of action or thinking perceived by men as expected or required, which can be harmful to other men or other people.

They're not the same and it'd be not great to think that they are the same.

Re: Anxiety Looks Different in Men

#122

Post by TheOtherHobbes »

krapp wrote: post #102
lazyasciiart wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Society has a serious attitude problem towards men and it is seriously damaging a huge number of people. As I understand it, this is what “toxic masculinity” is supposed to mean.

The only thing that toxic masculinity is supposed to mean is that there are aspects of traditional masculine norms which can manifest in harmful ways in modern society. For instance, men often have difficulty seeking help for mental or emotional health issues, because traditional masculine identity requires men to be stoic and independent of emotional connection - such needs are considered feminine, and a weakness wh…

No, that's absolutely wrong. Men and women have strongly defined expectations of themselves and of each other. Some are social and cultural. Some are genetic. Many are contradictory - which leads to impossible demands that can't be achieved by either gender.

All of the current models for dealing with this are wrong. Neither liberal feminism and identity politics nor alt-right resentment and nostalgia for an imaginary lost "real" masculinity are healthy solutions to this problem.

Essentially, both approaches are resentment-based rather than reality-based. Some of the resentments are justified, others are rather artificially exaggerated. But I don't think either approach is the last or best word.

Re: Anxiety Looks Different in Men

#123

Post by jazoom »

WhitneyLand wrote: post #117
jazoom wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a doctor. I can tell you that even if I think a middle aged man with chest pain has anxiety he's still getting a full cardiac workup. Even a 20yo woman with anxiety will get a cardiac workup. It doesn't sound like these doctors missed anything based on this story. It sounds like they were ruling out the stuff that'll kill you quickly.

I don't see where we are disagreeing? I'm not arguing against triage. GPs were mentioned - I'm simply stating that it's not uncommon that a patient comes to see a GP questions are asked to elicit the role of stress and anxiety in the situation as appropriate. This does not rule out other care or take precedence over it as you know.

Reading your comment now I also don't see where we are disagreeing. Though, I didn't say we are disagreeing, and I don't see why we need to.

Edit: Did you by any chance edit your comment? I swear the word "miss" was in there.

Re: Anxiety Looks Different in Men

#124

Post by air7 »

jjeaff wrote: post #119
air7 wrote: post #112

> When a man explodes in anger over something seemingly insignificant, he may appear like just a jerk. But he could be anxious. What's in a name... Its amazing the difference a title makes. Being "a jerk" is frowned upon, its "bad" and the jerk should know better. But when its "anxiety" its met with compassion and understanding. He needs help not a stern look. Why do we feel that the jerk has agency over his actions…

In one case, someone is being a jerk because they can't control their reactions due to their anxiety disorder. These people are likely remorseful for what they have said or done. A true jerk is someone who is being a jerk on purpose because they don't care about others. And they don't regret their actions because they think they are justified. Seems like an important distinction to me.

The question then becomes: Does the "true jerk" have more control over his actions, or is he bound by his personality traits just as much as the "remorseful jerk"? Can we not say that the former can't control his reactions due to their "true jerk" disorder?

Re: Anxiety Looks Different in Men

#125

Post by TheOtherHobbes »

krapp wrote: post #118
schalab wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dont think its a cultural thing. Men on average show less empathy and emotion than women. For obvious reasons, child rearing vs hunting. But most writers and journalists tend to be on the feminine side of the spectrum because that correlates with verbal ability. So this theory has emerged that most men are actually just as emotional as women but are hiding their feelings because society expects them to do it. Maybe…

>But most writers and journalists tend to be on the feminine side of the spectrum because that correlates with verbal ability. Most writers and journalists have traditionally been men, because men have traditionally been considered more trustworthy and intelligent. The cultural stigma against female authorship has been strong enough that they have tended to either publish under male pseudonyms or neutral identities (…

Do you really think JK Rowling's gender has harmed her earning potential? She was outed - if that's the word - as a woman - almost as soon as the books began selling and no one seemed particularly bothered.

It seems odd to pick a woman who is a billionaire as evidence of poor earning potential.

Re: Anxiety Looks Different in Men

#126

Post by mjlangiii »

dkarl wrote: post #40

Anxiety is one of the emotions that I have to consciously think about how to express. I have to imagine what people look like in the movies when they're scared, and then I try to reproduce it. I can show many other emotions naturally, without thinking about it: happiness, anger, disgust. But fear I have to consciously simulate. (I suppose if I was in a bus going off the edge of a cliff or someone stuck a gun in my fa…

I'm sure you've worked plenty of time thinking about this already so I feel dumb trying to supplement that at all, but I'd assume you're probably repressing some level of emotion just because the physical expression of anxiety isn't so much a learned behavior coming from your prefrontal cortex but more like a low level hind brain thing you have just by being human. Between survival instincts and social instincts we have very physically based "emotions" and playing the odds here, I'd wager you and others that comment, having similar experiences, that you developed this coping mechanism at a young age. Apologies if I'm reading too much into a simple comment saying you're misunderstood at times.

Re: Anxiety Looks Different in Men

#127

Post by billner »

habnds wrote: post #111
hanoz wrote: post #48

Anxiousness, alertness to danger, and the imperative not to show it, is an essence of the male human condition surely?

surely if these traits are valuable to survival they would be valuable to females too? dont you think the difference might be nurture not nature?

I don't think men were picky enough to care if woman had those traits or not.

Re: Anxiety Looks Different in Men

#128

Post by akuji1993 »

dkarl wrote: post #40

Anxiety is one of the emotions that I have to consciously think about how to express. I have to imagine what people look like in the movies when they're scared, and then I try to reproduce it. I can show many other emotions naturally, without thinking about it: happiness, anger, disgust. But fear I have to consciously simulate. (I suppose if I was in a bus going off the edge of a cliff or someone stuck a gun in my fa…

A thing I love about my therapist is, that I tell my anxiety stories exactly like you, without much emotion and pretty clear and to the point. Still, in that moment, I experienced heavy levels of anxiety, but I can't just reproduce that at a later time (that sounds odd to me anyway). But he takes my word for it and works through it with me. Never in my therapy did he not believe me, just because I didn't tell it with a terrified look in my face.

Re: Anxiety Looks Different in Men

#129

Post by mkl »

davidjnelson wrote: post #94
lawnchair_larry wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are the big 4 tech companies? I’ve heard that in accounting, but I don’t know which 4 they would be in tech.

(F)acebook, (A)mazon, (N)etflix, (G)oogle.

Microsoft and Apple each have over twenty times more employees than Netflix. I've never understood why Netflix is included, in FAANG, etc.

Re: Anxiety Looks Different in Men

#130

Post by [deleted] »

spaceprison wrote: post #52

This is a great article. For years I didn't know how to handle anxiety so I handled it "like a man" which lead to a pretty decent drinking habit. Now that I've stopped drinking and being open about what's going on with me, my anxiety looks like traditional anxiety which was easy for my gp to help diagnose. Taking the leap to be open and get help was the best thing to happen to me in years.

[deleted]
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