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NSA slides explain the PRISM data-collection program

washingtonpost.com

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Re: NSA slides explain the PRISM data-collection program

#111

I'm not sure why this is a big surprise to anyone. I'm a cynic, but if anyone asked me whether I think the NSA, CIA, or FBI are eavesdropping on personal communications, I would say, "of course they are." This is nothing new: ECHELON, Clipper/Skipjack, Carnivore, ...

>ECHELON, Clipper/Skipjack, Carnivore

Were any of those ever confirmed with documentation?

Re: NSA slides explain the PRISM data-collection program

#112

I'm not sure why this is a big surprise to anyone. I'm a cynic, but if anyone asked me whether I think the NSA, CIA, or FBI are eavesdropping on personal communications, I would say, "of course they are." This is nothing new: ECHELON, Clipper/Skipjack, Carnivore, ...

>ECHELON, Clipper/Skipjack, Carnivore Were any of those ever confirmed with documentation?

Carnivore definitely was, and it wasn't really kept secret. If you worked long enough in telecom or Internet service, you probably got to install a Carnivore box in your data center.

Re: NSA slides explain the PRISM data-collection program

#113
post #5
post #2

Two days, two major reveals, wouldn't be suprised if tomorrow I wake up to find out that they've been switching on the microphones and cameras on webcams and cellphones.

"...switching on the microphones and cameras on webcams and cellphones." http://news.cnet.com/2100-1029-6140191.html They've been doing it with cell phone microphones for years apparently.

Aha! Now we know the real reason that most phones sold today have a non-removeable battery.

Re: NSA slides explain the PRISM data-collection program

#114

I'm not sure why this is a big surprise to anyone. I'm a cynic, but if anyone asked me whether I think the NSA, CIA, or FBI are eavesdropping on personal communications, I would say, "of course they are." This is nothing new: ECHELON, Clipper/Skipjack, Carnivore, ...

>ECHELON, Clipper/Skipjack, Carnivore Were any of those ever confirmed with documentation?

Echelon was indeed confirmed, afaik, although in less apocalyptic terms than initially described, hence deflating the related news-cycle. In a way, 20 years later, all the fuss looks very naïf compared to what GCHQ and friends do nowadays.

Re: NSA slides explain the PRISM data-collection program

#115

I'm not sure why this is a big surprise to anyone. I'm a cynic, but if anyone asked me whether I think the NSA, CIA, or FBI are eavesdropping on personal communications, I would say, "of course they are." This is nothing new: ECHELON, Clipper/Skipjack, Carnivore, ...

It's not about surprise, it's about proof. Comments like this are nothing but highschool cool-table karma whoring. "I knew it all along" adds nothing to the conversation. Congratulations for nothing.

Re: NSA slides explain the PRISM data-collection program

#116
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder how the Obama administration will repond to this other than the usual "Terrorism is bad and you need to trust us that we do all this for your own safety"

I hate to be this guy but there are people lighting off bombs out there and as soon as a big one goes off people will demand they do a lot more than this. Would you rather have your Facebook scanned or see a car bomb go off in Times Square during rush hour? That's not hyperbole, that's the decision we have to make.

You're a moron. We had none of this infra in place until recently and what have the "terrorists" managed to pull off? Two WTC attacks in 20 years and the biggest one killed 3k people. I'd rather take the chance on a bomb going off in Time Square at rush hour. That happening is insanely unlikely, but the government abusing privacy information has already happened. The more they have the worse it will get.

The only "terrorists" I worry about is the US government itself.

Re: NSA slides explain the PRISM data-collection program

#117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is hyperbole. The number of terrorist incidents is massively low, and the few that the government claims to have stopped were such laughably unrealistic plots that one wonders the government even bothered. Meanwhile, we have a government surveillance program that literally surpasses the level of the Stasi, here in the United States, and simultaneously an administration that will not even reveal the criteria used…

Bullshit, 'the Stasi"? Go talk to somebody who lived in East Germany. And they catch people all the time trying to get bomb materials, how did you think they were doing it, luck? (In the case of the car bomb in Times Square you're right, it was dumb luck, the timer malfunctioned.) If the average person didn't freak out and start yelling retarded things like 'Stasi!' I'd say fine, maybe my fucking Facebook is worth pe…

They don't catch anyone! The only plans they intercept are their own fucking plans! Have you not noticed that every would-be "terrorist" they've caught was entrapped? That is, without the US government talking them into it and supplying the materials they wouldn't have done shit? Get your fucking head out of your ass, you're selling our freedoms to fight shadows.

Re: NSA slides explain the PRISM data-collection program

#118
post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right. Their argument is invalid because if some hypothetical future even happens, you predict that their attitude would change.

"Hypothetical": http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_foiled_Islamic_terroris... And those are the ones we know about, Obama doesn't spike the ball on that stuff quite like Bush did. And if you think there wouldn't be global ramifications for blowing up the New York City subway line you're not thinking clearly.

So in 20+ years we have 12 cases? And how do we know any of these cases are actually true? Because the people who benefit from wiretapping us claim it's true? The cases I follow have all been clear cut cases of entrapment (where the victim still went to jail!).

Re: NSA slides explain the PRISM data-collection program

#119
post #23

Link to delete Google Account: https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/32046?hl=en

I don't think this is helpful or productive -- it's not the companies at fault, but rather the government that is making this compulsory.

No, it's absolutely productive and helpful. We the people have no voice. Companies like Google who makes billions are the ones with a voice. If a million people left Google in protest you could expect action. If a million people signed some bullshit online petition nothing at all would happen.

Re: NSA slides explain the PRISM data-collection program

#120
post #30
post #19

I-M-P-E-A-C-H

oh please. like this has a thing to do with POTUS. I worked at an ISP in 1998 when we were contacted by the FBI and required to install carnivore. This has been going on a very long time.

Right, so lets just keep on holding no one accountable. That's worked great so far.
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