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MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

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Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#111

So much for the "but Microsoft is a new company now". Remember "Microsoft loves open source" phrase from just few years ago? Guess what, Ike also loved Tina.

I always saw it as Microsoft is clearly two (or more) companies now. Some of those companies are very much what Microsoft was always like. Some others aren't at all like microsoft in anything but name.

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Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#112

I have no skin in the game, but even I am starting to think the obvious thing here: Apple and Google own the entire mobile OS market. They could literally destroy Microsoft if they started to hugely degrade the experience of Microsoft products on iOS and Android with dark patterns a la Microsoft. But they don't. So far they were competing by making their own products better. Microsoft needs to think hard how hostile…

Apple controls the browser on iOS with an iron fist. Even if you are using a different app, its still Safari under the hood. And even though they control the rendering, they still open all links from Apple apps in Safari.

Oh and music. I use an alternative to Apple music because I choose to. That doesn’t stop Apple music from being the auto play choice even when I don’t use Apple Music.

If Apple’s products are so much better they should allow choice and bot be threatened by it.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#113

So much for the "but Microsoft is a new company now". Remember "Microsoft loves open source" phrase from just few years ago? Guess what, Ike also loved Tina.

Recall that Microsoft initially tried to make the hot reload feature of .NET 6 available only in Visual Studio. Their 3E strategy continues to this day.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#114
post #69

Microsoft is shoving their software down people's throats with impunity. Just yesterday I had to install VS Code for a Homebridge integration, and out of nowhere they slapped a Bing search bar bang in the middle of the desktop.

Why not VS Codium?

Not answering for the GP:

There are so many people out there, who should know better, or even do know better. Yet, for whatever reason install VS Code instead of VS Codium. Even when you inform people about the existence of VS Codium, they still don't move and keep using VS Code. It is like they do not even care at all.

That this is even allowed to happen in organizations is already an oversight. It should not even be allowed to install VS Code on organization machines or use it to ever view or work on the code of an organization.

To me it looks very unprofessional. It is like a shiny toy has been dangled in front of their eyes and they reach for it, never willing to let go of it, even when they are being told that there is telemetry and non-reproducible builds and whatever other mistreatment of them as useds. Like children they stick to their shiny toy, even if they could have the same features, same UI, just without built in telemetry. (And they can still install any extensions they want later, if they trust that extension or marketplace of extensions.) It is very similar to people installing Chrome instead of Ungoogled Chromium. I have personally experienced how uninformed people at a university went wide-eyed, thinking I was talking crazy stuff, when I told them that it should not be installed on university computers, since it is spyware.

I wish I could get people to get off their behinds and improve the situation. But it is of course very difficult to always create awareness and people are so damn ignorant. Often I am not even suggesting, that they should switch to free software tools yet. They could literally have the same experience, but no, most of the time you cannot tell them anything and they continue to take us with them into dystopia of our own making as a society with collective uninformedness and ignorance.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Simply put, people don't love Edge as much as they love Chrome. The browser bundled with Windows 11 is naturally Edge, but users who use Chrome install Chrome of their own volition, so forcing them to open links in Edge is extremely annoying.

I don't use either chrome or edge but why would I use a clone instead of the real thing? I never understood why Microsoft thought cloning chrome was a good thing for adoption. Edge is just chrome now but with some annoying bloat like the coupon pop-ups and pay later scams.

> why would I use a clone instead of the real thing

Has nothing to do with why people don't use Edge (they still didn't use Edge when it was using a custom engine; same for IE before it).

And it's only the techy minority that even knows Edge is built on top of Chromium.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#116

I have no skin in the game, but even I am starting to think the obvious thing here: Apple and Google own the entire mobile OS market. They could literally destroy Microsoft if they started to hugely degrade the experience of Microsoft products on iOS and Android with dark patterns a la Microsoft. But they don't. So far they were competing by making their own products better. Microsoft needs to think hard how hostile…

>Have they just become Were they ever different tho? I know a lot of people believed the 'MS loves open source' and similar stuff but it always felt like bait to me. They still tried to force trough their shitty open document format, still regularly pull layers of small anticompetitive stuff. Small changes that aren't outrageous enough on their own to cause a reaction or throw out the trust they try to create but eno…

my understanding is that within microsoft there are different factions competing with each other for i don't know what, dominance maybe. it kind of makes sense since microsoft has several different strong products that can stand on their own (unlike google whose main income is from advertising so really all google products subsume to that), and some of these factions may well genuinely love FOSS.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#117
Is everyone misreading the article?

The new policy is to ignore your default browser from Outlook and Teams and open Edge. There is an option to turn off this policy to use your default browser.

> Microsoft 365 Enterprise IT admins will be able to alter the policy, but those on Microsoft 365 for business will have to manage this change on individual machines.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#118
post #80

Am I the only one who sees the technical aspect here: They literally write in this article that this is about embedding web pages next to the chat/email/whatever. That means in-memory over contracted hosting api etc. When I would own, e.g. MS Teams or Outlook, the hell I would love to have a dependency on the internal Firefox hosting API which can break any other day (just a example ... firefox is cool) or introducin…

Aren't you sort of saying that it's okay because they have a vision where you use their products for everything? Hard to tickle that out from antitrust, no?

The worst thing about the integration is that their safelink checker thing is slow as hell.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#119
post #79
post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why not VS Codium?

Is there any usability difference between the two?

VS Codium and other forks don't (maybe can't) use the official VSCode extension market. Because a lot of goodness, like the ability to refactor and debug PHP, is coming from the extensions and the extension ecosystem, it can be a big deal.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#120
This is an expected normalization of html email and the mostly-client-side-apps; Outlook (the desktop app) already renders the html email in a MS rendering engine (Edge? I don't know).

If the email has a button (or a link) - i think it makes sense that the click event shows up "in" the mail client.

I hate html email - but the last 20 years have been all about siloing hypertext apps in email systems - proprietary protocols (exchange, Gmail web - with IMAP/SMTP/pop3 as secondary citizens).

This just a natural continuation.

If you want to escape use a real MUA - and maybe a real mail provider.

Unfortunately if you want groupware - there's no proper open solution (but props to Fastmail for at least trying - but until there are good independent desktop/mobile/console apps with JMAP support - and the equivalent for shared booking and calendar) - it's pretty much either proprietary crapware, or open solutions without feature parity.

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