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The TSA's Selective Laptop Ban

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Re: The TSA's Selective Laptop Ban

#111

Post by tehlike »

sandworm101 wrote: post #35
tehlike wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who flies through istanbul once a year, i was always surprised by the fact that there is very little security at us airports. :) I think it is more about penetration possibility more so than airport sevurity itself.

Security at US airports is hit-and-miss. Sometimes they check something and sometimes they dont. Rules appear to change daily and every checkpoint seems to interpret them slightly differently.

In middle eastern countries where domestic terrorism is higher, like turkey or israel, the security checks are pretty abundant.

You get searched at the airport entrance, and get your luggage checked with xray scanners. Yoy get another one after passing the passport check done by cops. If you are flying to united states you get searched again at the gate.

On top of this, they verify your legal status at the checkin. It happened to me once when my greencard was approved but i only had the ead card. We literally spent an hour to get it sorted.

So i am not sure, but adding one more layer on top makes me feel sad.

Good thing turkish airlines will use specialized storage mechanism to store laptops in cabin. At least that will prevent things from getting stolen or potentially illegally searched.

Re: The TSA's Selective Laptop Ban

#112

Post by luca_ing »

sseveran wrote: post #90
rajathagasthya wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Imho this is business and politics. This everyday safety mesure is being applied selectively in order to disadvantage some and advantage others. This was designed to put gulf carriers at a disadvantage because American airliners can't quite match their quality of service. They have been crying about gulf carriers getting huge subsidies from their governments without doing a single thing to improve their own service…

It's difficult to say that American carriers have not done a single thing to improve their service. The cost structure of United/American/Delta is very different than long haul international carriers. http://fortune.com/united-airlines-ceo-oscar-munoz/

I tried to read the piece you linked, but TBH I couldn't be bothered to wade through the fluff and stopped before I came to the part you were referencing.

Maybe you could quote it for us?

Anyway, the question I wanted to ask is: how does United/American/Delta's structure compare to, say, Lufthansa, or Air France, or Thai Airways? I've honestly never flown a US carrier, but long-haul complaints and horror stories tend to be about US carriers, not European ones, even though I suspect they have pretty similar structure.

Re: The TSA's Selective Laptop Ban

#114

Post by pavel_lishin »

logicallee wrote: post #109
pavel_lishin wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But the worst argument you can make is "People will always tie up the pilot and copilot, and banning shoelaces won't stop this." Nobody ever, ever made that argument. The argument was that people will always try to strangle the pilot. People will always have dirt on their shoes. There is a way to keep my carpet clean, but banning Nikes won't do it. You will never get the percentage of people who want to commit terr…

Okay, in your own words please rephrase what the OP meant with "at some point we are going to have to realise that terrorists are always going to want to target aircraft and just live with it". What does "just live with it" mean, to you? I don't have to just live with the fact that there is probably at least 1 cannibal in the world (out of 7 billion people), today, who would probably love to cook and eat me (or eat m…

> Okay, in your own words please rephrase

I have, several times. I think I've explained this well enough in the past, and I'm not sure rephrasing it will do any good, so this is my last attempt:

    The selective laptop ban makes no sense
    and is not statistically likely to decrease
    the chances of an airplane being bombed.
> I don't have to just live with the fact that there is probably at least 1 cannibal in the world (out of 7 billion people), today, who would probably love to cook and eat me (or eat me raw).

I mean, you do. There are absolutely cannibals in the world, certainly more than one, and they would absolutely not turn up their nose at the idea of eating you.

So how do you live with it?

The answer is, by realizing that there are safeguards in place already to largely prevent this from happening.

There is no need to ban passengers boarding at Jacksons International Airport from bringing plastic cutlery and napkins along with them, despite the fact that they could conceivably use them to eat you. Such a ban would be at best a complete waste of time, money and manpower, and would be pretty racist at worst.

Re: The TSA's Selective Laptop Ban

#115

Post by logicallee »

pavel_lishin wrote: post #114
logicallee wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Okay, in your own words please rephrase what the OP meant with "at some point we are going to have to realise that terrorists are always going to want to target aircraft and just live with it". What does "just live with it" mean, to you? I don't have to just live with the fact that there is probably at least 1 cannibal in the world (out of 7 billion people), today, who would probably love to cook and eat me (or eat m…

> Okay, in your own words please rephrase I have, several times. I think I've explained this well enough in the past, and I'm not sure rephrasing it will do any good, so this is my last attempt: The selective laptop ban makes no sense and is not statistically likely to decrease the chances of an airplane being bombed. > I don't have to just live with the fact that there is probably at least 1 cannibal in the world (o…

That rephrasing has zero to do with learning to live with airplanes being bombed. Zero.

We're done talking about OP, and we're now just talking about your ideas, which I don't disagree with. So we're not disagreed about anything.

Re: The TSA's Selective Laptop Ban

#116

Post by cylinder »

sandworm101 wrote: post #97
rajathagasthya wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Imho this is business and politics. This everyday safety mesure is being applied selectively in order to disadvantage some and advantage others. This was designed to put gulf carriers at a disadvantage because American airliners can't quite match their quality of service. They have been crying about gulf carriers getting huge subsidies from their governments without doing a single thing to improve their own service…

Apples and oranges. Frankly, on the short-haul flights of US airlines I don't want the type of service offered internationals leaving Dubai. I don't want in-flight hot towels or fancy entertainment systems when I am only in the chair for a couple hours. I want polite airport staff at well-designed and run airports. I want flights that leave on time and predictable security lines so that I need not arrive hours early.…

What is your point? I don't understand why you focused on short-haul. US carriers do long-haul to, and they are terrible at it, but they are so lazy and incompetent that they just choose to whine about unfairness instead of competing. Typical. The funny thing is, these Middle East routes were wide open for the taking for a long time, and they still don't offer them.

Re: The TSA's Selective Laptop Ban

#117

Post by [deleted] »

logicallee wrote: post #115
pavel_lishin wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Okay, in your own words please rephrase I have, several times. I think I've explained this well enough in the past, and I'm not sure rephrasing it will do any good, so this is my last attempt: The selective laptop ban makes no sense and is not statistically likely to decrease the chances of an airplane being bombed. > I don't have to just live with the fact that there is probably at least 1 cannibal in the world (o…

That rephrasing has zero to do with learning to live with airplanes being bombed. Zero. We're done talking about OP, and we're now just talking about your ideas, which I don't disagree with. So we're not disagreed about anything.

[deleted]

Re: The TSA's Selective Laptop Ban

#118

Post by doubleplusgood »

phonon wrote: post #101
doubleplusgood wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On mobile, this article seems to provide some info http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/4978149

Yup. You'd be surprised what comes out of your mouth if someone attractive and personable starts smiling at you and asking questions randomly. You don't have your "defenses up" and you start blabbing away before you figure out that no, this person is not actually trying to hit on me :-)

I'm aware, I travel via TLV a lot :)
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