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Ruqqus, an open source Reddit clone, is shutting down their main instance

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Re: Ruqqus, an open source Reddit clone, is shutting down their main instance

#101

Post by nemothekid »

BitwiseFool wrote: post #70

I think this is a good place to mention O'Sullivan's First Law: "All organizations that are not actually right-wing will over time become left-wing.": https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_O'Sullivan_(columnist) Any platform that establishes itself as a result of a purge from a left-wing dominated platform like Reddit will start out as explicitly right-wing and will struggle to gain non-partisan membership. That new pla…

There is a more general law that has nothing to do political leaning that was coined by someone who's community generally disproves your point.

moot, creator of 4chan, has a talk or blog post (can't find it now) detailing this exact dynamic. There are plenty of times moot banned discussion of a certain topic (not even politically relevant), those users would get mad and start their own chan. That chan would eventually be a community of people who just post about how they hate 4chan and continue to be contrarian until they died. Community building is hard and you can't build a platform around being anti-the-other-platform. I think it's fashionable to call these "new platforms" right wing, but this is not a new trend and its something common you would see in the phpBB days of the forum, except instead of the new platform being "right wing", it was that the old platform was fascist because the moderator was an asshole. That said, 4chan is a platform you can clearly point that started out non-partisan. Before Trump 4chan was pro-occupy Wall Street. The community, on its own, became more right wing without overtly advertising itself as such. Over time however it's clear that /pol/ is a far right platform and there was no need for it to splinter off from everything. The lack of robust right wing communities online has more to do with community building rather than self-censorship. A rightwing community has to be exclusionary from the start, and it's hard to bootstrap a community that must ostracize a portion early members.

It's my view, that globally in the western world, that conservatism is actually just a very loud minority position. The loudest conservative folks tend to act the most anti-social and ultimately tend to get ostracized. This ostracism as a result of their anti-social behavior leads to some persecution complex that they are being pushed out when in reality they just hold a minority position. The "no racism" rules are required because when said person gets banned for calling someone a n*gger who was just posting an image of a birdhouse, they tend to be the most pedantic about rules. Most normal people just don't want to deal with that.

Re: Ruqqus, an open source Reddit clone, is shutting down their main instance

#102

Post by preach »

nemothekid wrote: post #101
BitwiseFool wrote: post #70

I think this is a good place to mention O'Sullivan's First Law: "All organizations that are not actually right-wing will over time become left-wing.": https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_O'Sullivan_(columnist) Any platform that establishes itself as a result of a purge from a left-wing dominated platform like Reddit will start out as explicitly right-wing and will struggle to gain non-partisan membership. That new pla…

There is a more general law that has nothing to do political leaning that was coined by someone who's community generally disproves your point. moot, creator of 4chan, has a talk or blog post (can't find it now) detailing this exact dynamic. There are plenty of times moot banned discussion of a certain topic (not even politically relevant), those users would get mad and start their own chan. That chan would eventuall…

> Over time however it's clear that /pol/ is a far right platform

Citation needed.

Re: Ruqqus, an open source Reddit clone, is shutting down their main instance

#103

Post by Zacny_Los »

1270018080 wrote: post #25

Is it possible to create a free speech reddit alternative that doesn't immediately turn into a right wing extremist site? My mind immediately turns to the Paradox of Tolerance, and I think the answer is no.

Yes, that's lemmy.ml

Re: Ruqqus, an open source Reddit clone, is shutting down their main instance

#104

Post by xtracto »

dtjb wrote: post #48
hunterb123 wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ah yes, making fun of people dying is okay as long as you obscure the names! the same people that like to respond with "700,000+ dead"! this is the same reason /r/fatpeoplehate got banned is it not? yes the intent may be to "help through shaming" but it's not usually allowed, guess it's okay because of the political lean. ironically, shaming the fat people would help the covid thing most of all as it's the #1 morbidi…

I wasn't active in the community, but I believe r/fatpeoplehate was mostly unsolicited photographs ("creepshots") of overweight people and making fun of them. It appears r/hermancainaward is 100% based on posts that the deceased willingly shared with the public. I think that's a meaningful difference.

> It appears r/hermancainaward is 100% based on posts that the deceased willingly shared with the public. I think that's a meaningful difference.

Just a minor correction there: The majority of posts from the death people in HCA are from Facebook. I think that normally, people posts would only be shared with their Friends (unless you specifically change it to be public).

In that respect, posters in HCA would be publishing posts that were originally not meant to be public.

As an example, I might write a post in Facebook about me and my wife going on vacation to X place for 1 week. While it is OK for me for my friends to know that, I may not want this information to be public for fear of my house getting robbed while I am gone.

Although I completely agree with the sentiment and main point of HCA (and I actually have enjoyed the schadenfreude of some of the awarded people there), I concede that it is definitely a subreddit that is of quite bad taste and brings the worst of the "pro-vaccine" side of the argument.

Re: Ruqqus, an open source Reddit clone, is shutting down their main instance

#105

Post by iaml »

BitwiseFool wrote: post #90
dtjb wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wasn't active in the community, but I believe r/fatpeoplehate was mostly unsolicited photographs ("creepshots") of overweight people and making fun of them. It appears r/hermancainaward is 100% based on posts that the deceased willingly shared with the public. I think that's a meaningful difference.

I think that r/HermanCainAward is actually quite sinister and designed to normalize and reinforce dehumanization of "the other side". The whole point of the subreddit is to showcase people who've had strong political convictions, then died as a result of them. You're supposed to feel a sense of comeuppance that these people who don't believe in the vaccine or dismiss the severity Covid died as a result of their belie…

There have been threads there where people say they would prefer that sub wouldn't exist at all, those preventable deaths and misery fading from existence. I don't know whether they do it for laughs or are just burnt out from people choosing to make a point of politicizing not wearing a mask, probably a mix of both. I don't know how to solve that problem either, some of the posts there contain straight up insults towards people who vaxx/wear masks, this feedback cycle of radicalization is self sustaining at this point.

Re: Ruqqus, an open source Reddit clone, is shutting down their main instance

#106

Post by syshum »

noobermin wrote: post #100
somethingor wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Comparing is not equating. The only thing being compared is the “when in Rome” aspect.

My point is people are missing the point...again, clearly stating it again, the issue isn't the signaling, it's what must be signaled.

You don't believe, that perhaps people are not missing the point at all, but instead your political bias' are showing?

That you agree with political bent of one type of signalling...

Re: Ruqqus, an open source Reddit clone, is shutting down their main instance

#107

Post by syshum »

dtjb wrote: post #34
dymk wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

r/the_doland (banned) r/CringeAnarchy (banned) r/Greatawakening (banned) The myriad of r/incel communities and their clones that Reddit plays whack-a-mole with

r/antifa and r/chapotraphouse were also large communities that were banned. Reddit policy definitely appears to be based on behavior, not ideology.

Pointing to a few exceptions does not change the fact there is a clear political bias to reddit Admin action.

This is to be expected given the geographic location of their Admin staff, however to deny this to to pretend that CNN, MSNBC and Fox News are all "unbiased news sources" which everyone knows this to be false as well

While yes, Reddit Admins do take action on behavior, the Admins ideology allows certain groups more "benefit of the doubt" more warnings, more kid gloves than other ideologies do.

Any honest observer can see that in the pattern of Admin action

Re: Ruqqus, an open source Reddit clone, is shutting down their main instance

#108

Post by syshum »

nemothekid wrote: post #55
hunterb123 wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ah yes, making fun of people dying is okay as long as you obscure the names! the same people that like to respond with "700,000+ dead"! this is the same reason /r/fatpeoplehate got banned is it not? yes the intent may be to "help through shaming" but it's not usually allowed, guess it's okay because of the political lean. ironically, shaming the fat people would help the covid thing most of all as it's the #1 morbidi…

> ah yes, making fun of people dying is okay as long as you obscure the names! Yes. You've made up an imaginary enemy in your head and you are talking down to others based on the imaginary Reddit company in your head. The reason those other communities were banned were for targeted harassment, doxing of real people, and brigading other subreddits. Reddit has never stated that they were any rules on the "morality" of…

So then what is the defense for a similar subreddit that made fun of people that died after getting the vaccination. They followed the same "rules" you seem to claim here, they did not doxx anyone, they did not harass anyone, they did not brigade other subreddits, most of it was just side by side tweets of a person positing the vaccination announcement followed by a notification they died a few day later...

Re: Ruqqus, an open source Reddit clone, is shutting down their main instance

#109

Post by noobermin »

syshum wrote: post #106
noobermin wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My point is people are missing the point...again, clearly stating it again, the issue isn't the signaling, it's what must be signaled.

You don't believe, that perhaps people are not missing the point at all, but instead your political bias' are showing? That you agree with political bent of one type of signalling...

I don't agree that Jews are trying to make black people marry white people. Is that what you're referring to? I'm certainly not for white people "checking their privilege" either because as I said it's annoying.

Why are you attacking me?

Re: Ruqqus, an open source Reddit clone, is shutting down their main instance

#110

Post by apozem »

nucleardog wrote: post #91
1270018080 wrote: post #25

Is it possible to create a free speech reddit alternative that doesn't immediately turn into a right wing extremist site? My mind immediately turns to the Paradox of Tolerance, and I think the answer is no.

What’s the incentive for users to use it? You’re offering a comparable product except with no real existing user base and a higher friction to gain new users for your community. There’s some marginal audience in people interested in the principle of the thing, but the bulk of your users are going to be users that can’t be serviced by the main players. If your only offering is “X, but we won’t ban you” then you’re goi…

> If your only offering is “X, but we won’t ban you” then you’re going to collect the dregs of the internet.

Exactly. They’re the only people you have a value proposition for. Everyone else will just use X.

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