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Alternate Day Fasting Improves Physiological and Molecular Markers of Aging [pdf]

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Re: Alternate Day Fasting Improves Physiological and Molecular Markers of Aging [pdf]

#101

Post by bjourne »

dmd149 wrote: post #57

Been doing intermittent fasting for a long time now and have been doing ADF for the last few months. I lost fat and retained lean muscle while - eating between 3000-6000 calories on eating days - running 30-35 miles per week - weight lifting 3x per week Here is a reddit post about my progress with some documentation including pics of recent DEXA scans. https://www.reddit.com/r/leangains/comments/cliuqk/been_prac...

Don't you feel like shit if you don't eat anything for a whole day? Does your body adapt?

Re: Alternate Day Fasting Improves Physiological and Molecular Markers of Aging [pdf]

#102

Post by dmd149 »

bjourne wrote: post #101
dmd149 wrote: post #57

Been doing intermittent fasting for a long time now and have been doing ADF for the last few months. I lost fat and retained lean muscle while - eating between 3000-6000 calories on eating days - running 30-35 miles per week - weight lifting 3x per week Here is a reddit post about my progress with some documentation including pics of recent DEXA scans. https://www.reddit.com/r/leangains/comments/cliuqk/been_prac...

Don't you feel like shit if you don't eat anything for a whole day? Does your body adapt?

No. I feel fine. Just a bit hungry around dinner time.

Re: Alternate Day Fasting Improves Physiological and Molecular Markers of Aging [pdf]

#103

Post by meowface »

rsync wrote: post #68
frank_nitti wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there really no difference between eating 1500 calories at once vs. over the course of 5 meals? Of course, there is no weight loss without a calorie deficit, but are all calorie deficits equivalent on magnitude alone? I struggle with the notion that the timing does not matter at all, and much of the suggested benefits of controlling the timing focus on other metrics beside immediate weight loss. The "wisdom" of th…

"Is there really no difference between eating 1500 calories at once vs. over the course of 5 meals?" Digestion - and the ramping up of your entire metabolic process - is not a minor task. It is an all-hands-on-deck marshaling of a number of bodily processes that preclude other processes that you might like your body to engage in. If you are firing up this mechanism every three hours - insulin response, spiking your b…

I've been used to eating one huge meal (or one huge meal and a snack) per day for years, but I've recently realized it's not been very good for me (other than it possibly keeping my weight low).

For one, I seem to have a much higher chance of feeling tired if I eat a lot at once, compared to spaced out smaller meals. And two, this often manifests as me working/programming all day without eating anything until nighttime, having a huge meal, and then falling asleep. This typically leads to trouble sleeping, indigestion, and a general bleh feeling the next morning.

I've started moving to 2 - 3 smaller meals per day, and I find I have a lot more energy during the day, with no grogginess after meals and no issues with sleep. Though it seems a 24-hour fast gives me the most energy out of everything. And I agree continuous snacking is probably not great.

Re: Alternate Day Fasting Improves Physiological and Molecular Markers of Aging [pdf]

#104

Post by kdbg »

torben-friis wrote: post #35
dvt wrote: post #17

I fast, on average, once a week. At least once a month, I try to do an extended fast (2-5 days) to force ketosis. I also do intermittent fasting basically daily (I only eat between 12-8). Been doing this for about 4 years now. Some anecdata: - Fasting > 24 hrs paradoxically gives you an extreme boost of energy and mental focus. I especially love how my olfactory sense is extremely heightened. It's pretty cool and eve…

Are you fit? as in, do you lift weights or are active in sports that require strength? I ask because I wonder about the effects of extended fasts on muscle loss/retention, a big problem cutting weight for some people is that they get rid of some muscle mass along with the calories they wanted to eliminate.

I think for that you might want to research Protein sparing modified fasting, https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protein-sparing_modified_fas...

Gist of it is you still cut significant calories only eating like 500-800 a day in mostly low fat protien rich foods. Targeting only enough protien to avoid muscle wasting.

While I'm no doctor or nutritionist, my understanding is that it's for that case, you want some of the benefits of fasting like going into ketosis while maintaining lean mass.

Unfortunately I'm on my phone only this week so I can't try and find any studies about it, but I came across it first in connection with type 2 Diabetes. So you might have some luck googling those topics for more info.

Re: Alternate Day Fasting Improves Physiological and Molecular Markers of Aging [pdf]

#105

Post by core-questions »

SwellJoe wrote: post #99
core-questions wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> that's not really OK. This kind of word policing is even less OK. It's not "gross" to make a comment about something you see and have opinions about, especially for a public figure. You're not shedding light on any subject, either, all you're doing is being offended-on-behalf of someone else; the world's got enough of that and it doesn't seem to be making any positive difference at all.

The comment I responded to did not add substantively to the discussion, and I pointed out why. I am not "policing" anything. I have no power to arrest someone or censor someone for being an asshole online. I expressed an opinion about the kind of community I'd like to be a part of. Also, it seems like you're doing what you're criticizing me for. I don't think the world's got enough of minding one's own damned busines…

> Also, it seems like you're doing what you're criticizing me for.

Sure, but only in a meta-sense to curb the proliferation of the technique. I'd liken it to nuking would-be nuclear powers to prevent further problems.

And maybe, _just maybe_, Jack Dorsey should eat a sandwich.

Re: Alternate Day Fasting Improves Physiological and Molecular Markers of Aging [pdf]

#106

Post by firethief »

mikeklaas wrote: post #89
dvt wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My daily intake was 175g protein, 150g carbs, and 50g fats. To hit those macros reliably, egg whites for breakfast and chicken (or tuna) for dinner will quickly become a status quo :)

That's an insane macro ratio for most people, though. You don't need that much protein unless you're doing some intense weight training.

High protein ratios are for for weight loss; activities that increase protein need increase carb need by at least as much

Re: Alternate Day Fasting Improves Physiological and Molecular Markers of Aging [pdf]

#107

Post by kasey_junk »

ubermonkey wrote: post #79

It's interesting, but as a hobby and primary physical outlet I'm very involved in cycling. I don't race, but I ride with racers, and keep up. I do not think I could balance fasting with 1,500 calorie efforts. ;)

Funny enough in the 70s and 80s (and into the early 90s in some rare cases) it was fairly common for cyclists to cut weight like boxers.

I think its fair to assume that caffeine and amphetamines were used to achieve those results and not strict fasting regimes...

Re: Alternate Day Fasting Improves Physiological and Molecular Markers of Aging [pdf]

#108

Post by jacques_chester »

jacques_chester wrote: post #82
49para wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would your body breakdown your organs when you still have plenty of adipose stores ? Do you have a citation for the "starvation mode" ? If it's the 1940's study from MN, that was only when the subjects where well into single digit fat %.

Bodies aren't finite state machines and the concept of "modes" can be misleading. What you have is a (very large) number of independent processes that have differing amounts of flow under different conditions. So, for example, you don't click from building muscle to consuming muscle. What happens is that catabolism has a higher flow than anabolism, so the net balance is negative. As the body becomes leaner in starvat…

Clarifying some of what I wrote above --

* "independent processes" is better described as "interdependent, oftentimes antagonistic processes".

* In describing net balance, the key is that both processes remain active throughout, even if only the net balance of flow can be observed. Or more likely, the integration of the net flow over time (the stock).

* I say "that loop shifts", more accurately the loop dominance shifts. This is a term from system dynamics for describing how the behaviour of the overall system can suddenly change due to a change in flow of one or more loops that are working antagonistically.

Re: Alternate Day Fasting Improves Physiological and Molecular Markers of Aging [pdf]

#109

Post by zbtaylor1 »

rsync wrote: post #64
pizza234 wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm personally very skeptical [as well]. I notice that almost nobody that recounts their fasting experience ever mentions sport. I personally found very hard already to progress on weightlifting during diet cycles, as I need to cut on volume significantly; can't imagine to do that while fasting, unless fasting would "flip a switch" in how the (my) body works, which I doubt.

"I'm personally very skeptical [as well]. I notice that almost nobody that recounts their fasting experience ever mentions sport." Allow me to step right up. First, as you might expect, aerobic and endurance exercise benefits greatly from being in a fasted (16-24 hr) state. You're light, quick and your body is devoting zero blood flow (and other resources) to digestion. I suspect you're not surprised by this. Second,…

> First, as you might expect, aerobic and endurance exercise benefits greatly from being in a fasted (16-24 hr) state. You're light, quick and your body is devoting zero blood flow (and other resources) to digestion.

I'd say it depends greatly on the effort and the individual. Long, slow distance for someone who is accustomed to training fasted? Fat stores will suffice as an energy source.

But add in some intensity and that's gonna be rough without much glycogen in the tank - which will be the case if you've been fasting for the past 16-24 hours.

Re: Alternate Day Fasting Improves Physiological and Molecular Markers of Aging [pdf]

#110

Post by rtkwe »

frank_nitti wrote: post #52
rtkwe wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot of diets, especially IF style diets, are pretty much just tricks to get you to eat less calorie wise. Intermittent fasting does this by just setting the simple rule, only eat during a relatively small window of time. It's easier to eat less during that period because there's only so much you can comfortably eat in that time. (Granted you can totally fit a whole day's intake in the IF period but it's harder).

Is there really no difference between eating 1500 calories at once vs. over the course of 5 meals? Of course, there is no weight loss without a calorie deficit, but are all calorie deficits equivalent on magnitude alone? I struggle with the notion that the timing does not matter at all, and much of the suggested benefits of controlling the timing focus on other metrics beside immediate weight loss. The "wisdom" of th…

What I meant was it's easier to eat less calories if you restrict the amount of time you're allowing yourself to eat not anything about absorption being different due to the compressed time frame.
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