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Facebook completes construction of first full-scale aircraft, Aquila [video]

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Re: Facebook completes construction of first full-scale aircraft, Aquila [video]

#111

This video has given me a newfound respect for Facebook. Many engineers at tech companies like Google, Facebook, Microsoft, etc. report that they feel overqualified for their work. I imagine many yearn for the chance to work on moonshot projects like these - is there any reason why secretive research divisions at these companies are so small, when there is plenty of engineering talent to go around internally?

There is this idea that small teams with great leadership are more effective at innovation.

Re: Facebook completes construction of first full-scale aircraft, Aquila [video]

#112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a shame. If telcos are in the loop, my hopes for this shrink 99%...

Yeah, the telcos that build pretty much the full entirety of the "last-mile" internet as we know it today can not but trusted in the least to be at all involved in any new last mile provisions what so ever. We (fairly rich, definitely reasonably connected, people) cannot allow the third world to enjoy something as humiliating as imperfect internet (to a standard we barely enjoy ourselves, however immensely beneficial…

I'm pretty sure you haven't heard me complaining about the imperfect/perfect Internet this would offer, or whether we should wait or not for something more/less neutral, so your reply is totally misguided.

I have 7 years of experience working in telco business. I don't mind "rich" companies investing in this solution (something else you got wrong), what I mind is telcos in the loop.

Oh, BTW, besides the experience with the soul-crushing telco business, I also have experience at that third world thingy... You see, I've grown in a third world country. Born '85, had no idea that compact discs (CD) existed until '94.

Re: Facebook completes construction of first full-scale aircraft, Aquila [video]

#113
post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually France is far ahead of the US in its internet coverage, at a much lower price.

I am in France at the moment, and I have never (exaduration) seen so many feature phones... Getting a French SIM for data was an exercise in frustration even with a local helping me. I got a SIM from Bourgues Telecom by registering it to a friend's name and address. Mostly works but it is really really difficult to give them money (wtf) and they modify unencrypted HTML page image links: http://serverfault.com/questio…

Where are you in France?

I've got unlimited call + sms + 4G data (limited bandwidth after 20Gb) for 20€/month, and 300Mb/s fibre connection for 35€/month. I have not seen similar rates in the UK/US.

Re: Facebook completes construction of first full-scale aircraft, Aquila [video]

#114
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think that's true. We can substitute (no internet + desire for internet) in for the right side, and I think that's better than (some internet + lessened desire for full internet)

Why don't we ask the people who currently have no internet what they'd prefer?

Which would you prefer, knowing what you know?

Re: Facebook completes construction of first full-scale aircraft, Aquila [video]

#115
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They're likely not using something too exotic: 10Gbps free space optical links have been available commercially for a few years now (see products by AOptix). The tricky part is pointing them and getting the last bit of power on target. If they're actually forming links at 100's of km separation they're already on par with what APL was doing just 2 or 3 years ago [1]. Impressive that they not only have the data termin…

Agreed, this is very cool. How do free space optical links work in the rain though? Shouldn't be a problem for the link between aircrafts as they fly above the weather but might be for aircraft-ground link if that's optical. Hope FB will open source parts of this! I know NASA has been looking at optical links for high bandwidth space communication, this accurate tracking would really help

There are a couple effects from rain: absorption ("db per km") and scattering (bigger constant in front of your r^2 term), neither are good for FSO. Fog (and since this is airborne, clouds) is the real killer. Imagine taking your nice .1 degree wide laser beam and pointing it into one of those frosted street lamp bulbs so that it now points in every direction, then add to that the attenuation from being absorbed by the droplets. Now, in FB's case, they're doing something pretty smart to mitigate the water problem. Using RF for the ground-air links avoids most of the problems with scattering and absorbtion depending on droplet size and the band you're transmitting in. Hard to beat the bandwidth of FSO, so that's a great option for above the clouds. 60,000 feet should be above most clouds - anything that tall and you'll be wanting to get out of the way in any case.

The LCRD stuff that NASA is doing is indeed impressive. I think that their pointing problem is a few orders of magnitude harder than what FB is dealing with though - if anything we'll see technology transfer in the other direction.

Re: Facebook completes construction of first full-scale aircraft, Aquila [video]

#117
post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you okay with Comcast doing IP shaping and charging Netflix? If Comcast didn't exist, internet access wouldn't exist for many people. That's why it's a false dichotomy. Internet.org could very easily be rate and data capped alternatives. >connect the two thirds of the world that doesn’t have internet access. -Internet.org This would give them monopsonic control over the internet.

> If Comcast didn't exist, internet access wouldn't exist for many people. Sorry that is extremely far from the truth. Any of the other major ISPs' would leap at the chance to guzzle up these customers if there was no other competition.

You're splitting hairs. Most of Comcast's last mile infrastructure was government subsidized, exactly because no-one was "jumping on it".

So you're saying that it's okay to ignore net neutrality (charge Netflix) when the government isn't there to help subsidize last-mile infrastructure? When you could just as easily provide a capped alternative?

That's the point and splitting hairs doesn't change it.

Re: Facebook completes construction of first full-scale aircraft, Aquila [video]

#118
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fact that going public always tends to make a company's contributions to society less altruistic and turn the ethos of the company into "moar profitz foar de shaerhoaldurs" raises some fairly damning questions about our capital system and its tendency towards greed and stagnation.

Is this really the fault of the financial system? In some respects I believe 'economics' is a verb, so the fault -if there is any- lies with the agents enacting the verb, that is to say: people. Humans, groups of them even, certainly have a tendency to produce and accumulate all sorts of things being their survival needs and go on to trade them. This raises all sorts of concerns and has cause many a lot of stress. Bl…

I don't think anyone's saying that capitalism is directly at fault. Theoretically, a fully free market (assuming that companies always have consumer and shareholder interests at heart) should be optimal, encouraging healthy competition, choice for the consumer, and the economic freedom to found your own startup. Unfortunately, the realities of the free market encourage economic foundationalism and excessive bureaucracy. Despite the free market's relative strengths when looked at from purely a business and consumer perspective, the fastest way to earn revenue and (eventually) break even is to have a company playbook which encourages business decisions that are completely antithetical to what you'd expect from a free market company. After the inevitable IPO, they slowly tend towards maximizing shareholder profit in place of ensuring consumer satisfaction (there are exceptions to this rule-- Apple and Tesla are good examples), and the results are more acquisitions, more profiteering, more tax avoidance, and more focus on the bottom line than putting out a good product. Particularly harmful is how an unregulated free market encourages trusts and oligarchies -- the latter of which we still can't solve today with legislation alone.

For every airbnb or Facebook there are a thousand of acquired startups who kept thinking short-term and forgot entirely about long-term. Which is a shame, because I've no doubt that many put out a quality product -- and I've also no doubt that the company which acquired them may very well have killed said company's specific product two seconds after filling out all of the paperwork. See Google's numerous acquisitions for proof of this.

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