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Show HN: Spot the Drowning Child

spotthedrowningchild.com

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Re: Show HN: Spot the Drowning Child

#171

Post by irishcoffee »

aembleton wrote: post #165
irishcoffee wrote: post #30

I would like to point out that any flotation device in a pool besides a life jacket is just asking for problems. I life-guarded for almost 10 years, the only way I would ever let anything that supported a human floating __besides__ an approved life jacket was if the pool was almost empty (such that the one person got my undivided attention) and if I knew the child to already be a strong swimmer. I highly encourage ev…

My 20 month old has one of these Shark Fins: http://www.amazon.co.uk/SwimFin-3PK-Angelfish-Pink/dp/B001JR... I assume that they are good as he uses them in his swimming classes and with it he can swim a few metres to the side of the pool.

If I'm being honest, this is the kind of thing I would not have allowed. As you describe, your child can make it a few meters away from the side of the pool. Then what?

If your child gets tired, this will not help. This looks like it forced the child into a face-down position, and a tired child forced to be face-down in water doesn't seem like a great idea.

As a fellow parent of a 1.5 year old, I'm sure you've heard of latent drowning. [0] This device seems like it could promote the chances of that happening as well.

[0] https://www.parentmap.com/article/how-a-child-can-drown-5-ho...

Re: Show HN: Spot the Drowning Child

#172

Post by novaleaf »

derekp7 wrote: post #152
novaleaf wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

water wings are also terrible at teaching kids to swim: they can't properly use their arms wearing wings. I had both my kids (currently 3 and 5) learn to swim by having them wear inflatable vests. When they started they had fully inflated vests. every week or so I would deflate it bit by bit, until they are wearing a fully deflated vest. At that point the vest is just for emotional support, and they can pretty much h…

The funny thing is that I remember as a kid using a borrowed set of water wings (I'm assuming those are the inflatable things that go on the upper arms?). I was like 9 years old, and could barely swim by doing a back stroke (floating on my back, and somewhat making my way across the water). But when I put those water wings on, it gave me just enough support that I learned that afternoon how to do a breast stroke and…

interesting! I'll try mixing that in when they get to learning backstroke!

Re: Show HN: Spot the Drowning Child

#173

Post by maxerickson »

astalwick wrote: post #113
rhaps0dy wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm still curious about this: "What does it look like when an able swimmer encounters trouble?" Do adults drown as often as children?

You'd be surprised. This is in Canada, not sure about the US. Deaths per 100,000 people (drowning), Canada, 2006-2010: 0-4: 1.1 5-12: 0.6 13-17: 0.9 18-24: 2.2 24-34: 1.6 34-49: 1.4 50-64: 1.7 65+: 1.6 I don't have the source handy, but I'll try to dig it up. Edit: Source - http://www.lifesavingsociety.com/media/157475/2013-cdndrowni...

The gadget here puts the overall US rate at 1.07 in 2013

http://webappa.cdc.gov/sasweb/ncipc/mortrate10_us.html

I did 18-24, it says 1.18.

24-34, 0.98.

5-12, 0.49.

I wonder what factors into the differences. I'm sure things like number of guarded facilities, number of swimmers and amount of swim classes are important, it's the specific differences that would be interesting.

Re: Show HN: Spot the Drowning Child

#174

Post by Kluny »

AlphaGeekZulu wrote: post #102
kzhahou wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Watching "it" happen. the drowning

Sorry, I am not a native speaker. German. Will fix the comment, so everyone can ease off again...

You're doing well, it was just someone being a grammar stickler for no good reason.

Re: Show HN: Spot the Drowning Child

#175

Post by trhway »

hamiltonkibbe wrote: post #126
run4yourlives2 wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That would probably cause a good deal of false alarms though.. people that aren't comfortable in water will have elevated heart rates every so often over normal stuff. Maybe that's not such a bad thing overall though.

My first thought was "Hey this is HN, and that's exactly what PCA is for!" Followed shortly thereafter by "I wonder where you get/how you generate a dataset of the vital signs of drowning children..."

>"I wonder where you get/how you generate a dataset of the vital signs of drowning children..."

panic attack data set will get you halfway there and panic attacks happen naturally and sufficiently frequently. Add the dataset from something like asthma attacks (unfortunately it is easy to obtain too).

Re: Show HN: Spot the Drowning Child

#177

Post by Nadya »

Kluny wrote: post #168
AlphaGeekZulu wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do not know for sure. My believe is, that kids at that age sometimes simply do not know what they are able to do or not. They watch others, as they climb down the ladder and they just imitate them, somehow expecting the same outcome. This boy for sure was not able to swim, but he probably didn't know it. He perfectly copied the behaviour of other people entering the pool and then was maybe completely stunned that h…

I don't understand why he didn't float? In my experience you bob to the top because of the buoyancy of air in your lungs - not above the water, but you at least float to the surface. Am I wrong?

One might not realize it, but many people who already know how to swim will take a breathe in while lowering themselves into water. When diving to do a cannonball the first thing many swimmers will do is take a deep breathe. Someone who doesn't swim might... not.

A child who doesn't know how to swim but is copying what they see others doing might be breathing as normal, have exhaled recently, and when they release the handles/ladder and enter the pool begin to sink. Not knowing how to swim and now head-under-water they are unable to get air into their lungs to have any amount of buoyancy.

Re: Show HN: Spot the Drowning Child

#178

Post by dimino »

atourgates wrote: post #150
dimino wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having had a similar experience (lifeguard/counselor), I never worried much about the kids at the lake. They had PFDs, they'll float. Swim tests were always my nightmare. That said, my bosses weren't huge assholes and didn't disappear kids regularly like yours sound like they did. We had drills, but you could tell by the demeanor of the director that it wasn't real.

I thought it was a really good practice, and didn't feel it was assholeish at all. It's not like having your camper stolen was unavoidable. If there's a lapse in your attention long enough that allows someone to walk up to one of your campers, explain to them what's going on and walk away with them, there's a lapse in your attention long enough for your camper to drown. You're signing up for your job with the primary…

I think it's a terrible practice, wholly ineffective, and neighboring on pathological to instill terror into your staff at the prospect of losing a child.

There are many better, more effective ways to ensure you're not going to lose a kid. We did things like count children before/after each activity, run drills at regular (not weekly) intervals, etc.

We also had games where kids were left to run in the forest for multiple hours unaccompanied (variations on capture the flag). The kids loved it, your kid would love it, and the counselors in charge of your kid wouldn't be obsessively paranoid about the exact location of your child at every single moment because that level of attention just isn't necessary.

Re: Show HN: Spot the Drowning Child

#179

Post by trhway »

janekm wrote: post #110
trhway wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

with regard to price i just googled randomly: http://www.amazon.com/Pulse-Oximeter-Blood-Oxygen-Monitor/dp...

Unfortunately that type would not work in a pool... they barely work with significant movement, never mind when there's water sloshing in and out between the LEDs / light sensors.

of course the googled above device wouldn't work as it is. It was only a random google just to gauge the scale of money such tech costs.

Re: Show HN: Spot the Drowning Child

#180

Post by facepalm »

irishcoffee wrote: post #30

I would like to point out that any flotation device in a pool besides a life jacket is just asking for problems. I life-guarded for almost 10 years, the only way I would ever let anything that supported a human floating __besides__ an approved life jacket was if the pool was almost empty (such that the one person got my undivided attention) and if I knew the child to already be a strong swimmer. I highly encourage ev…

I have already heard two kids claim they can swim, when later it turned out they can only swim with water wings.
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