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Chicago fires investigator who found cops at fault in shootings

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Re: Chicago fires investigator who found cops at fault in shootings

#61

Post by knodi123 »

happyscrappy wrote: post #18
rosser wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We tend not to hear about the thousands of airline flights a day that don't crash, either. That doesn't mean for a second that we should just shrug and resign ourselves plane crashes. And even that analogy is flawed, because it's unambiguous that at least some of these "bad cop" interactions involve deliberate malfeasance on the part of the cop . When was the last time the pilot intentionally crashed their plane? It…

>When was the last time the pilot intentionally crashed their plane? Germanwings not long ago.

bad rhetorical question, but valid point.

Re: Chicago fires investigator who found cops at fault in shootings

#62

Post by rquantz »

dragontamer wrote: post #33
rosser wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's "taking pride in your work", and there's "the thin blue line". One of those things is healthy. The other is emphatically not. It's left as an exercise for the reader to determine which is which.

Agreed. But then there are plenty of newbie (and even veteran) cops who don't understand the difference either. Keeping that in mind, and educating them of the viewpoint is more important than yelling at them or breaking them down.

If "pride" means doing childish things like the slowdown in New York last year, or apparently not investigating drive by shootings in Baltimore because the protesters hurt their feelings, then that pride needs to be ruthlessly rooted out and destroyed. We need cops who work for us – all of us – rather than for the FOP or PBA, and they need to understand that they have unconscious racial bias that needs to be counteracted.

If they don't believe those things, fire them and get cops who will do their jobs.

Re: Chicago fires investigator who found cops at fault in shootings

#63

Post by zo1 »

rosser wrote: post #43
slantyyz wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a non-American, I find it interesting how so many Americans (especially online commenters) refer to other Americans only as liberal/Democrat or conservative/Republican these days. Is America that polarized? Or, are the people with more complex views (i.e., having both liberal and conservative viewpoints) just less likely to speak out?

Yes, and yes. America is that polarized, and when people with more nuanced views speak up, they tend to get shouted down immediately by the "side" that sees some aspect of "the other side"'s views in the nuance, drowning them out in the noise. Want to make a nuanced point in a discussion about gun control? You're probably from Kenya, too. Want to make a subtle distinction in a debate about investment banks, or energy…

Or if you advocate more Libertarian principles/discussion, you're immediately told to "move to Somalia". Yes, I've gotten that one on HN even, IIRC.

Re: Chicago fires investigator who found cops at fault in shootings

#64

Post by rquantz »

vaadu wrote: post #13

This is why all officer involved shootings should be investigated and prosecuted(if necessary) by people with no skin in the game for any outcome.

Specifically, investigation of police should the purview of the Federal Justice Department.

Re: Chicago fires investigator who found cops at fault in shootings

#65

Post by digitalneal »

happyscrappy wrote: post #19
mingus68040 wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "Even though liberals will deny this..." This blanket assumption is probably why you're being down-voted. The easiest way to avoid this is by supporting your statements with as many facts as possible. A simple google search proved that this is not at all the case, for example, and that Republicans show much stronger support of police unions. http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/12/12/the-gop-and... This selec…

It will be very hard to pin the problems with Chicago on Republicans.

Are you saying Governors have no power over the cities that reside in their state?

From 1977 to 2003 Republicans were in control of Illinois executive office. 26 years in a row.

From 1972 to 1991, Jon Burge running the show as Chicago police commander.

Are you trying to say that Republican governors had no power to investigate/curtail the evil that was brewing under his leadership?

hehe.

Re: Chicago fires investigator who found cops at fault in shootings

#66

Post by backtoyoujim »

to wit from the article:

The performance evaluation covered 19 months and concluded that Davis “displays a complete lack of objectivity combined with a clear bias against the police in spite of his own lengthy police career.”

That is a serpent choking down its own tail.

Re: Chicago fires investigator who found cops at fault in shootings

#67

Post by rosser »

zo1 wrote: post #63
rosser wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, and yes. America is that polarized, and when people with more nuanced views speak up, they tend to get shouted down immediately by the "side" that sees some aspect of "the other side"'s views in the nuance, drowning them out in the noise. Want to make a nuanced point in a discussion about gun control? You're probably from Kenya, too. Want to make a subtle distinction in a debate about investment banks, or energy…

Or if you advocate more Libertarian principles/discussion, you're immediately told to "move to Somalia". Yes, I've gotten that one on HN even, IIRC.

I guess it depends on exactly how "Libertarian" a view one is espousing.

"Why should I have to pay for a fire department? My house isn't on fire!" Yeah, that guy needs to move to Somalia. Not so he can experience what that degree of government-free state is actually like, but rather so the rest of us don't have to put up with that kind of idiocy.

Re: Chicago fires investigator who found cops at fault in shootings

#68

Post by maxxxxx »

slantyyz wrote: post #35
drzaiusapelord wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is Chicago, we really have no republicans in power. The downvotes are just knee-jerk stupidity because the MSM doesn't report much on union abuse and unions largely get a free pass in the US for political reasons. Democrats won't go after them as they more or less pay for Democratic campaigns.

As a non-American, I find it interesting how so many Americans (especially online commenters) refer to other Americans only as liberal/Democrat or conservative/Republican these days. Is America that polarized? Or, are the people with more complex views (i.e., having both liberal and conservative viewpoints) just less likely to speak out?

As non-american leaving here for 15 years now I think that Americans like binary options. Good/evil, democrat/republican, socialist/capitalist.

Often the media enforces that.

Re: Chicago fires investigator who found cops at fault in shootings

#69

Post by sixothree »

drzaiusapelord wrote: post #20
mingus68040 wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "Even though liberals will deny this..." This blanket assumption is probably why you're being down-voted. The easiest way to avoid this is by supporting your statements with as many facts as possible. A simple google search proved that this is not at all the case, for example, and that Republicans show much stronger support of police unions. http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/12/12/the-gop-and... This selec…

This is Chicago, we really have no republicans in power. The downvotes are just knee-jerk stupidity because the MSM doesn't report much on union abuse and unions largely get a free pass in the US for political reasons. Democrats won't go after them as they more or less pay for Democratic campaigns.

Please just stop acting like a jerk. These sorts of problems exist in many jurisdictions spanning all sorts of political boundaries.

Re: Chicago fires investigator who found cops at fault in shootings

#70

Post by afarrell »

mikeash wrote: post #57
dragontamer wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its more like they serve a critical role in cities. There's been a drive-by shooting in Baltimore a few weeks ago, but Officer Morale (from the protests / etc. etc.) is so low that none of the officers wanted to do anything about it. Anthony Batts was fired for it, but a change in leadership doesn't change the fundamental morale problem going on with the Baltimore City Police Department.

The fact that they serve a critical role is why I suggest that the response for the case when police all have excessively delicate feelings would be to fire them all and find new ones , not just fire them all and leave the police department empty. Officer morale in Baltimore is so low that nobody wanted to respond to a drive-by shooting? Anywhere else, if your morale is so low that you don't feel like doing your job,…

> fire them all and find new ones

What recruiting pool do you imagine we get new officers from? And how do you imagine that having a force completely made of inexperienced cops will improve things?

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