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The real scars of Korean gaming

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41–50 of 107 posts

Re: The real scars of Korean gaming

#41
post #3

With Dota 2 sitting at an $11,000,000 prize pool, it's a little shocking that there isn't more structure and regulation in a massive sporting event like this. Given the development of LoL in Korea and Dota in China (Along with CS:GO and others), an international esports comittee is something desperately needed for increasing player salaries, and driving up viewership.

Regulation which would kill the little fun left?

Re: The real scars of Korean gaming

#42
post #26

I wonder why real-time-strategy (RTS) is dead outside of the StarCraft 2 e-sport niche. RTS used to be the best selling game category around 2000.

To add to what the other guys here said (EA and stuff) I would add lack of RTS games on consoles and FPS taking over those platforms

I remember there were plenty of RTS games for the Genesis and SNES, but by the time of the PS2 hardly any strategy games launched on consoles.

PC-only titles are scarce these days because profitability is too low to justify an AAA budget

Re: The real scars of Korean gaming

#43
post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would suggest a footballer needing surgery is "too far". The purpose of sports is to provide a framework that motivates healthy exercise. Once it gets to the point where it's frequently causing harm rather than benefit to the participants, the purpose has been lost along with any reason society should consider the activity normal or tolerable.

... I'm pretty sure that is not the purpose of sports. The purpose from my perspective is: Advertising, Gambling, and entertainment. Since when has it been at all about exercise? Defensive Linesmen are hardly a "healthy exercise" motivation. Sports that have little to do with exercise: - Racing (Horse, car, hound) - Chess - MMA (While they are super fit, it isn't "healthy") - Boxing - Bowling - Sumo (nothing healthy…

Boxing, Football/Soccer, Rugby (which was the precursor to American Football), and so on, were all codified and set up as formal sports to fulfill explicitly moral/social/physical purposes. And for a long time, they had rules banning professional participation, in an attempt to avoid the sort of problem's we're discussing, and protect the sport's role within society.

Re: The real scars of Korean gaming

#44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>"who are subject to the same amount of physical and mental stress and grueling 12 hour practices while making welfare wages. " They aren't subject to anything. They choose.

While true, it's not adults getting into pro-gaming, it's usually teenagers. Kids who would rather play Starcraft than study, and, despite being very good, lack the foresight of knowing what kind of hole they're digging themselves into.

I can show you a lot of teenagers doing the same but playing football(soccer), less hours at least, and even pushed by their parents with the hope that some of them will be the next Messi, Xavi or Ronaldo.

Re: The real scars of Korean gaming

#45
post #11
post #2

Sometimes you pay a price to be able to do the things you love. However, the plight isn't necessarily with Lee Young Ho (aka "FlaSh"), who was winning $50,000 tournaments multiple times a year while on a 200-300k per year salary (I stopped following after the end of professional Brood War, not sure what it's like now). The plight lies with those who aren't among the top 1% in their already elite field who are subject…

I spent four years of my life dedicated to StarCraft. I made GM several seasons on NA ladder. I made GM on Korean ladder for one season. I played many top tier players, and I beat them. Repeatedly. Then I decided to invest in flying myself down to Dreamhack. All the people I played online and beat about 50% of the time and made connections with, I lost to every single time. There's many like me, top tier players but…

I've had a similar experience, except it was with the Tekken series fighting games. At one point I was ranked in the top 20 in NA. I had a few chances over the years to play the top 5 in NA, and #3 from Korea.

The difference in skill level as you go from #20 down to #1 can be huge. I would have 50% chance against one of the other top 20, but that would go to maybe 5% against someone in the top 5, 1% against #1, and 0% against the Korean #3. I think I beat him one round ever.

I'm not sure I'd want to be #1. There is a point of diminishing returns when the game is no longer fun but work.

Re: The real scars of Korean gaming

#46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree, in my opinion there are more productive and 'healthy' uses of ones time. But, my opinion doesn't mean anything. Forcing/coercing kids into doing what you think is best for them is not productive either.

Making choices for children, who are otherwise too immature, is the whole point of parenting. Of course, you can "coerce" them, or you can "guide" them, but then we are talking about different means for the same end goal. And then we can talk about parents that are too busy or uninterested to give a fuck and it's precisely in such families that you see children being allowed to play computer games for hours on end. I…

My comment was not from the perspective of a parent.

Re: The real scars of Korean gaming

#47

It is still incredible to watch the Starcraft Brood War games played by FlaSh: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CLSlqG9f4AQ

I often forget just how good BW was to watch. I used to stay up all night watching ProLeague on some Korean stream, way before Twitch was a thing.

SC2 killed it though, but it was just never anywhere near as entertaining to watch.

Re: The real scars of Korean gaming

#48
post #26

I wonder why real-time-strategy (RTS) is dead outside of the StarCraft 2 e-sport niche. RTS used to be the best selling game category around 2000.

To add to what the other guys here said (EA and stuff) I would add lack of RTS games on consoles and FPS taking over those platforms I remember there were plenty of RTS games for the Genesis and SNES, but by the time of the PS2 hardly any strategy games launched on consoles. PC-only titles are scarce these days because profitability is too low to justify an AAA budget

This is misleading. The most popular competitive games: League of Legends, Dota 2, CSGO, and SC2, are all PC exclusives. The problem with RTS games isn't that they don't work on consoles, it's that they aren't that fun to play for most people. It takes a long to play a single game, and there's no progression.

With the push to make strategy games more like RPGs (heck look at all of the FPS games with "loadouts" and RPG elements), games like League and Dota really work much better, and have more people playing them than any other game ever. For example, more people played league of legends yesterday[1] than have bought the last CoD game since November[2].

Obviously only taking league into account kind of breaks everything, because it's the most popular anything that has ever existed, but I'm not sure how people don't understand that the PC gaming market is much larger than the console gaming market[3].

[1] http://www.forbes.com/sites/insertcoin/2014/01/27/riots-leag...

[2] http://www.vgchartz.com/gamedb/?name=advanced+warfare

[3] http://www.forbes.com/sites/marcochiappetta/2014/07/14/the-c...

Re: The real scars of Korean gaming

#49
For context, Flash, with the large scar on his arm had an elo rating in brood war that may have made him the best player of any game -ever-. I think I've seen it noted somewhere that his highest elo was higher than even famous chess grandmasters.

This implies that after over a decade of hardcore professional broodwar around the world, he was more dominant at his peak than anyone else has ever been in a game with elo ratings.

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