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Ross Ulbricht Sentenced to Life in Prison

nytimes.com

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Re: Ross Ulbricht Sentenced to Life in Prison

#541

Post by rascul »

timsally wrote: post #367
homulilly wrote: post #346

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cars and guns also hurt people but pretty much anyone can sell those. I agree that drug sales should be regulated but that doesn't in any way make sentencing someone to life in prison for running a website any less fucked up.

> Cars and guns also hurt people but pretty much anyone can sell those. The following applies only to the US. Since 1968 you need a license granted by the federal government to sell guns ( https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/who-can-obtain-federal-firea... ). The law allowing you to carry a firearm was passed in 1791. Driver's licenses have been around since 1899. You can't sell a car to someone without one. When thinkin…

> Driver's licenses have been around since 1899. You can't sell a car to someone without one.

You most certainly can. And it's completely legal. Driver's licenses have nothing to do with buying and selling vehicles. Some (all?) dealers might not do it, but there's other reasons besides legality for them to worry about.

Re: Ross Ulbricht Sentenced to Life in Prison

#542

Post by SixSigma »

jensen123 wrote: post #516
civilian wrote: post #310

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Licensed & regulated dealers (aka pharmacies) would be great. In regards to the harm from drugs-- I'd add the obvious point that prohibition comes with a really high cost. I recently did dry-january and I was really happy with the results of cutting back on my drinking. I wake up more rested, and had more energy in the evenings. I've been thinking that going totally dry might be a good thing to do in my life. But wou…

> Why does the general public consider drug prohibition to be that much different than alcohol prohibition?? The average IQ of most western countries, including the US, is around 100. That's probably significantly lower than the average reader here on Hacker News. I'm not sure if a person with an IQ of 100 ever asks themselves intelligent questions like yours...

That the average is 100 should come as no surprise, seeing as IQ is defined so that the median score of tests on the population is 100.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intelligence_quotient

Re: Ross Ulbricht Sentenced to Life in Prison

#543

Post by peterwoo »

Nadya wrote: post #320
Rhapshe wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, I'm glad you're convinced, because I'm certainly not nor does it appear that the judge was either. "Forrest rejected arguments that Silk Road had reduced harm among drug users by taking illegal activities off the street. “No drug dealer from the Bronx has ever made this argument to the court. It’s a privileged argument and it’s an argument made by one of the privileged,” she said"

No drug dealer from the Bronx was reviewed by buyers for all to see before making a deal with them. Arguably, a dealer from the Bronx would be on the streets so couldn't make that defense in the first place... so the comparison doesn't hold up. >It’s a privileged argument and it’s an argument made by one of the privileged I'm unsure what this is even supposed to mean. I tried searching for a definition of "privileged…

More quotes from the Judge on this issue:

>“Silk Road created [users] who hadn’t tried drugs before,” Forrest said, adding that Silk Road “expands the market” and places demand on drug-producing (and violent) areas in Afghanistan and Mexico that grow the poppies used for heroin.

>“The idea that it is harm-reducing is so narrow, and aimed at such a privileged group of people who are using drugs in the privacy of their own homes using their personal internet connections”, she said.

Through its drug market Silk Road incentivized (horrific) drug violence across the US and other countries. The best you could say is that they had no effect on it.

The privilege criticism is that Ulbricht wants leniency despite the overall harm reduction being marginal. It might have been safer for him and for the dealers, but not significantly for any other group.

Re: Ross Ulbricht Sentenced to Life in Prison

#544

Post by ChrisLomont »

indrax wrote: post #488
tptacek wrote: post #391

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You forgot the part where he wanted Curtis Green dead because of a theft of --- not sure why I need to read past this point.

Odd that laws allow for killing to prevent a robbery, but taking a life as punishment is unthinkable. I wonder: If the money had been gained legally then stolen, what steps could the victim legally take to recover it?

What law allows killing to prevent a robbery? I think you're mistaken. Some places allow using lethal force when your own life is threatened. I am not aware of any place in the US where one is justified in killing merely to prevent a robbery.

And if there is, can you show me a law in the US where a citizen can go after a robber long after the robbery is over and then kill them?

I think not.

Re: Ross Ulbricht Sentenced to Life in Prison

#545

Post by 7952 »

smhenderson wrote: post #13

That seems way too harsh to me. I have strong opinions on the US War on Drugs and it's failure to meaningful deal with drug use/abuse in the USA. And I feel even worse about how it's spilling out into the rest of the world as we go "global" with everything. I can't say I know every detail of the case but I don't recall anyone getting killed or even hurt by Mr. Ulbricht so in my mind the punishment does not fit the cr…

Surely drug traffickers in the USA are complicit with the US Government? They respond to one injustice (victimisation of users) by inflicting another injustice (drug cartel violence). They exploit the law to further their own interests at the expense of innocent bystanders. Yet you act like this guy is some activist who has never hurt anyone!

Re: Ross Ulbricht Sentenced to Life in Prison

#546

Post by jmkni »

caseysoftware wrote: post #421

I think it's great that his LinkedIn page is still online.

So it is! You would think the first thing he would have done given access to the internet would be to take it down.

Kind of suggests he hasn't even been online since the day he was arrested, crazy!

Re: Ross Ulbricht Sentenced to Life in Prison

#548

Post by latiera »

drcode wrote: post #32
smhenderson wrote: post #13

That seems way too harsh to me. I have strong opinions on the US War on Drugs and it's failure to meaningful deal with drug use/abuse in the USA. And I feel even worse about how it's spilling out into the rest of the world as we go "global" with everything. I can't say I know every detail of the case but I don't recall anyone getting killed or even hurt by Mr. Ulbricht so in my mind the punishment does not fit the cr…

You have to understand that the "murder for hire" evidence was introduced as part of the trial (at which point Ross' lawyer could have disputed it, but didn't) so it could be used as part of the sentencing decision... and that kind of takes the luster off of the "non-violent crime" argument.

Takes the luster off?

Nobody died so how is he a murderer? I swear the amount of stupidity written on the matter defies belief. People are unable to think critically and be objective. Disregarding the facts that: He wasn't charged/convicted of murdering anyone He wasn't charged/convicted of attempting to murder anyone The supposed "hitmen" were law enforcement agents, entrapment anyone?

Ulbricht got life without parole for selling some mushrooms and running a fucking forum. Guess what the HSBC scum who laundered hundreds of millions for drug cartels got: A huge fucking paycheck and nice fat bonus.

There is no justice in this country.

Re: Ross Ulbricht Sentenced to Life in Prison

#549

Post by rorykoehler »

tracker1 wrote: post #539
rat87 wrote: post #525

Earlier quoted context omitted.

May I reccomend http://www.reddit.com/r/iamverysmart/top/ to you? Also you're assuming some sort of strong correlation between IQ or some other measure of intelligence and good political judgement.

I was recently in a conversation where it was pointed out that my rather cold analytic nature when it comes to these kinds of things puts me at odds with more emotionally driven decisions. Even without agreeing, I can see the point. That said, in my mind short of violent action, I find it hard to see how having to serve more than two decades in prison is any kind of justice for any kind of non-violent crime. I also f…

There is no justice in this sentencing. The sentence is to set an example (words of the judge) which by it's very definition is unjust. Regardless of what you think of the laws relating to this case everyone deserves the same treatment under the law.

Re: Ross Ulbricht Sentenced to Life in Prison

#550

Post by mpyne »

diyorgasms wrote: post #481
mpyne wrote: post #336

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's amazing to me how people can be pointed to literally where in a charging document you can find where the government actually included murder-for-hire as part of the charges against Ulbricht and yet "people here" can still manage to avoid seeing it...

Except presumption of innocence is supposed to be a cornerstone of the american justice system. Until that he hired a killer is proven in a criminal court, we all ought to refrain from making the assumption that such accusations in any way reflect the truth of the matter.

His complicity in murder-for-hire was part of Count One of the indictment. The jury convicted him on all Counts.

Ergo, his involvement in murder-for-hire has been proven in a criminal court, and I will feel free to repeat that fact ad nauseum.

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