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Microsoft Launches Visual Studio Code, a Free Cross-Platform Code Editor

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Re: Microsoft Launches Visual Studio Code, a Free Cross-Platform Code Editor

#551

Post by cm2187 »

brudgers wrote: post #541
cm2187 wrote: post #534

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't need more than a few seconds to find that the contextual menu at the bottom of the screen was absurd. Being frustrated with it means I would try to avoid using it, go around that problem. The solution Microsoft advocated for desktop: use keyboard shortcuts! I do not dispute that keyboard shortcuts are faster than any mouse based UI. And I am sure that you became more proficient having to go around the Win 8 h…

Consumers are not the primary target for Windows. Never has been. Microsoft is primarily a B2B company. That's why they have long support cycles. That's why they make Excel. That's why they make Visual Studio...and languages and frameworks and SQL Server and Windows Server and Exchange etc etc. Picking tools based on first impressions, is in my opinion, a suboptimal strategy. YMMV.

They are getting cornered into a corporate environment. But they used to dominate the consumer market, and windows 8 was precisely designed to reconquer this lost market share.

Re: Microsoft Launches Visual Studio Code, a Free Cross-Platform Code Editor

#553

Post by jordz »

AdamTReineke wrote: post #376
MCRed wrote: post #351

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Electron Shell was previously known as the Atom Shell. So part of it is Atom work.

Fair point. I wanted to clarify the difference since "built on Atom" has a different meaning to me than "using the GitHub Electron shell". The first sounds like an extension to Atom and the second sounds like a whole new app.

They started work on this before the Atom Shell was "Electron" and speaking to the team in Zurich before this was unveiled (about 3 months ago) they mentioned this was built on top of Atoms foundations. There is an Atom binary inside the package app and this is where my comment came from (:

Re: Microsoft Launches Visual Studio Code, a Free Cross-Platform Code Editor

#554

Post by stdgy »

Joe4evr wrote: post #498
stdgy wrote: post #396

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honest question, not snark: Who are some big C# developers that create major applications consumers (Not enterprises) use everyday? You mentioned the paucity of major OSX/iOS developers, but I'm not sure the case isn't the same for C#/.NET.

Supergiant Games (Bastion and Transistor) and Squad (Kerbal Space Program), to name a couple. And all the StackExchange sites are made on ASP.NET, if you want to count that too.

The Unity-oriented stuff are good examples. The Stack Exchange sites came to my mind as well, though I was hesitant to count web apps.

Re: Microsoft Launches Visual Studio Code, a Free Cross-Platform Code Editor

#555

Post by ghshephard »

StillBored wrote: post #522
ghshephard wrote: post #464

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple could not care less about that $99 fee. It is 100% immaterial to them beyond the function that it is attempting to server - act as a minimum bar of entry to the developer program.

The $99 isn't the barrier, owning a recent mac decent enough to develop on is the real barrier.

Exactly my point - the $99 isn't a financial barrier, but, your average user isn't going to pay it each year, so it creates a minimum barrier between "Users" and "Developers" to provide Apple with some insight into how many developers they have.

Advance access to IOS kind of messed that up, (at lot of people paid the developer fee to access the next operating system) which is why application to the WWDC lottery is probably a better estimate of developer count.

Re: Microsoft Launches Visual Studio Code, a Free Cross-Platform Code Editor

#556

Post by beagle3 »

brudgers wrote: post #518
cm2187 wrote: post #461

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it is more problematic than that. It takes only a few minutes of using Windows 8 on a desktop to realise it was a terrible idea. Like when you right click and the context menu appears at the bottom of the screen. They clearly haven't tried that with a mouse on a 4k monitor. They reversed most of these moronic design decisions in 8.1 and the 10 preview, but they kept some (hopefully they will be fixed before t…

Evaluating a user interface in a few minutes makes sense for things which will be used for a few minutes...and for journalists in need of sensational headlines under deadlines. An operating system is complex and used over a long period of time. Using Windows 8 meant I had to learn something. It took a day or two to become effective. A few months to become more effective than I had been under Windows 7, and a while be…

> It took a day or two to become effective. A few months to become more effective than I had been under Windows 7, and a while before I really started to get it.

I've been using Win8 for about 1 hour/day for the last few months. The flips between Metro and Desktop still drive me crazy. You might have learned to accept that, or to avoid those flips, but this schizoid mode of operation comes with unneeded cognitive overload for desktop work, even if you did master it.

The thing is, Win8 was optimized for Microsoft's benefit, not yours. Win8.1 gave up some of those things, because (a) it didn't provide the benefit it was optimized for -- windows phone acceptance, and (b) it did alienate a significant portion of the userbase that clang hard to their Win7.

"Using 8 meant you had to learn something", yes. But for what purpose?

Re: Microsoft Launches Visual Studio Code, a Free Cross-Platform Code Editor

#557

Post by the_why_of_y »

mreiland wrote: post #414
veidr wrote: post #400

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I think is " obvious to those who are not unduly biased " is that he was cherrypicking the most extreme example (the restrictive GPL license, which is not used by most open source software[1]), and then trying to use that to spraypaint FUD over the (much) broader open source concept as a whole. "Open source is not available to commercial companies" is about as factually incorrect as any statement in the English…

weird how the GPL shows up as the most popular license by having double the marketshare of number 2. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyleft#Viral_licensing " Craig Mundie remarked, "This viral aspect of the GPL poses a threat to the intellectual property of any organization making use of it."[35] In another context, Steve Ballmer declared that code released under GPL is useless to the commercial sector (since it can o…

If any of that FUD were true, how do you explain that Microsoft has been shipping the "Subsystem for UNIX-based Applications" add-on for Windows Server for a decade, while Ballmer was CEO?

https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/cc771470.aspx https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Services_for_UNIX

It includes GPL-licensed programs such as GCC and GDB; shouldn't Microsoft have released the source code of Windows Server by now if these statements weren't anything but FUD?

Re: Microsoft Launches Visual Studio Code, a Free Cross-Platform Code Editor

#558

Post by randallsquared »

MrGando wrote: post #544
notsony wrote: post #330

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Panic and OmniGroup were big 10 years ago. The fact that nobody has appeared on the scene, innovated and become a name that you or I can quote is quite telling. Where is the new blood? I personally know many long-time Mac developers who have sold their products to others to maintain, or have quietly slipped away and let sales slide. The 30% fee is not an industry standard that was debated and researched and rationali…

You are generalizing too much. Panic big 10 years ago? Coda came out in 2007, and it was pretty big for a while. So omnigroup is no longer a thing? They are alive and kicking. I agree that they both had faced problems with the Apple Sandboxing scheme, but I guess they'll overcome those issues (even by being out of the App Store). What about Sketch, AgileBits, Alfred? I know many long time devs who are still doing it…

Coda? Coda is just Panic's new thing. They used to make the main file transfer application on Mac, Transmit, which was originally developed for classic Mac OS.

Re: Microsoft Launches Visual Studio Code, a Free Cross-Platform Code Editor

#559

Post by MrGando »

randallsquared wrote: post #558
MrGando wrote: post #544

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are generalizing too much. Panic big 10 years ago? Coda came out in 2007, and it was pretty big for a while. So omnigroup is no longer a thing? They are alive and kicking. I agree that they both had faced problems with the Apple Sandboxing scheme, but I guess they'll overcome those issues (even by being out of the App Store). What about Sketch, AgileBits, Alfred? I know many long time devs who are still doing it…

Coda? Coda is just Panic's new thing. They used to make the main file transfer application on Mac, Transmit, which was originally developed for classic Mac OS.

And before that they made Audion for Mac OS Classic (audio app that I used a lot).

What's the point here? :)

Re: Microsoft Launches Visual Studio Code, a Free Cross-Platform Code Editor

#560

Post by randallsquared »

MrGando wrote: post #559
randallsquared wrote: post #558

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Coda? Coda is just Panic's new thing. They used to make the main file transfer application on Mac, Transmit, which was originally developed for classic Mac OS.

And before that they made Audion for Mac OS Classic (audio app that I used a lot). What's the point here? :)

My point was that they were already stuggling to retain mindshare when Coda was released. They went from being a well-known fish in a small pond to being an average fish in a great lake, so their relative importance has certainly been declining from ten years ago.
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