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$149 Chromebooks

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Re: $149 Chromebooks

#371

Post by pgeorgi »

Sanddancer wrote: post #170
na85 wrote: post #11

I'd definitely consider using a Chromebook if the offline functionality works. My understanding from people I know working at Google is that the offline Docs and Gmail experience is pretty sub-par at the moment. I guess if you pop out their SSD for a larger one it'd make a decent BSD netbook. Bitrig[0] is slowly but surely getting better. [0] https://www.bitrig.org/

Even then, you'll probably have a pain in the butt time. It uses coreboot to startup, and the coreboot devs don't seem to care about any OS that isn't Linux, so you have to go through a somewhat painful process to get to the point where you can install a BSD.

(wearing my coreboot developer hat): We care about BSD. And Windows. And Solaris, Haiku, and whatever else comes our way that runs after coreboot. The amount of care varies with developers, and Linux is indeed the OS that sees the most interest.

If BSD fails with coreboot + SeaBIOS, that's a bug, and I'd love to hear about it. And I think so would the SeaBIOS developer and the QEmu people who use the same PCBIOS implementation.

Re: $149 Chromebooks

#372

Post by pgeorgi »

jolan wrote: post #191
green7ea wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes you can but it's not a straightforward process. I did it for my chromebox which follows the same procedure as doing it for a chromebook. Basically you have to open the machine and remove a screw to enable write access to the bios. After that you have to replace the coreboot bios that came with the computer with a newer coreboot version and install SeaBios (old bios emulation on top of coreboot) as a payload. You…

These are ARM Chromebooks though so there is no conventional bios to flash. They have u-boot with support for booting external media turned off so all you need to do is turn that on and make bootable media. http://archlinuxarm.org/platforms/armv7/samsung/samsung-chro...

Recent ARM Chromebooks also come with coreboot.

Re: $149 Chromebooks

#373

Post by chetanahuja »

gcb0 wrote: post #173
TheTaO wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is a colossal, market-moving play from Google. Is it that or is it just an effort to stay relevant? If you can get a laptop/tablet that can do the same thing that this Chromebook does and has a full OS for a few bucks more, would you do it? There are tons of tablets from HP/Dell that cost 100-200$ and run full windows OS and have comparable specs to the Chromebooks. As far as I know they are selling quite well…

exactly. in the US they also launched with the mobile association. leading them to be mostly ignored by everyone. the only time i heard about chromebooks in the wild was while walking at low income are shopping malls. the Cricket and att stores would often have a little banner on the floor advertising the "cheap kinda of a computer!"

"ignored by everyone"

Heh... wonder what your definition of "everyone" is. Another comment posted above points to data that chromebooks are forming 14% of PC sales in the US. From my personal experience, the local highschool and middle school where I live have basically mandated that each student buy a chromebook -- they don't say chromebook exactly but heavily, strongly suggest it for the low price and maintenance factors. 90+% of the students are carrying around lightweight chromebooks in their backpacks now.

Re: $149 Chromebooks

#374

Post by jorgearturo »

noteloop wrote: post #307
nightpool wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually, I upvoted this, but on reflection I think this is wrong. Here's why: - Most Chromebooks are freely bootloader unlocked, allowing any operating system to be loaded on them. - ChromeOS follows the same open source model as Chrome—Most core features open, with things like Flash/Wildvine/API keys held secret. - There are no native apps on ChromeOS—the correct question is not "Can Mozilla write a browser for Chr…

> There are no native apps on ChromeOS This is not correct, you can run native apps for Chrome OS via Native Client (NaCL) or App Runtime for Chrome (ARC). VLC, a poster child for native apps, will be released for Chrome OS in a few months using ARC. Anandtech has already tested a beta version: http://www.anandtech.com/show/9082/the-chromebook-pixel-2015...

> Anandtech has already tested a beta version

It's an interesting experiment but I don't think Google is aiming to please the crowd with the need for "native apps" anyways and they wouldn't be terribly interested in keeping the native VLC dependencies alive and/or compatible. It seems pretty obvious to me that Google is trying to push the mainstream consumer market into a "cloud computing/services lifestyle", it only makes sense because their whole business model revolves around web users. So VLC is out, Netflix/Playstore is in.

Not for me, don't get me wrong, I'm not that kind of consumer and it may be safe to state that most people within the HN crowd isn't either. I'm personally following and waiting for the Novena[1] laptop and open hardware to be launched.

Even if chromeOS is removed and Gnu/Linux is loaded instead, chromebooks' keyboards look abysmally ugly and useless to me, otherwise I would at least be excited about the inexpensive hardware.

So yeah, as a consumer I can distill my opinion about this product to "meh...", but as a web developer though, that's a different story, the possibility of Google hardware converting handheld mobile users to desktop-ish mobile users and reaching a broader international audience makes me almost enthusiastic about Chromebooks.

After all, until some potentially better hardware project (Firefox OS [2] or Indie Phone [3], who knows) expands to the netbook-ish form factor ("Lapfox"?/"Indiebook"?), the not-so-open inexpensive Chromebook hardware & affordable by hundreds of millions (potentially billions, we'll see) introduces and welcomes new demographics to the web and is better for the world (in the short run) than almost-fully-open expensive hardware that only a few million can afford (for now), don't you think?

[1]: https://www.crowdsupply.com/kosagi/novena-open-laptop

[2]: https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/os/

[3]: https://ind.ie/about/

Re: $149 Chromebooks

#375

Post by sireat »

nightpool wrote: post #222
ntakasaki wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's sad to see folks celebrating computing devices that are more extremely locked down than even the iDevices. A Windows PC/laptop is much more open than a Chromebook. Can Mozilla even make a Firefox browser for ChromeOS? Only Google can make system and native apps, unlike the iDevices where you can access most of the native functionality even if you have to go through Apple's approval and you're not forced to uploa…

Actually, I upvoted this, but on reflection I think this is wrong. Here's why: - Most Chromebooks are freely bootloader unlocked, allowing any operating system to be loaded on them. - ChromeOS follows the same open source model as Chrome—Most core features open, with things like Flash/Wildvine/API keys held secret. - There are no native apps on ChromeOS—the correct question is not "Can Mozilla write a browser for Chr…

Which Chromebooks are freely bootloader unlocked?

I am asking because it was a major pain to get Lubuntu installed on Acer C720, Windows is not an option at all.

Chromebooks feel extremely locked down I'd say close to iDevices.

Re: $149 Chromebooks

#376

Post by jrockway »

Scarbutt wrote: post #356
jrockway wrote: post #351

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apps running in a window can capture whatever keys they want. So Control-W is interpreted by your shell/app, not by the browser (closing the window). In a tab the browser keybindings still exist, so be sure to set "open in new window" by right-clicking the app before running. Terminal settings are configurable and persistent. You can have as many windows open as you like. Here's the app: https://chrome.google.com/web…

cool, I think I'm getting one, one last question :) you said it is your main workstation, I'm guessing you are an external monitor, how well does external monitors work?

I actually use a Chromebox: http://promos.asus.com/us/chrome-os/chromebox/

I have the i7 model at work and an i3 model at home. Both are fast. I also have a Chromebook Pixel for situations that require a laptop.

As for monitors, both the desktops and laptops handle my 4k monitor OK, but only at 30Hz (because it's a Displayport MST model which are horrible hacks and are thankfully no longer made). At work I use a 24" and 30" monitor. Works as expected.

You can tune the density per-monitor, so you can run your 4k monitor at 1.25x or 2x density and your normal monitor at 1x density and it Just Works.

It's a pretty nice OS.

Re: $149 Chromebooks

#377

Post by 72deluxe »

wstrange wrote: post #322
VikingCoder wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What was she trying to do? For me, it's the camera-printer link that keeps messing me up.

A google cloud print enabled printer solves the printing issue.

The Google printer "solution" has always struck me as an exceedingly stupid solution. I have a local microcomputer, and a local printer yet the solution is to send my data to the other side of the world and then push it back on to the printer I am stood looking at? Why? It's stupid. Why not talk directly to the printer without the requirement of an Internet connection?

The same goes for sending files via Dropbox to someone next to you on an iDevice. Since it's very difficult for me to send data from my Android device to my wife's iPad or even from my MacBook to my wife's iPad3, the "solution" is to send it to the other side of the world on to Dropbox's servers for her to retrieve it.

Back in thte 50s when people had visions of an interconnected world and a utopian human future, filled with spaceflight and wonder, I am pretty sure they didn't have visions of needlessly sending data through 50+ network nodes just to get it back again on a device right next to them.

It's so stupid; if you had proposed this "solution" 20 years ago they'd have laughed you out of the room, yet today Chromebooks ("store all of YOUR data ELSEWHERE! Struggle to get it back! Find it impossible to send to a device NEXT TO YOU!") and the associated cloud solutions are all the rage.

It's stupid.

Re: $149 Chromebooks

#378

Post by michaelt »

nightpool wrote: post #222
ntakasaki wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's sad to see folks celebrating computing devices that are more extremely locked down than even the iDevices. A Windows PC/laptop is much more open than a Chromebook. Can Mozilla even make a Firefox browser for ChromeOS? Only Google can make system and native apps, unlike the iDevices where you can access most of the native functionality even if you have to go through Apple's approval and you're not forced to uploa…

Actually, I upvoted this, but on reflection I think this is wrong. Here's why: - Most Chromebooks are freely bootloader unlocked, allowing any operating system to be loaded on them. - ChromeOS follows the same open source model as Chrome—Most core features open, with things like Flash/Wildvine/API keys held secret. - There are no native apps on ChromeOS—the correct question is not "Can Mozilla write a browser for Chr…

  There are no native apps on ChromeOS—the correct question
  is not "Can Mozilla write a browser for ChromeOS"
Ah, so we're back to "the browser and the OS are inextricably linked, so the browser can't be replaced with a competing product" ?

It's just like the old days!

Re: $149 Chromebooks

#379

Post by 72deluxe »

mariusmg wrote: post #102
jdietrich wrote: post #94

This is a colossal, market-moving play from Google. Look at the brand names. TRUE, XOLO, Nexian. Recognise them? Consumers in Thailand, India and Indonesia do - they are local smartphone brands. Look at the promo video. Notice how many Asian faces there are? This isn't about cheap Chromebooks, it's about a major strategic effort to court the global middle class. As with the Android One initiative, Google are seeking…

The middle class can afford to pluck down a few more bucks and get a device with a real OS...

Yes, it makes me wonder how many people buy a Chromebook and state "never again!". It's like being given an etchasketch as a computer to do "real" work on but with the iron filings only accessible when with a tethering plan.

With all the talk of schools mandating that children have equivalent devices, what was wrong with writing on paper and doing maths on paper? We managed at school.

Re: $149 Chromebooks

#380

Post by aikah »

Nursie wrote: post #261
pjmlp wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually that was a USA only phenomenon, I never saw Chromebooks live in Europe. Here in Germany, some chain stores do have a few of them at their little corner being ignored by everyone.

Pretty sure Chromebooks dominated amazon.co.uk for a while too...

> Pretty sure Chromebooks dominated amazon.co.uk for a while too...

Pretty sure it didn't.

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