Netflix, Amazon and Hulu No Longer Find Themselves Upstarts in Online Streaming • Hacker News Board

Re: Netflix, Amazon and Hulu No Longer Find Themselves Upstarts in Online Streaming

#31

Post by ghaff » Wed, Mar 25, 2015, 4:29 PM UTC

aaviran wrote: post #2

As a consumer, I don't like the direction where streaming services are headed - many small services with limited content (original or not). I've been a Netflix customer for years now (I also had Hulu Plus, cancelled it due to their then-horrendous interface). While in the past I was very impressed with Netflix's selection, I now find it... meh, despite all the original content. When I pay Netflix, it's not for one, t…

On the one hand, we do seem to be headed into a pretty fragmented market. On the other hand, if you're willing to cut the cord or at least switch to a bare-bones cable subscription with just the basic channels and no HD, that leaves you with a pretty sizable budget for streaming services and content purchases compared to a typical expanded channel lineup cable subscription. Of course that may mean limited access to certain types of content--live broadcasts in particular--especially if you don't get OTA. And it makes for a rather fragmented user experience. But it will probably actually be cheaper than a standard cable subscription, at least for now.

I'm very close to doing this but then I watch very little sports or other live events.

Re: Netflix, Amazon and Hulu No Longer Find Themselves Upstarts in Online Streaming

#32

Post by hanley » Wed, Mar 25, 2015, 4:36 PM UTC

aaviran wrote: post #2

As a consumer, I don't like the direction where streaming services are headed - many small services with limited content (original or not). I've been a Netflix customer for years now (I also had Hulu Plus, cancelled it due to their then-horrendous interface). While in the past I was very impressed with Netflix's selection, I now find it... meh, despite all the original content. When I pay Netflix, it's not for one, t…

I'm curious how many people will be regular subscribers to all of these services or just sign up for a month to watch a new show and then freeze the account.

When Game of Thrones premieres I'll be getting an HBO Now account for a month, and then will freeze/cancel it until another new HBO show starts that I want to watch. I do the same with Netflix for House of Cards and a couple other shows. Unfortunately Amazon makes this difficult because you pay an annual subscription to Prime.

By doing it this way I might bounce around between services and only spend $10-20 for content streaming in any given month.

Re: Netflix, Amazon and Hulu No Longer Find Themselves Upstarts in Online Streaming

#33

Post by ctdonath » Wed, Mar 25, 2015, 4:47 PM UTC

fluidcruft wrote: post #30

ctdonath wrote: post #24

Ok, so long-term participants aren't new anymore. What's much more interesting is the death of the "long tail service" which attracted so many to these services in the first place: the implicit promise that their goal was to provide _everything_ in their catalogs, meaning you could give up buying media outright because they'd have & host whatever you could want. ...then others saw how very much money Netflix et al we…

This is partly what makes Redbox is so infuriatingly frustrating. Netflix DVDs are in awful shape and waits for the "long tail" disks are insane. I really can't get behind the online rentals because they feel like Blockbuster-style ripoffs. At the same time that I can rent a new release from Redbox for $1.50, streaming wants to charging $4 for the exact same show. Public library inter-library requests are becoming th…

"No ads" is huge for many of us. I'll pay $7/mo to not have my time wasted & wallet seduced & continuity unbroken. Children in particular I want not exposed to ads, as they suddenly & passionately want something stupid (PopTarts? A teddy bear with a fishbowl for a belly? SpongeBob anything? Borderline R-rated trailers? WTH? keep that crap away from my under-7yo kids).

Redbox at $1.50 vs. iTunes at ~$4 is a fine tradeoff per: cheap & max data rate but travel time & unpredictable availability vs. right now & always available vs. marginally more expensive & lower data rate.

As for buttons, why does the "Play" button not do anything when "Play" is selected on the disc menu? on _every_ disc player out there?!?

Re: Netflix, Amazon and Hulu No Longer Find Themselves Upstarts in Online Streaming

#34

Post by manigandham » Wed, Mar 25, 2015, 4:50 PM UTC

aaviran wrote: post #2

As a consumer, I don't like the direction where streaming services are headed - many small services with limited content (original or not). I've been a Netflix customer for years now (I also had Hulu Plus, cancelled it due to their then-horrendous interface). While in the past I was very impressed with Netflix's selection, I now find it... meh, despite all the original content. When I pay Netflix, it's not for one, t…

This is the natural evolution of the space. The fundamental laws havent changed, it's either everything bundled together for a flat price or a-la-carte where you'll need to get all the services you want and put them together yourself.

A-la-carte is what lots of people have been complaining about and now it's here, I don't really see what the problem is.

If people are expecting to have all the available content of cable which used to cost > $100 but only pay a single streaming service $10 that's just not going to happen. Those are unrealistic expectations.

Re: Netflix, Amazon and Hulu No Longer Find Themselves Upstarts in Online Streaming

#35

Post by jerf » Wed, Mar 25, 2015, 4:51 PM UTC

ctdonath wrote: post #25

coloroadie wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's exactly why the cable guys have been saying that bundling is the most economic option for consumers that want a large content catalog. As content creators stand up their own streaming services they'll begin to pull their content from third party streaming services (see Starz/Netflix). Consumers will eventually have two choices: purchase a very small subset of services directly from providers or go back to the…

How long until someone provides a bundling service? For just $50/mo they'll give you Netflix/HBO/Discovery/PBS/etc thru a single interface.

Ah, but how will they?

Startup: "Hey, Comcast, I'm a new startup trying to provide bundling services for all the fragmented streaming services out there! We feel we can offer a real win-win for both you and our customers by making it easier to subscribe and consume your service! And look at this awesome new Angular UI we built for your service that runs on Node.js backed by Mongo! It's web-scale!"

Comcast: "Sorry, kid, we have every intention of being the Uber-service. Have a lawsuit."

Startup: "Um, okay, well, that burns down our runway a bit. In the meantime, fake it 'till you make it! Hey, HBO, we're a new startup that can win-win yada yada webscale!"

HBO: "Sorry, kid, we have every intention of being the Uber-service. Have a lawsuit."

Startup: "Ack, now my runway is even shorter. Hey, Amazon..."

Amazon: "Sorry, kid, we're already the Uber-service and we intend to stay that way. Have a lawsuit."

Startup: "Shit."

Netflix: "No, we're the Uber-service! And also, have a lawsuit."

Startup: "Chapter 7 ho!"

Aereo: "Nice try, kiddo. Have a beer. Sucks, donnit?"

Re: Netflix, Amazon and Hulu No Longer Find Themselves Upstarts in Online Streaming

#36

Post by jstx » Wed, Mar 25, 2015, 5:04 PM UTC

cheriot wrote: post #18

The streaming services created the a la carte programming people have wanted from cable companies. They don't have a choice, content owners don't want any of them to have too much bargaining power. http://www.lazyfan.com One big problem is the lack of a TV guide equivalent. I've been taking a crack at this problem and have a prototype for movies (TV shows are still TODO).

XBMC has a solution for TV, but it only applies to your own hosted media. Take a look at PseudoTV.

I was actually writing a similar plugin for Plex.tv last year until my client hours put that on the backburner indefinitely.

Re: Netflix, Amazon and Hulu No Longer Find Themselves Upstarts in Online Streaming

#37

Post by dragonwriter » Wed, Mar 25, 2015, 5:07 PM UTC

coloroadie wrote: post #5

aaviran wrote: post #2

As a consumer, I don't like the direction where streaming services are headed - many small services with limited content (original or not). I've been a Netflix customer for years now (I also had Hulu Plus, cancelled it due to their then-horrendous interface). While in the past I was very impressed with Netflix's selection, I now find it... meh, despite all the original content. When I pay Netflix, it's not for one, t…

That's exactly why the cable guys have been saying that bundling is the most economic option for consumers that want a large content catalog. As content creators stand up their own streaming services they'll begin to pull their content from third party streaming services (see Starz/Netflix). Consumers will eventually have two choices: purchase a very small subset of services directly from providers or go back to the…

> Consumers will eventually have two choices: purchase a very small subset of services directly from providers or go back to the big bundle.

I don't think the cable-style "big bundle" will exist much longer, just premium sources which you pay for per source (or, for the highest-value premium content, per individual piece of content or individual viewing) and advertising-supported disaggregated content. There might be (advertising-supported) portals and aggregators for this providing something like the big bundle, but consumers won't be directly paying money for it (with the cable model they do, but over time that's going to go to paying for internet access.)

Re: Netflix, Amazon and Hulu No Longer Find Themselves Upstarts in Online Streaming

#38

Post by fluidcruft » Wed, Mar 25, 2015, 5:11 PM UTC

ctdonath wrote: post #33

fluidcruft wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is partly what makes Redbox is so infuriatingly frustrating. Netflix DVDs are in awful shape and waits for the "long tail" disks are insane. I really can't get behind the online rentals because they feel like Blockbuster-style ripoffs. At the same time that I can rent a new release from Redbox for $1.50, streaming wants to charging $4 for the exact same show. Public library inter-library requests are becoming th…

"No ads" is huge for many of us. I'll pay $7/mo to not have my time wasted & wallet seduced & continuity unbroken. Children in particular I want not exposed to ads, as they suddenly & passionately want something stupid (PopTarts? A teddy bear with a fishbowl for a belly? SpongeBob anything? Borderline R-rated trailers? WTH? keep that crap away from my under-7yo kids). Redbox at $1.50 vs. iTunes at ~$4 is a fine trade…

Agree about "no ads" being important. But comparing Netflix to DVR OTA is a very different proposition than comparing it with the abomination of ad-straight-jacketed streaming apps.

Streaming apps don't let you skip and play the same damn apps all the time. On DVR it's just a fast-forward and it's not so difficult (caveat I use a TiVo for this and I know they have a warchest of patents so I have no idea whether it is worse on competing DVRs).

With respect to kids programming, honestly the Netflix kids section is basically a huge toy product ad. It's full of the product crap. Bratz this, Ponies that, Shortcake that, Legos this, Star Wars that, Barbie this, Tikerbell that, Disney fad-coms etc and Netflix doesn't let you blacklist any of that shit. Even rating it low, they'll still shove all the related shit in front of your kids. The best we can find are European imports and PBS shows. But you can get PBS shows without ads already.

Basically, for us Netflix streaming is becoming useful only for it's kids programming but we've started building a local streaming media library because we are so unsatisfied with the entire experience vs what it could and should be.

There is very little interesting to watch on Netflix. With Netflix DVD you at least used to (lately it's only true on paper, not in execution) have access to quality programming in addition to the crap. There was a time when Netflix content was broader than local rental options. Now the local rental options have disappeared and Netflix only cares about serving the 90% of the idiots of the world.

Re: Netflix, Amazon and Hulu No Longer Find Themselves Upstarts in Online Streaming

#39

Post by ghaff » Wed, Mar 25, 2015, 5:16 PM UTC

manigandham wrote: post #34

aaviran wrote: post #2

As a consumer, I don't like the direction where streaming services are headed - many small services with limited content (original or not). I've been a Netflix customer for years now (I also had Hulu Plus, cancelled it due to their then-horrendous interface). While in the past I was very impressed with Netflix's selection, I now find it... meh, despite all the original content. When I pay Netflix, it's not for one, t…

This is the natural evolution of the space. The fundamental laws havent changed, it's either everything bundled together for a flat price or a-la-carte where you'll need to get all the services you want and put them together yourself. A-la-carte is what lots of people have been complaining about and now it's here, I don't really see what the problem is. If people are expecting to have all the available content of cab…

Yep. Time's TV critic was talking about this when the Apple TV streaming service was announced. The gist was that people who expect these streaming services to give them the same TV for less money are probably dreaming. But they may give people the option of less TV for less money.

That's certainly the situation I'm in. I don't really get my "money's worth" (whatever that means exactly) out of cable but I sort of hate to give up live TV entirely. But as new streaming options become available, at some point I'll probably decide that I can live without a regular cable package given its cost even if that means I lose access to some programming.

Re: Netflix, Amazon and Hulu No Longer Find Themselves Upstarts in Online Streaming

#40

Post by coloroadie » Wed, Mar 25, 2015, 5:21 PM UTC

dragonwriter wrote: post #37

coloroadie wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's exactly why the cable guys have been saying that bundling is the most economic option for consumers that want a large content catalog. As content creators stand up their own streaming services they'll begin to pull their content from third party streaming services (see Starz/Netflix). Consumers will eventually have two choices: purchase a very small subset of services directly from providers or go back to the…

> Consumers will eventually have two choices: purchase a very small subset of services directly from providers or go back to the big bundle. I don't think the cable-style "big bundle" will exist much longer, just premium sources which you pay for per source (or, for the highest-value premium content, per individual piece of content or individual viewing) and advertising-supported disaggregated content. There might be…

Why do you think the big bundle will go away? Sure, subscribing to a small number of one-off streaming services may make sense for some consumers, but not all.

For example: if you collect the top three must-have channels from each member of your average American family, you'll discover that mom, dad and the kids have very different tastes in media. By the time each family member finds and subscribes to the streaming service that provides them the content they want, they'll be paying much more than what they paid for the big cable bundle.