As a hetero male that is relatively new to management, what can I do to let my direct reports, indirect reports, and other colleagues know that they can report these kinds of things to me, and I will take them seriously? I don't have any women reporting directly to me right now, but it's very likely to happen over the next year, and I want to be proactive from the get-go.
Sexism in Tech: Don’t Ask Me Unless You’re Ready to Call Someone a Whistleblower
181–190 of 407 posts
Re: Sexism in Tech: Don’t Ask Me Unless You’re Ready to Call Someone a Whistleblower
#182Earlier quoted context omitted.
But it's not "rape" unless the coercion involved threats of violence, cf http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/cgi-bin/displaycode?section=pen&gr... It is sexual harassment though.
As another poster pointed out, your own link includes retribution as a form of duress, and it doesn't limit it to physical retribution. Section 261 b. It applies to all of section 261. Did you make a new account just to post a misinterpretation of this link twice? Edit: I changed the text. I had cited the wrong section. But that doesn't change what the document says: section b says retribution is a form of duress, no…
The "duress" you refer to is only relevant when someone is using "the authority of a public official" in lieu of force. I.e., the police/IRS can't threaten to arrest you/hit you with tax penalties unless you sex them up.
Please read all of 261.7.
[edit: I misunderstood the scoping rules of law. Ignore.]
Re: Sexism in Tech: Don’t Ask Me Unless You’re Ready to Call Someone a Whistleblower
#183Earlier quoted context omitted.
I have spoken at a professional conference and had about two dozen drunk fully grown men shout-chant at me to take my shirt off, becoming louder and growing more numerous the longer nobody responded to them. Security did nothing, and I was on my own to de-escalate the situation. Yeah, I mean, fucking hell. Seriously? I don't really understand how this can happen. It's just not thinkable in any professional context I…
Not OP, but did write the article. I think everything you've said makes a lot of sense given the data set you seem to be working with, and that most people in the tech industry are very good. The incident in question was my talk at DEFCON 19 right before the camera started rolling. I want to reiterate that THEY MADE GOOD ON THIS and I am NOT MAD. I feel like everybody learned a lot and things will be better now. But…
> The incident in question was my talk at DEFCON 19
That makes much more sense. DEFCON, a hacker convention where each speaker seems obligated to comment on how much they've had to drink - while holding a beer. Also, "hacker" being closer to the juvenile antics of webpage defacement - not the making of blinking sweaters with lilypad kits and hot glue.
It bothers me to think that females have some responsibility for avoiding these sort of situations (blaming the victim, etc), but hell - I'm a 30 year old man in the security industry and I avoid DEFCON.
Re: Sexism in Tech: Don’t Ask Me Unless You’re Ready to Call Someone a Whistleblower
#184I feel so naive asking this, but I really would like to better understand the specific scenario that led to being raped repeatedly "several times over months" by a colleague. Especially because it apparently happened to another female colleague by another man "in much the same way my attacker had raped me." I don't doubt FOR A MINUTE that this can happen but perhaps understanding the circumstances could provide a foc…
I can imagine at least one likely useful, but probably extremely invasive policy. But if, based on all of these recent blog posts, this is as pervasive as we're lead to believe then I would argue that invasive policies are the least of your concerns. For all company events pair people up and make each persons' well-being the other person's responsibility. In the sense that they will share the responsiblity for report…
as an addendum to that: If your partner didn't see it, it didn't happen. This would force the pair to stick together at all times if they were at all concerned for their well-being.
Re: Sexism in Tech: Don’t Ask Me Unless You’re Ready to Call Someone a Whistleblower
#185Earlier quoted context omitted.
The word 'rape' is being re-defined now. The definition is being expanded far beyond what we called rape 20 years ago. Feminists are trying to do this in order to call attention to sexual harassment, but it is backfiring. They will dilute the term to the point where violent rape is no longer seen as the uniformly more serious offense that it is.
Forced oral sex is considered rape. This isn't feminist redefinition. You think if a gun is to your head and you give a blowjob that is sexual harassment? Think about someone who has a family and needs their income, and what this kind of situation puts them in.
For the sake of argument, let me play the devil's advocate here and do a bit of armchair philosophy.
Let's say I have a family, many mouths to feed, maybe it's the last job I could possibly get in my small town in the middle of nowhere. I hate the job, it sucks the life out of me, I don't want to do it, but I'm forced to "against my will" every single day because otherwise my family will starve to death. If I lose it, I might never find one again. I'm under duress. Sure, there's no sexual abuse in this specific scenario, but as other posters have mentioned, modern definition of rape makes it not about sex, but about power structures.
Am I being raped, in the scenario above?
Note: I want to stress that I'm simply having a philosophical discussion here, I have no agenda, downvotes are pointless.
Re: Sexism in Tech: Don’t Ask Me Unless You’re Ready to Call Someone a Whistleblower
#186Earlier quoted context omitted.
Story from a friend of a friend's law firm. Young associate worked for this partner. Over the course of months, he coerced her into giving him blowjobs. Eventually she quit. 1) Why is this rape? Because coercion doesn't just take the form of physical violence. 2) Why not report to the police? Because it's mutually assured destruction. Even if you bring the guy down, you'll be known as the woman who called the police…
I'm sure that as a heterosexual man, regardless of my financial circumstances, no one could coerce me into giving blowjobs under the threat of losing my job. I'd quit and take my chances. What am I missing here?
because you're essentially a fucking idiot.
now, let me explain a bit.
you work in a mostly male environment. gender bias always favors you, hence it never rubs you the wrong way, hence you never notice it.
you're also a male, which for some reason means that your dick sometimes takes over your actions. history is full of proof of rules/regulations because of this behavior. hell, put a bunch of hetero-sexual males into a closed confine and eventually they start raping EACH OTHER. forbid them sex, put them near kids, they start raping kids (aka priesthood if this wasn't obvious).
once you realize that being a single, different individual within a large homogenous group makes things really awkward you'll continue to be:
a fucking idiot.
Re: Sexism in Tech: Don’t Ask Me Unless You’re Ready to Call Someone a Whistleblower
#187Earlier quoted context omitted.
> While there were a few of the expected "where's the proof" people on Twitter, as Kelly said, the large majority of responses she got were supportive, from lots of men and women. You raise a good point, but the problem is that not all supportiveness is equal. There are a lot of people who share their opinions when an incident like this goes public, and depending on what communities you happen to draw the attention o…
The reluctance is understandable. But we can't understate the positive: In that very google+ thread, more than one former colleague from Google said something to the effect of "I've always considered you someone to try to hire for my future startup, and I still do." In other words, even if some wary bosses would see any whistleblowing as a risk factor, the fact is that the large majority of responses she got were pos…
I don't work at Medium. I'm taking some time between work right now. I don't think I could have written this if I had a job with a conventional employer. No matter how great my employer is, if the post got popular, it would be pretty irresponsible and could hurt my employer. I'd at least talk it over with my coworkers and have addressed it directly in the article.
Re: Sexism in Tech: Don’t Ask Me Unless You’re Ready to Call Someone a Whistleblower
#188Earlier quoted context omitted.
You say that rape is a colloquial term for a range of specific crimes and chide me for not being more specific. And yet the person I replied to was making a positive claim that certain actions were rape. So how am I supposed to interpret that claim? Does rape take on a different meaning (e.g. a broader feminist definition) in that context? If rape is defined to be a crime or class of crimes, it's completely unreasona…
> So how am I supposed to interpret that claim? As someone using a colloquial term for anything sexual without consent, obviously. Sex without consent is generally called rape; most people don't have any clue about the exact legal definitions. You don't even know what legal jurisdiction OP is in; how could you interpret the word as anything but the colloquial definition? > In the US I don't believe there is any such…
As someone using a colloquial term for anything sexual without consent, obviously. Sex without consent is generally called rape; most people don't have any clue about the exact legal definitions
But most people don't subscribe to your consent based definition of rape. I think the majority of people would lean towards the force based definition of rape. You personally might think that rape should be defined as sex without consent, but that's a different matter.
True, there has been some movement towards consent based laws in the US, but many states still retain the requirement of force (which could be expanded to include threats and physical restraint).
Re: Sexism in Tech: Don’t Ask Me Unless You’re Ready to Call Someone a Whistleblower
#189Earlier quoted context omitted.
[deleted]
Not according to the California penal code. Duress suffices, and duress is not limited to physical force. http://codes.lp.findlaw.com/cacode/PEN/3/1/9/1/s261 "(b) As used in this section, "duress" means a direct or implied threat of force, violence, danger, or retribution sufficient to coerce a reasonable person of ordinary susceptibilities to perform an act which otherwise would not have been performed, or acquiesce…
Read that whole section. 261.7 refers to public officials abusing their authority, and duress is defined in that context.
Re: Sexism in Tech: Don’t Ask Me Unless You’re Ready to Call Someone a Whistleblower
#190Earlier quoted context omitted.
"A second colleague at a different institution held me against a wall against my objections and struggles and hit me with objects for his own amusement." Now this sounds rather as an assault, a sick power play, but I would accept it called rape when it involved was sexual amusement but probably sexual assault would be a better term as it would not dilute the meanings confusingly. Nonetheless this kind of behaviour is…
> I think that it would be much easier to fight with such behaviour by calling it by actual names. No, it won't, and let me explain why. One of the well known forms of sexism is what I like to call (I wonder if there's an academic name for this) "everyone's a lawyer". You'll find that often when men report wrongdoings, there's a simple expression of outrage, but when women do, everyone's a lawyer who says "of course…
Are you saying even if it wasn't a rape by whatever your very own definition of rape, you would rather call it rape to express outrage?
Of course those "everyone's a lawyer's" types are going to crawl out of the woodwork. Why not call it what it is and not give them any ammo to justify a disgusting action?
This isn't the first time I've seen people on the moral highground undermine their own position by giving their opponents something to focus on that makes sense.
I've never seen a benefit from doing that. Don't give them an inch if you truly want change.