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Fired

zachholman.com

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Re: Fired

#251

Post by meesterdude »

smacktoward wrote: post #111
davidu wrote: post #41

There are people who were at OpenDNS in the early days who were incredible, and as we grew, became less and less incredible, largely because the things that made them incredible actually started to be really frustrating as the company grew and they didn't want to change those things. So they had to leave. Usually it was a series of conversations about how the person, their peers, and the company were all unhappy, and…

In his classic book Accidental Empires ( http://www.amazon.com/Accidental-Empires-Silicon-Millions-Co... ), Robert X. Cringely wrote that if you think of a market as an invasion beach you can think of three kinds of employees at tech companies: commandos, infantry, and police. Commandos are people who love challenges and hate structure. They'll happily take on missions that other people think are crazy or impossible,…

I really like this idea, and I think its generally right. However, I think its worth recognizing that people can change roles - commandos can become infantry, which can become police.

But for sure, Its important to recognize that this is what the growth pattern looks like, and does highlight that needs and roles change; if you can't or won't, you gotta go - not because you're a horrible commando, but because they only need infantry now.

Re: Fired

#252

Post by alsdifu3 »

paulhauggis wrote: post #226

It's posts like these that remind me why I quit being an employee and started my own business. As an employee, you could be working on a project for 10 years and have it taken away in an instant.

Well customers can leave too. I'd say it's a completely different kind of freedom but you are still at the mercy of forces besides yourself.

Re: Fired

#253

Post by dasil003 »

mc32 wrote: post #205

I'm not sure I'd be so sanguine about things. If you get fired, unless you could not stand management or the environment, you should feel upset. Zach apparently feels okay because the company did it classily. No, dont do that. Get angry, it is their fault. When you hire someone you should not think of people as disposable commodities. No, you owe them recognition and respect, the dame with the employee, but to a less…

Do you have more of the story than appears in this article because otherwise it seems like you are jumping to a lot of conclusions.

Re: Fired

#254

Post by alsdifu3 »

porker wrote: post #211

How many of the 'classic' GitHub team are left there now? Is GitHub, the product we've come to like and know so well now run by people with different views to those who started it?

What is the 'classic' GitHub team? 2/3 founders are still there.

Re: Fired

#256

Post by zbowling »

NateDad wrote: post #138
lchengify wrote: post #91

Re: Zach's COBRA question. For those who don't know, COBRA (Consolidated Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act) is a law passed in 1985 [1] that compels companies to offer "continuing health insurance" to employees that leave the company for any reason other than "gross misconduct". Basically it means that you can pay the company directly for your employer's health plan for a period of time, typically 18 months. The out-…

Just to clarify.... it's retroactive for 60 days. That means you don't really have to do anything for the first 45-ish, and if you don't need insurance in that time, and you get a new job, you're done. If you do need insurance (break a leg or something), then you can apply then, and it'll take effect retroactively to your departure date. If you get to 45-ish days and still don't have a new job that'll start before th…

In the pre-existing condition days, this could still be an issue, because not being covered at any point would reset the clock.

Re: Fired

#257

Post by bmelton »

cylinder wrote: post #170
NateDad wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uh, have you been on unemployment? There's a max. In Massachusetts it's $698 / week (with no taxes taken out). That would only barely cover my mortgage, let alone car payment, food, health insurance, etc. And yes, people should have emergency funds... but when you were a few years out of college, did you have 3-6 months of salary saved up? I certainly didn't.

...why should the taxpayers cover your mortgage? I don't think "debt service on assets" is a universal human right. And why would someone have a mortgage just out of college if they can't even save 3 months first? Either way, $698/week is a lot. Do you know how much these European countries and Canada pay under their "safety net?" It's probably closer to $1500 per month. They certainly don't give a shit about anyone…

The point isn't that the taxpayers should cover his mortgage, but that the unemployment benefits should be more commensurate with how much one has paid in.

Anecdotal, but one of my older buddies was laid off. He's been earning north of $250k for over 30 years. He had savings, but assuming he didn't, his max withdrawal would be $698 a week, and only for 6 months, which is a max withdrawal of ~$18k, which is right around what he paid in to unemployment in a year. Ignoring that he'd been paying in ~$15k for years (or, I guess, half of that for awhile, as the pay-in percentage used to be lower), then he's not taking taxpayer dollars, he's taking his own money back. Or at least, a fraction of it, because the state made a lot more off of him than he made off of the state.

If he shouldn't be able to profit off of the state, then the state shouldn't be able to profit off of him.

Otherwise though, the compelling reason that unemployment should be enough to cover one's mortgage is because it is specifically designed to prevent homelessness, as the taxpayer cost of allowing him to go homeless because he had a few week lapse between employment and unemployment benefits is substantially higher than simply giving him more of his own money back.

Re: Fired

#258

Post by dbg31415 »

Having been fired... three times in my life... I can say that each time was more of a personality issue than a skill or competency issue. So I never took it hard. I've gotten some people fired too... and it sucks from both sides.

I'll say that it as satisfying as it is to know you won't have to work with some asshole again, it really sucks to sit them down and tell them that today is their last day on the project / with the company. Knowing the stress they will be under if they have kids or a spouse... it sucks.

When getting fired, when firing, always important to remember that there are probably plenty of people in the organization who still would like to work with you... so badmouthing and spreading drama is always your least beneficial solution.

Just take it with dignity / try and let them go gracefully.

Re: Fired

#259

Post by sib »

engendered wrote: post #179
gaius wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Getting fired and getting laid off are totally different things. These days there is no stigma attached to the latter.

Aside from the fact that many people use the term interchangeably, getting "laid off" often means "you got fired at a company that doesn't actively fire individually, but rather fires en masse". Being "laid off" from a company like Microsoft is equivalent to being outright fired at many other shops.

This simply isn't true. People who are terminated at Microsoft or Amazon or Google or others for poor performance (either during annual performance review or other times) are not laid off - they are terminated for poor performance.

Re: Fired

#260

Post by [deleted] »

mrb wrote: post #13

Human nature is really amazing. After the reading the first 4 paragraph I saw his openness and honesty. I felt compassion and trust. And I was already thinking to myself "Zach really looks like a cool guy; if he is skilled I would probably hire him", without attaching any significance whatsoever to the fact he was fired. If you are reading this, Zach, continue to be open, honest, accept your mistakes, show you do lea…

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