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Elementary OS Freya Beta 2

blog.elementaryos.org

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Re: Elementary OS Freya Beta 2

#21

Post by bpeebles »

meatfuck wrote: post #16
microhex wrote: post #10

After that blog post of theirs where they called everyone who took advantage of the free option they provide "cheaters", why would I want to use or recommend a Linux distro that provides nothing but a shoddy OSX GUI ripoff?

By putting cheaters in quotes, you're putting words into their mouths. I didn't find the word cheaters on that page. They are making a solid point about the cost of open source software and about how free software isn't free.

The another blog post originally[1] had the phrase:

"We want users to understand that they’re pretty much cheating the system when they choose not to pay for software."

And like, they have this on their home page:

"100% Free elementary OS is completely free, both in terms of pricing and licensing."

So it's weird to mention cheating or talk about making it harder to download for $0 while talking up the free pricing in their ad copy.

[1] https://web.archive.org/web/20150211113458/http://blog.eleme...

Re: Elementary OS Freya Beta 2

#22

Post by leonatan »

gnud wrote: post #9
ubercow13 wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In what way does that make it less free or open

It doesn't. This distro is supposed to be about design and usability, though. If that's their idea of usability, I think I'll go elsewhere.

Their idea of usability is different; they want you to pay. Don't underestimate the power of the default.

Re: Elementary OS Freya Beta 2

#23

Post by psgbg »

mox1 wrote: post #18
bndr wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You mean this post [1] ? I find their reasoning quite logical. [1] http://blog.elementaryos.org/post/110645528530/payments

So they wrote all this code themselves right? No, of course they didn't. The large majority of what they are selling was written by others (kernel, Debian, etc). Are they passing any revenue to their upstream providers? They have every right to try and charge people, but it's very disengineous to run git clone on a FOSS repo,make a few changes then write a big blog post about charging for the output.

>So they wrote all this code themselves right?No, of course they didn't. The large majority of what they are selling was written by others (kernel, Debian, etc).

That's is misleading at most.

It's true that they use other free software, so they don't write all the software themselves. That's a fact, but every other open source project is based in work by other.

The development of Linux kernel is based in work made by individuals at their own expense, but also contributions made by companies (as IBM, Canonical, Red Hat) and donations. Linux have paid software developers (it does not cost you but it cost to somebody).

As far I know, the developers of Elementary OS, are collaborating with the community and they have fixed problems in other open source projects they use themselves as Gtk.

>Are they passing any revenue to their upstream providers?

They have posted bounties (cash) to fix bugs in other software the "upstream providers" in bountysource, so that's public information.

>hey have every right to try and charge people,

That's true!.

> but it's very disengineous to run git clone on a FOSS repo,make a few changes then write a big blog post about charging for the output.

They write their own file-manager (pantheon-files), their own window manager (gala, over mutter), their own configuration system (switchboard). Their calendar application, their calculator, their music player, their movie player... etc.

So that's not easy, and your own phrase is "very disengineous" at least, certainly inaccurate and I hope not bad intentioned.

*Edited:formating.

Re: Elementary OS Freya Beta 2

#24

Post by [deleted] »

nothrabannosir wrote: post #11

Side-note: please don't publish checksums over unencrypted channels, and please don't use MD5 for image checksums. Technically, it's no problem if the intended use-case is not to verify against tampering but against transmission errors. However, it's a fine line that people easily cross by accident. It helps with global education if we condition people to never accept checksums from unencrypted sources, and to be war…

[deleted]

Re: Elementary OS Freya Beta 2

#25

Post by Touche »

microhex wrote: post #10

After that blog post of theirs where they called everyone who took advantage of the free option they provide "cheaters", why would I want to use or recommend a Linux distro that provides nothing but a shoddy OSX GUI ripoff?

That's not what it is. It's obvious if you follow these guys that they are Apple fans who wanted to customize their OS, couldn't, so created their own. They used OSX as a starting point, that's for sure, but that was years ago, now it's going in its own direction. I personally wouldn't use Elementary because it's overly opinionated for my taste, but I recognize their hard work and originality, they are not ripping anything off and haven't for a long time.

Re: Elementary OS Freya Beta 2

#26

Post by SunShiranui »

microhex wrote: post #10

After that blog post of theirs where they called everyone who took advantage of the free option they provide "cheaters", why would I want to use or recommend a Linux distro that provides nothing but a shoddy OSX GUI ripoff?

I think a lot of people have taken a single statement out of context without actually trying to understand the message they wanted to convey.

It's hard to deny that an open source project with more funding has more chances of surviving and developing good software, and I think it's true that users need to be made aware of that.

A well-funded, sustanaible open source ecosystem is in the interest of all of us. Having an alternative to proprietary software is very important if we want to mantain at least the freedom of choice.

Re: Elementary OS Freya Beta 2

#27

Post by nickysielicki »

psgbg wrote: post #19
microhex wrote: post #10

After that blog post of theirs where they called everyone who took advantage of the free option they provide "cheaters", why would I want to use or recommend a Linux distro that provides nothing but a shoddy OSX GUI ripoff?

I think that was a poorly transmitted message and an overblown story. Probably it should be read as "taking advantage of the system". Look run an Open Source project is costly, as much as making any other kind of software. Or you throw money developing it or time (which can be translated to money). They release the source code of everything, plus is GPL so it's free* software as stated by the FSF (but they have priva…

The elementary devs are idiots for not thinking about what they wanted to get out of this project in the first place.

Let's take a look at other open source monetizers:

* Red Hat - Provide enterprise support.

* Canonical - Provide dumb cloud services and enterprise support

* Docker - Provide enterprise support.

Where does Elementary fit into any of these models? Oh it doesn't? Then what in god's name were you thinking? And then they go on to insult 99%+ of their userbase for using their software without paying? But that was never implied as part of the deal! When I first heard of Elementary I thought of it as something much like Linux Mint... A Ubuntu install with a non-gnome DE as default. Actually, I still very much see it as that... That's all it fucking is.

So when Lubuntu, Kubuntu, Xubuntu, Linux Mint, and Ubuntu all exist entirely for free, and this similar product (but more hipster) comes along, why were the "cheaters", expected to know that this one intended to charge them?

I'm toying with the idea right now of registering geteos.com and linking to images of Elementary without an option to pay just as a "Fuck You" to these guys.

Re: Elementary OS Freya Beta 2

#29

Post by rukittenme »

listic wrote: post #28

Elementary OS. What's their deal (approach, unique selling point)?

A mix of technology, design, and community. The elementary community are actually writing apps designed for their desktop which is sadly rare in other distros. Everything they do is design oriented. Kind of feels Mac-ish but with obvious speed and usability improvements. elementary's approach to multiple desktops is much stronger than OSX's current offering. Their theme is a bit stale now but the awesome elementary community is writing tons of gorgeous themes (worlds better than anything on gnome-look). Unfortunately a lot of them have weird quirks when run on non-elementary distros but they're perfect on elementary

Re: Elementary OS Freya Beta 2

#30

Post by psgbg »

nickysielicki wrote: post #27
psgbg wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that was a poorly transmitted message and an overblown story. Probably it should be read as "taking advantage of the system". Look run an Open Source project is costly, as much as making any other kind of software. Or you throw money developing it or time (which can be translated to money). They release the source code of everything, plus is GPL so it's free* software as stated by the FSF (but they have priva…

The elementary devs are idiots for not thinking about what they wanted to get out of this project in the first place. Let's take a look at other open source monetizers: * Red Hat - Provide enterprise support. * Canonical - Provide dumb cloud services and enterprise support * Docker - Provide enterprise support. Where does Elementary fit into any of these models? Oh it doesn't? Then what in god's name were you thinkin…

Sorry I don't follow you for the first part.

>So when Lubuntu, Kubuntu, Xubuntu, Linux Mint, and Ubuntu all exist entirely for free, and this similar product (but more hipster) comes along, why were the "cheaters", expected to know that this one intended to charge them?

Look I don't like the "cheater" part more than you do yet I consider a bad way to express what they intended to say and not a mere insult.

Now what Lubuntu, Kubuntu, Xubuntu, Linux Mint, and Ubuntu do as their "marketing" (to say a word) policy is up to them. But if you read my comment what I try to say is the same for them. Using an open source project without helping them if you can is take advantage of the system.

>I'm toying with the idea right now of registering geteos.com and linking to images of Elementary without an option to pay just as a "Fuck You" to these guys.

You consider them as idiots/jerks and want to do that, and possibly running against the risk to be sued for trademark infringement or whatever... man you have balls.

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