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Why Is My Smart Home So Dumb?

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Re: Why Is My Smart Home So Dumb?

#91

Post by maxerickson »

sly010 wrote: post #83
maxerickson wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think as soon as there is a comm protocol that is worth calling a winner (works well, widely supported), it will quickly become the case that LED bulbs and fixtures will come with it built in. A while after that, whole home lighting control is a $100 feature that you expect in every house (or less for smaller places), not a $500 or $1000 feature that doesn't work very well in houses where the owner really pursued i…

I don't expect there will ever be such protocol though, there is too much competition already and everyone wants to be the "platform", because no-one actually has any idea of what gadgets would be useful. Even if we just look at the low level, there already is a war between grid powered vs battery powered, which then influences the war between BTLE, WIFI and ZigBee. There are inherently very different architectures,…

Could be. There is some chance that hubs like Wink (which supports ~6 protocols) will encourage manufacturers to choose the ones that work well. Then someone just needs to make a similar hub that isn't architecturally tied to the internet.

Re: Why Is My Smart Home So Dumb?

#92

Post by sp332 »

ssharp wrote: post #33
lentil_soup wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That smoke detector story makes me think it could even be dangerous, no?. Could opposite happen and the device fail to detect smoke?

Maybe I'm becoming more of a luddite or cranky old-man, approaching my mid-30's, but I don't see any benefit at all to using the Nest smoke alarm. I'm replacing tried and true, simple, technologies, with a new device that seems way more complicated than it needs to be.

It's easier to turn off in a false alarm. It can warn you ahead of time when the batteries are getting low. It can alert you over the internet if your house is maybe on fire. Not sure if that's worth the price premium, but there are some benefits.

Re: Why Is My Smart Home So Dumb?

#93

Post by natch »

Homeboy cameras are the one thing in my setup that work perfectly. I wish more products could be so well integrated with the cloud and the phone. I have them set up to send pictures to Dropbox via IFTT, and it all works perfectly, recording only when there's motion, and only when we are not home (it uses your cell phone location).

Tried a Quirky Spotter, and it does detect things like motion, but it doesn't know to send just one push notification; instead it sends a continuous stream of them while motion is happening, which is irksome.

Re: Why Is My Smart Home So Dumb?

#94

Post by tehwebguy »

alistairSH wrote: post #59
tehwebguy wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Turning off the lights on the other side of the house after you are already in bed is such a nice feature :)

If you're in bed, how do you know those lights are on? Also, why wouldn't you turn the light off as you left the room? Most of these "smart home" devices really do seem like a gimmick at this point. Maybe in the future, they'll be well enough debugged and refined to be useful, but for now, I just don't see a benefit in a normal* home. My dad uses Nests, "smart" locks, and remote cameras alarms (off-season) on his bea…

Good questions, our house isn't huge (smaller than "normal" it according to that def) so light travels. We usually DO turn lights off before getting in bed but sometimes we are tired and forget, and it's not obvious until our eyes adjust. It's a little childish but it's like "ugh I don't want to get up"

We really only use lamps and sunlight aside from the kitchen so we're mostly using the plug-in switches, so it really is nice turning off lamps in 3 bedrooms + living + den in a few taps.

Might as well turn this comment into a little review of my Vivint setup. These are controlled via the console in the house, the web and the app:

- Alarm

This is nice because you can enable it after you leave the house, which is nice if you are in a hurry or just simply forget. Maybe not a killer feature.

- Front door lock

Same deal here, but it also lets me open the door for people remotely or grant them temporary access. It's a little janky, I imagine that the Lockitron is better. My main concern is battery life, which it alerts me about long before the batteries (4 AA) die. My second concern is that the gears inside will wear out, though it has lasted for ~3 years so far.

- Thermostat

Super convenient for Florida. We travel a lot so it's nice to kill the AC before we leave and still have a cool house half an hour before we get back home. There is an automated "Nest-like" web interface for this but I don't really trust it. Scheduling works great.

- Pan & tilt camera

This is more of a toy but it's cool, the other day we saw our dog tearing up the trash can in the living room so we ran home and stopped her (and put the can in the garage).

None of this stuff is perfect, and you are probably better off (quality and price wise) by going with Nest + Wemo + Lockitron + some alarm company, but we're still happy with it all.

Re: Why Is My Smart Home So Dumb?

#95

Post by fixermark »

romaniv wrote: post #88
upofadown wrote: post #79

I've been into the home automation thing since before forever. There have been many periods of excitement over the years. They come and go. As a result I have to admit to a high level of skepticism about the current period. The companies that generate and are influenced by this excitement tend to make two main errors. 1. They don't understand that without an open standard for controls and sensors they are just foolin…

Open standards are a real issues in the industry. I find it ridiculous that you often have to pay thousands of dollars for software that simply understands those protocols. Not only that, it requires you to jump through ridiculous hoops to do stuff that you could easily do with a reasonably simple Python script. (Look up Niagara AX as an example.) Another problem is APIs and connectivity. Tuning a light on or off sho…

I had some luck awhile ago with an INSTEON setup using their SmartLinc central controller---but only because the SmartLinc itself had a sniffable HTTP protocol for its "phone control." So basically it was ideal for me, as long as I completely bypassed all the crap software that came with it (I ended up writing a small server app that read my Google Calendar for "light on / light off" commands and sent the appropriate HTTP commands to the SmartLinc to fool it into doing the actions).

Unfortunately, the setup stopped working and I don't have useful tools to debug it; no way to know why an INSTEON controller can't see another component, only that it can't. Plus, I'd like to move away from systems that want to use the house wiring at all (INSTEON is hybrid x10 / radio) because I don't want an errant power surge blowing my $100+ of equipment.

Re: Why Is My Smart Home So Dumb?

#96

Post by fixermark »

lentil_soup wrote: post #30
jmuguy wrote: post #28

Sounds like my experience with Nest last summer. Got the thermostat, can't get it connected to my wireless. Support basically tells me to get bent until I go into full IT guy mode and prove its an issue with the unit. Replacement unit comes, doesn't work at all (first one was at least a nice looking thermostat with no connected features). Third unit comes and it's been fine ever since. For some reason I thought it wo…

That smoke detector story makes me think it could even be dangerous, no?. Could opposite happen and the device fail to detect smoke?

Why yes, yes it could. ;)

http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-26879987

Re: Why Is My Smart Home So Dumb?

#97

Post by TimothyGee »

statictype wrote: post #89
TimothyGee wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I set up my house such that when I unlock the front door using my code, the downstairs lights come on if it's after sundown. I also have a camera capture the first few minutes of the door changing state. I get alerts if the door is opened outside of normal away hours (8-4 on weekdays). I also have a vacation mode that will control various lights in the house to simulate occupancy. I also set up a nightlight mode that…

What components did you use for this?

I used a Schlage Z-wave compatible door lock, a VeraLite smart home controller, and a handful of generic Z-wave devices (sensors, outlets, switches). I also have a Nest thermostat. The package cost me about $200 bucks (not counting the Nest).

Re: Why Is My Smart Home So Dumb?

#98

Post by DanBC »

joezydeco wrote: post #82
modoc wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My understanding is that modern tank water heaters are extremely efficient, 96%+ so I don't think they use that much energy these days?

Switching a water heater completely off (or below Vacation setpoint) is an invitation to grow nasty things in your tank, like Leigionaire's Disease.

To kill legionella you need to water at 140 F (60 C) or over, for more than 30 minutes. That temperature will cause a full thickness ("3rd degree") burn in less than a second in children and old people, and less than 5 seconds in adults.

It's best to set the water temperature to no more than 50 C. This is still potentially harmful, but takes a bit longer.

Or set the tank temperature high and have some safety feature at the point of delivery.

Scalds hospitalise many people, killing some of them. Legionella, not so many.

EDIT: It's hard to get legionnaire's disease. The "attack rate" is less than 5%. http://www.cdc.gov/legionella/clinicians.html

Re: Why Is My Smart Home So Dumb?

#99

Post by fixermark »

ocdtrekkie wrote: post #73

A lot of this is bad technology choice. The new hipster smart bulbs are a doomed technology, they were a bad idea from the start. Try INSTEON, buddy.

Do you have any suggestions on debugging INSTEON?

I have a setup at my house, but the light switches stopped talking to the SmartLinc and I can't get them to re-pair. And without any debugging options, I'm feeling a bit sunk.

Re: Why Is My Smart Home So Dumb?

#100

Post by FrozenCow »

romaniv wrote: post #88
upofadown wrote: post #79

I've been into the home automation thing since before forever. There have been many periods of excitement over the years. They come and go. As a result I have to admit to a high level of skepticism about the current period. The companies that generate and are influenced by this excitement tend to make two main errors. 1. They don't understand that without an open standard for controls and sensors they are just foolin…

Open standards are a real issues in the industry. I find it ridiculous that you often have to pay thousands of dollars for software that simply understands those protocols. Not only that, it requires you to jump through ridiculous hoops to do stuff that you could easily do with a reasonably simple Python script. (Look up Niagara AX as an example.) Another problem is APIs and connectivity. Tuning a light on or off sho…

This is what I do as well. One raspberry pi with all the required connections (Z-Wave USB controller, IR emitter and a wire to my PC) with an extremely simple node application that serves urls like /lights/on, /curtains/open and /computer/power. My phone running Tasker to trigger the various appliances. Add some buttons to the homescreen for direct control over everything. The real added value comes from a trigger from the wakeup-alarm app that runs a Tasker script, turning on the lights, waiting 5 minutes and opening the curtains.

I haven't found an all-in-one solution to do all this. Then again, I haven't looked for anything else once I got my curtains going through Tasker. An open standard would've made the process much simpler though.

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