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'YOUTUBE is EVIL': Somebody had a tape running, Google

theregister.co.uk

91–100 of 107 posts

Re: 'YOUTUBE is EVIL': Somebody had a tape running, Google

#91
post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really it's bizarre because the service they're offering on its own is quite valuable, so they'll get user adoption eventually I imagine - maybe not 100% but that's greedy or unreasonable at minimum. Far more damage is done with an aggressive/controlling stance, future long-term revenues and negative mindshare.

Google's definitely lost their way. Got too big, too fast and didn't preserve the culture. The biggest an organization can get and hope to have a reasonable chance of not going evil is probably some multiple of Dunbar's number. I think realistically the uppermost limit on it is going to be Dunbar's squared and assuming everyone has really high social skills and no life outside work then it's 250*250 = 62k people. But…

Everything I've read suggests that the G+ / GMail / YouTube integration was forced onto the various parts of Google by executive fiat: The rank & file Google employees were against it, but a company is not a democracy so it was forced on them & by extension us.

Executive culture tends to laud the "visionary leader" who pushes their vision on everyone else. When that vision is wrong-headed you end up with situations like the G+ débâcle: it was a failure of the Google executive, not the employees.

My guess is that we have the same effect in play with the YouTube Music debacle: an "up and coming" exec who wants to make their mark by creating a new business line for Google that brings in big profits. They don't care if they sully the Google brand in the process because their incentives aren't aligned with Google's, any negative effects on Google's userbase (be they musicians, music consumers or just ordinary users of Google services) are just collateral damage in their internal political game.

This is warring business units in action.

Re: 'YOUTUBE is EVIL': Somebody had a tape running, Google

#92

As a Massachusetts resident, this brings the question of "two-party consent" to the forefront for me. There are many times I would like to record conversations, but cannot legally do so. Who does two-party consent benefit more, the large corporations or the individual's right to privacy? Or is it not black and white?

Are you sure you can't record them? All you have to do is tell them that you're recording. Then they can either take it or leave it. I'm not sure how many people will hang up on you if you say that, but it's worth a try. Also, as I understand it, if you call in to a place that has a notice that they're recording you (i.e. the ubiquitous "this call may be recorded or monitored for quality or training purposes") that also suffices as permission for you to record them. (Not a lawyer, this is not legal advice, yada yada.)

Re: 'YOUTUBE is EVIL': Somebody had a tape running, Google

#93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Problem: the lack of: (c) monetize some, but not all, content. Not everyone wants to be all-in or all-out. Maybe she wants her best work monetized, but has additional content she wants available for free. Ad-stamped content can be really annoying and turn people off from watching/listening when there isn't sufficient desire for the content to put up with it. Free content, unladen of ads, can help draw in followers wh…

There is a (c) as you describe it, OP just neglected to mention it. The third option is to just monetize videos uploaded to the official channel. They can continue uploading only specific songs they want to monetize on their channel.

I thought that if Keating didn't agree to (b), her channel would be removed?

Re: 'YOUTUBE is EVIL': Somebody had a tape running, Google

#94
post #22

As a Massachusetts resident, this brings the question of "two-party consent" to the forefront for me. There are many times I would like to record conversations, but cannot legally do so. Who does two-party consent benefit more, the large corporations or the individual's right to privacy? Or is it not black and white?

I hate that law. It makes me think that some politician got caught talking about something immoral or illegal and sought to make phone conversations "safer." It certainly doesn't help, for example, a victim of domestic violence who receives threatening phone calls. He/she has to go to the authorities and receive permission. On the other hand, in a conversation with like this with a corporation she could simply announ…

> And if the corp decides they don't want to have the conversation on the record, then they don't get to have the conversation at all.

I think a problem with this approach is that in most cases, the individual loses more by not having the conversation than the corporation does.

Re: 'YOUTUBE is EVIL': Somebody had a tape running, Google

#95
post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Um, last I heard, unless you pay them, Github requires you to make any code you upload open-source and publicly available. In many ways that's even more far-reaching than what YouTube is asking, but that hasn't stopped programmers from flocking to them in droves. That does, however, suggest to me an option (c) that Google isn't offering: Musicians pay Google to run Content Id on their behalf to simplify the takedown…

Um, last I heard, unless you pay them, Github requires you to make any code you upload open-source and publicly available. Publicly available yes, open source no. You're free to choose whatever license you want: You're under no obligation to choose a license. It's your right not to include one with your code or project, but please be aware of the implications. Generally speaking, the absence of a license means that t…

The requirement used to be open-source and publicly available

It is now only publicly available

Re: 'YOUTUBE is EVIL': Somebody had a tape running, Google

#96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your parent was modded down for bringing nothing to the conversation. It might as well have read "lol google." Unfortunately other similar media aren't as lucrative. Even if they pay as well, not being on YouTube creates an exposure problem. I hope there's some way to work this out, but to be honest, Google still seems to me like the least sleazy company to help you monetize your music, and that's not a compliment to…

> Google still seems to me like the least sleazy company to help you monetize your music I don't know...even if you sign with the worst of the traditional record labels, once your contract is up the rights to monetize your own works revert back to you. With Youtube (so far) it seems that if you refuse to sign with them, they still claim the right to monetize your works even if you don't upload them yourself. They tak…

Yeah, although Google and others were always willing to monetize your work without your knowledge or consent. To some degree that's how the internet works and it's not _entirely_ a bad thing, and a lot of it is not intentional (photograph a painting, share it on forum with banner ads.) But with Google, their change is now they're unwilling to give back without a contract.

Re: 'YOUTUBE is EVIL': Somebody had a tape running, Google

#98
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Addendum - what is key here is that Zoe's original post was balanced and rational and even-handed. Even if YouTube disputed the factual aspects of it then this was a really poor way to go about it and has merely confirmed the feeling that they are throwing their weight around with small artists. They could have turned things around by engaging in dialog and still got their point across. Someone at YouTube needs to go…

> Someone at YouTube needs to go back to PR school after this. I'd say that someone just needs to be repeatedly hit in the head with a copy of Carnegie's "How to Win Friends and Influence People". Seriously, every single PR flop I've seen discussed here (or anywhere else) was a result of failing to adhere to a single basic rule: don't be a douchebag. It's really that simple . Do we really need PR schools to teach peo…

was a result of failing to adhere to a single basic rule: don't be a douchebag

It's called The Golden Rule, and I've maintained for a long time it pretty much the only law/rule you need in life.

Re: 'YOUTUBE is EVIL': Somebody had a tape running, Google

#99
post #74
post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Um, last I heard, unless you pay them, Github requires you to make any code you upload open-source and publicly available. In many ways that's even more far-reaching than what YouTube is asking, but that hasn't stopped programmers from flocking to them in droves. That does, however, suggest to me an option (c) that Google isn't offering: Musicians pay Google to run Content Id on their behalf to simplify the takedown…

By your analogy, any code you put on bitbucket would also have to be uploaded to github at the same time.

Yeah that was not a good comparison; the problem here is that the contract applies to all music released by the artist for 5 years, not just what is uploaded to Youtube. This is vastly, vastly more restrictive than Github. Not even close.

If Github did this, they would lose everyone overnight.

Re: 'YOUTUBE is EVIL': Somebody had a tape running, Google

#100
post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really it's bizarre because the service they're offering on its own is quite valuable, so they'll get user adoption eventually I imagine - maybe not 100% but that's greedy or unreasonable at minimum. Far more damage is done with an aggressive/controlling stance, future long-term revenues and negative mindshare.

Google's definitely lost their way. Got too big, too fast and didn't preserve the culture. The biggest an organization can get and hope to have a reasonable chance of not going evil is probably some multiple of Dunbar's number. I think realistically the uppermost limit on it is going to be Dunbar's squared and assuming everyone has really high social skills and no life outside work then it's 250*250 = 62k people. But…

I always feel there should be a single controller that reviews all major outreach tactics - or even a team dedicated merely to that once at that scale. It's just too important to skulk at.
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