Google to close engineering office in Russia • Hacker News Board

Re: Google to close engineering office in Russia

#201

Post by pandaman » Fri, Dec 12, 2014, 5:44 PM UTC

okatsu wrote: post #182

pandaman wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Their" is referring whom exactly? I don't think Russia is a Common Law country, judges there cannot derive something from a law so whomever you think is interpreting the law. Were not media saying that gay athletes in Sochi are going to be incarcerated using the same logic?

"Their" referring to the Putin government. You can't really use Sochi as an example. The Olympics are a very important international event and Russia wanted the good publicity. You'll also notice that Putin ordered the release of many political prisoners just in time for that event.

I see. So Putin has made media to lie. What an asshole!

Re: Google to close engineering office in Russia

#202

Post by king_jester » Fri, Dec 12, 2014, 5:47 PM UTC

notjackma wrote: post #187

PJDK wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's nothing wrong with telling Children that it's fine to be gay

Depends on who's telling the Children, right? Like Larry Brinkin, the former San Francisco Human Rights commissioner and high-profile gay rights activist? "Larry Brinkin, S.F. Gay Rights Activist Convicted of Porn Charges, Headed to Jail... SF Weekly broke the news in June 2012 when local cops had arrested the high-profile gay rights activist after investigators traced images of children as young as perhaps a year ol…

There are plenty of straight folks doing this same thing but there is no ban on people from talking about heterosexuality around minors.

Re: Google to close engineering office in Russia

#203

Post by a_c_s » Fri, Dec 12, 2014, 5:50 PM UTC

notjackma wrote: post #163

drzaiusapelord wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't imagine doing business with a Russian owned company at this point. An autocratic regime has never been good for internet or software freedoms. I'm very glad I chose Sophos over Kaspersky for our shop.

Why discriminate against a Russian company over something that may or may not happen? Russia has elections and they have laws which affect businesses based there - pretty much like every other country out there. As the article states, Google is moving its engineers but the sales team is staying, so this reorganization is less to do with politics and more to do with Google centralizing its engineers in Zurich - just l…

Russia has neither free speech nor free elections.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-25299116 http://www.theguardian.com/world/2007/nov/30/russia.politics

Re: Google to close engineering office in Russia

#204

Post by debacle » Fri, Dec 12, 2014, 5:52 PM UTC

muglug wrote: post #175

debacle wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Freedom zones," trying to get MLK to commit suicide, the Red Scare, subversion of activist groups during the Nixon years, Kent State, manipulation of social networks and Wikipedia, controlling the media to the point that it might as well be called the state media unless you're watching BBC or Comedy Central. I could go on and on. The Russians are not worse than the US, they're just not as good at hiding it.

The US government does not "control" the media, and allows private news organisations (Fox News, The Wall St Journal) that effectively act as a mouthpiece for the opposition party to flourish. Not so in Russia, where independent news organisations are under constant attack. You're absolutely right that the US has done some deplorable things in its past (including, as we now know, the recent state-sanctioned torture o…

Your problem is comparing Russia's censorship to the US's spying. Russia has its own intelligence gathering programs that we know little about, but we know a lot about the US's censorship (and how they manipulate the media) and it would make more sense to compare those two.

For the same reason that it makes no sense to compare the US GDP to the size of Poland's navy, there's no value in comparing Russian censorship to US intelligence.

Re: Google to close engineering office in Russia

#205

Post by CamperBob2 » Fri, Dec 12, 2014, 5:55 PM UTC

osipov wrote: post #141

bad_user wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a Romanian, a country that's pretty close to Russia and I am one that suffers for what the Ukrainians are going through with Russia, because I can see how the same thing could happen in Basarabia (Moldova) and there are already signs of that. Russia historically has been occupying territories, getting rid of any political dissent by effectively killing or deporting people, while crushing their national identity.…

>>So spare me rhetoric about every government or country being the same. Don't twist my words. I said governments are becoming more authoritarian. I stand by this statement.

You falsely equated the actions of a few berserk local cops in the US with the Putin regime. You need people to twist your words so that you don't look like an idiot or worse.

Re: Google to close engineering office in Russia

#206

Post by osipov » Fri, Dec 12, 2014, 6:00 PM UTC

unprepare wrote: post #162

osipov wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok, I skimmed LGBT article. Would you be willing to skim the following white paper on the subject? http://gallery.mailchimp.com/d0e55f3197099944345708652/files...

interesting, an article written by an author who has never written anything else and comes up with not a single social media profile, or really anything other than this article and articles referencing it. perfect shill bait.

Are you serious? This is Brian. I've met him: https://www.youtube.com/user/DiversitySpectrum

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vTS4ZASCo_0&list=UUsd-fzq2Mj...

Brian is gay btw.

Re: Google to close engineering office in Russia

#207

Post by JumpCrisscross » Fri, Dec 12, 2014, 6:02 PM UTC

notjackma wrote: post #163

drzaiusapelord wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't imagine doing business with a Russian owned company at this point. An autocratic regime has never been good for internet or software freedoms. I'm very glad I chose Sophos over Kaspersky for our shop.

Why discriminate against a Russian company over something that may or may not happen? Russia has elections and they have laws which affect businesses based there - pretty much like every other country out there. As the article states, Google is moving its engineers but the sales team is staying, so this reorganization is less to do with politics and more to do with Google centralizing its engineers in Zurich - just l…

> Russia has elections and they have laws which affect businesses based there - pretty much like every other country out there

In the U.S. I can sign a contract with a private party–or even with the government–and reasonably expect (a) that the terms will be complied with or (b) if they are not, to have reasonable options for compelling performance or collecting damages. In Somalia, on the other hand, a contract is merely a discussion aid. Forcing performance or collecting damages requires deploying force.

Russia is in between. The courts are venal and capricious. This means that a contract saying one thing can be interpreted differently because of the counterparty's political connections. (Not saying that doesn't happen everywhere, but its degree and brazenness is greater in states without a firm rule of law, like Russia.) It also means that any disagreement could escalate unpredictably to one's property being sacked and self being jailed.

None of this makes Russia an impossible place to do business. But it does make it more costly, in the form of ambiguous risks and the unique and uncertain costs of mitigating them.

Re: Google to close engineering office in Russia

#208

Post by unprepare » Fri, Dec 12, 2014, 6:10 PM UTC

osipov wrote: post #198

unprepare wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not parsing anything incorrectly. > _in presence of minors_ so, anywhere in public? where would one find space to hold a public event where children are guaranteed to not be present? Also the whole line of reasoning is that mentioning homosexuality to children makes them gay which is... bad? thats a value judgment on homosexuality that was put in place by the government, yet you are trying to constantly say that…

I don't know if you have kids but I do. I don't want my kids to be exposed to any form of expression supporting any sexual lifestyle. In fact, I don't event want my kids to see a blurred photo of Kim Kardashian's naked butt on TV. There is zero prejudice in this value statement. And most parents agree with my position. When my kids are adults they can decide about sexual relationships for themselves. Until then I dec…

Does the law block speaking to kids about ALL sexual orientations, or just 'non traditional'?

you're point is completely irrelevant to the discussion. this is about discrimination against homosexuality.

But I'll address it anyways:

>I don't want my kids to be exposed to any form of expression supporting any sexual lifestyle.

Good for you, luckily as a parent you have the ability to make those decisions for your kids.

This does not extend to you forcing your views on others.

>And most parents agree with my position.

and the rights of the majority are the only rights that matter, correct?

>Until then I decide for them and I want a legal system that supports my decisions.

This is not how it works. Say you were an anti-vaccine advocate, you would want the legal system to outlaw vaccines, but many other parents would disagree. see how this conflicts with the rights of others?

Re: Google to close engineering office in Russia

#209

Post by curiously » Fri, Dec 12, 2014, 6:12 PM UTC

drzaiusapelord wrote: post #155

curiously wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you think Putin can keep this up with the falling currency and economy crashing? Or does he have a stronghold on everyone with guns that nobody could take him down? I wonder if Russia could change to a more democratic and liberal tone after Putin. I mean, it seems like Putin wants to go back straight to Soviet era.

My Russian friends on Facebook love Putin. Why would they overthrow him? He's given them everything they wanted: revenge on West for the cold war, bullying neighbors, a toughguy image, punishing homosexuals, and up until recently a higher oil price (coincidental of course). Sorry I just don't believe that the Russian people are interested in peace or human rights. Putin reflects the will of majority. I think Russia's…

So basically normal humane civilization is something not part of Russian culture or at least for majority anyway.

Re: Google to close engineering office in Russia

#210

Post by curiously » Fri, Dec 12, 2014, 6:16 PM UTC

osipov wrote: post #150

curiously wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You sound like one of the many Russian comment spam bots from Reddit news threads about anything Russian.

You are someone with an account created 69 days ago. A noob. Back in the day both reddit and this place used to have rational discussions. Until noobs like you showed up.

Actually I've been coming on here for years now. This is just one of my other accounts created while I'm at work. But yeah, seems like you are on your way to being hellbanned.