Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Peter Sunde: 'I went to jail for my cause. What did you do?'

wired.co.uk

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

231–240 of 372 posts

Re: Peter Sunde: 'I went to jail for my cause. What did you do?'

#231

Post by mbillie1 »

karmacondon wrote: post #43

Many don't agree with the principles of TPB, but Sunde was willing to take risks for what he believed in. He deserves a lot of respect for that no matter what people think about the morality of what he helped to create. Most people go their whole lives without caring strongly about any issue at all, and almost all of those that do care are willing to sacrifice exactly nothing. I'd like to think that I would be willin…

> Sunde was willing to take risks for what he believed in. He deserves a lot of respect for that no matter what people think about the morality of what he helped to create

I find this argument completely fallacious. Does it change the value of a thing if someone takes a risk for it? Ought we respect the causes of suicide bombers, since they gave their lives for them?

Re: Peter Sunde: 'I went to jail for my cause. What did you do?'

#232

Post by drzaiusapelord »

newaccountfool wrote: post #227
drzaiusapelord wrote: post #156

I'm sorry, but downloading entertainment is not a human right. He didn't exactly feed starving people by breaking the law. He put up a torrent aggregator to, mostly, Hollywood movies and shoved aggressive and high-revenue porn and malware ads into every nook and cranny of that site. HN and those passionate about internet freedoms deserve better heroes than guys like Sunde, Dotcom, and Ulbricht. These guys very much e…

You do understand that the Malware has nothing to do with the website? and by that I mean that it's an adnetwork that controls what adverts that are displayed, and that many many adnetworks have been used to malvertise.

TPB chose the types of ads they are willing to display. I consider spyware and malware the exact same thing. TPB isn't a victim of the ad networks. They hired them to put up those misleading spyware and malware ads.

Re: Peter Sunde: 'I went to jail for my cause. What did you do?'

#233

Post by pbhjpbhj »

gedrap wrote: post #129
higherpurpose wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's like saying designer clothes should be free. I wonder if it's not more like "designer cloths shouldn't be copyrighted" - which is actually true in the fashion world. And because of that tens if not hundreds of millions of people can get "cheap cloths" that look good.

Well, yes, but you can't download clothes using torrents ;) Similar idea would be that ideas of movies and video games should not be copyrighted. IANAL, but there are many many similar movies and video games and don't think there are any copyright infringements unless you create a video game with almost identical name, etc.

>there are many many similar movies and video games and don't think there are any copyright infringements //

That's because they're copying the ideas and not the implementation, copyright protects implementations ("works") and not the ideas behind them (at least that's the intention).

Similar names would be trademark law rather than copyright FWIW.

Re: Peter Sunde: 'I went to jail for my cause. What did you do?'

#234

Post by the8472 »

patzerhacker wrote: post #223
scrollaway wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You sure talk a lot about how he was putting malware into people's computer through ads, when he himself said he's glad TPB is gone mostly because of how horrible its ads were[1]. You have a point (to the extent that it can be a point - it's just not really worth talking about anymore): downloading entertainment is not a human right. You make a very poor case of arguing that point. But I don't think anyone really arg…

> You are a fool if you're angry about piracy on your pet project. I'll tell my employees that as our company folds from lack of revenue. I'll tell my wife that as we apply for food stamps. I'll tell the that to the next person interviewing me for a job because people didn't want to pay for the value I provided.

> people didn't want to pay for the value I provided

Well, that simply sounds like a failed product, no? Not everything is successful. Given finite resources (human labor in this case) not everything can be successful.

Just because some people would take it for free does not mean they would take it at the cost it takes to make the product profitable.

Re: Peter Sunde: 'I went to jail for my cause. What did you do?'

#235

Post by newaccountfool »

zxcdw wrote: post #103
yitchelle wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> since it doesn't harm anyone How did you come this this conclusion?

No "lost potential sale", when the sale wasn't even a realistic possibility?

I can help back this up by an article that details studies that have been done.

http://freakonomics.com/2012/01/12/how-much-do-music-and-mov...

Re: Peter Sunde: 'I went to jail for my cause. What did you do?'

#236

Post by ultramancool »

jkaunisv1 wrote: post #205
ultramancool wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Yes, there are rich people who make money off of TV shows, movies, videogames, etc. But there are also regular hardworking people who depend on it for their living, and saying TPB is just exercising free speech really skips over the issue. Does it though? TPB themselves are not doing any sort of piracy, nor are they harming anyone. That exercise is left entirely up to the users. The only thing they do is distribute…

The world isn't theoretical. Context matters, intent matters. It's called the PIRATE bay for fucks sake. Sure, there is plenty of regular sharing on TPB. But the majority of it is pirated content that they are making a hell of a lot easier for people to access. This thread is really exposing to me the variety of views on the topic. I get your argument, but it's like you're deliberately ignoring the reality of how TPB…

> This thread is really exposing to me the variety of views on the topic. I get your argument, but it's like you're deliberately ignoring the reality of how TPB is used.

I'm simply saying TPB cannot be held directly responsible for how their users behave. Same as any website operator really. Not "deliberately ignoring" anything. TPB doesn't pirate. TPB helps pirates by offering names and comments on hashes. I don't see why that should be illegal at all.

Their name and marketing is simply the best marketing for their platform to get the most ad views. Nothing wrong with that.

> Which people are you talking about that we have no need for? The people who make the content? You don't feel we have a need for them? I love cutting out middle men as much as anyone, but eventually somebody has to make the product.

Simply "working hard" alone should not be rewarded. And as we've seen time and time again, plenty of people are willing to make a product for free, with or without ad revenue or to find alternative ways to profit. Just because 1 business model fails doesn't mean everybody loses out. Just some people. I'm saying the people who _rely_ upon the failing business model should in fact lose rather than being encouraged by archaic laws.

Re: Peter Sunde: 'I went to jail for my cause. What did you do?'

#237

Post by newaccountfool »

drzaiusapelord wrote: post #156

I'm sorry, but downloading entertainment is not a human right. He didn't exactly feed starving people by breaking the law. He put up a torrent aggregator to, mostly, Hollywood movies and shoved aggressive and high-revenue porn and malware ads into every nook and cranny of that site. HN and those passionate about internet freedoms deserve better heroes than guys like Sunde, Dotcom, and Ulbricht. These guys very much e…

You seem very caught up with the Malware and Adverts, why don't you just use adblock on those websites if you don't find it acceptable.

Re: Peter Sunde: 'I went to jail for my cause. What did you do?'

#238

Post by forgottenpass »

pionar wrote: post #128
ars wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is that stealing? If they won't sell you the wiget then why should they get to claim copyright? Copyright only exists to promote selling content, take that away and copyright vanishes right along with it.

No, copyright exists to say, I made this, I get to control how it's distributed.

    To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts, by 
    securing for limited Times to Authors and Inventors the 
    exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries.

Re: Peter Sunde: 'I went to jail for my cause. What did you do?'

#239

Post by pdabbadabba »

the8472 wrote: post #229
pdabbadabba wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Making money from producing entertainment isn't a human right. No, but at least in the U.S., and most of the rest of the world, it is a legal right. Does that count for nothing just because we're on the internet?

Making money from media is NOT a legal right. You don't have a right to profit. You have the right to attempt to profit from it and exclude others from doing the same with your work. That's all copyright provides. A limited right to an opportunity to make money, granted to you by society so you can make more of that work if society (by proxy of "The Market") deems your works as successful. This right is granted to yo…

> Making money from media is NOT a legal right. You don't have a right to profit.

> You have the right to attempt to profit from it and exclude others from doing the same with your work.

I think this is a distinction without a difference when the context is whether someone can interfere with your "attempt" to profit by violating your right to exclude others.

Re: Peter Sunde: 'I went to jail for my cause. What did you do?'

#240

Post by psykovsky »

patzerhacker wrote: post #223
scrollaway wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You sure talk a lot about how he was putting malware into people's computer through ads, when he himself said he's glad TPB is gone mostly because of how horrible its ads were[1]. You have a point (to the extent that it can be a point - it's just not really worth talking about anymore): downloading entertainment is not a human right. You make a very poor case of arguing that point. But I don't think anyone really arg…

> You are a fool if you're angry about piracy on your pet project. I'll tell my employees that as our company folds from lack of revenue. I'll tell my wife that as we apply for food stamps. I'll tell the that to the next person interviewing me for a job because people didn't want to pay for the value I provided.

That job interview would be your epiphany. That nobody paid for it because you didn't really provide any value at all. Welcome to the real world, where your actions are most likely insignificant and valueless, except for you.
Post reply on HN