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Uber banned from operating in Indian capital after rape accusation

reuters.com

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Re: Uber banned from operating in Indian capital after rape accusation

#61

Post by baxter001 »

[deleted] wrote: post #46
awinder wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/12/10/delhi-rape-one-conv... Of 706 reported rape cases, 1 lead to an actual conviction. So you have an under-reported category of crime which is irregularly prosecuted. There's obvious ethical issues with denying jobs to people based on accusation rather than conviction, but in a society with a broken justice system surrounding that, there's ethical dilemmas no matter how you slice…

[deleted]

Great idea, you could operate on a sliding scale that reduces the fare based on freakiness of the driver.

Make real killing by hiring a driver that torutured small animals and chronically wet the bed as a child, because although it has no real correlation with adult psychopathy you still save 8Rs/Km

Re: Uber banned from operating in Indian capital after rape accusation

#62

Post by hashx »

[deleted] wrote: post #53
awinder wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/12/10/delhi-rape-one-conv... Of 706 reported rape cases, 1 lead to an actual conviction. So you have an under-reported category of crime which is irregularly prosecuted. There's obvious ethical issues with denying jobs to people based on accusation rather than conviction, but in a society with a broken justice system surrounding that, there's ethical dilemmas no matter how you slice…

[deleted]

> Heck, they even elected quite a few convicted criminals to lead the Government

Can you give an example of a "convicted" (not accused) elected member from India?

>For example, a small search on Amit Shah and his fake encounters

Amit Shah has not been convicted. The case is ongoing.

>To me all this showdown to ban Uber seems more like an attempt to squeeze a little extra dollars from an American company.

By banning Uber they are trying to squeeze more dollars from it?

Re: Uber banned from operating in Indian capital after rape accusation

#63

Post by kyledrake »

tomp wrote: post #37
kyledrake wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I would often usually with you, the nature of sexual assault is that even in "developed" countries, it is very hard to convict people for committing these offenses, and very often the accused walk. I can only imagine how much worse this is in countries that are less than friendly to women (I am not saying that India is better or worse, I don't know). I don't think it would have hurt them to err on the side of c…

> I don't think it would have hurt them to err on the side of caution on this one. Erring "on the side of caution" in this case basically means denying someone a job, a livelihood, based on mere allegations that anyone can make. If you strictly enforce this (or even harsher variants, e.g. "no men sitting next to children on planes"), you make it very simple to ruin someone's life.

We're not talking about plane customers here, we're talking about the pilots. Finding trusted drivers in a situation where safety is important because people are in a unique position to trust that driver with their lives, with a startup that has to be extra-careful to prevent major controversies while they are under a heavy spotlight doing ambiguously legal things (or in the case of Portland a few days ago, just outright, unambiguously breaking the law and then trying to pass the legal buck to their drivers).

The notion that women are filing police reports and potentially going to court over something so serious is not really something I would describe as a simple way to ruin someone's life. Nor would Uber rejecting an application due to a sexual assault allegation really qualify to me as a life ruiner.

Law very often fails justice, particularly in sexual assault cases. When laws don't work, it's the job of a company to recognize when and how that failure occurs, and manage that risk. Uber failed to manage that risk, and most disturbingly, I can't even figure out if they care.

Re: Uber banned from operating in Indian capital after rape accusation

#64

Post by [deleted] »

tomp wrote: post #55
yummyfajitas wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which do you think will reduce rape right now ? A bunch of rapists showing up at hospitals with holes in them, or some sort of education campaign to change the culture? If things can get better in 10 years that's great. I'd also like the women I care about to be safe tomorrow. A few dead rapists is a small price to pay for that.

The only problem with your solution is that it would very likely increase the rate of murder , probably much more than it would decrease the rate of rape. (At least in EU and other countries where weapons are generally banned.)

[deleted]

Re: Uber banned from operating in Indian capital after rape accusation

#65

Post by mike_hearn »

what_ever wrote: post #54
mike_hearn wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How would that have achieved anything? You want a Minority Report-esque flying police department that drops themselves onto the road if the driver veers off route?

It seems to be doing okay with other cabs which have been operating for much longer.

Can you provide evidence for that?

It seems common sense that a GPS unit, even one that cannot be disabled, would only be useful as evidence to follow up on after an alleged crime took place. I don't see any way to use it to prevent a crime happening in the first place.

Re: Uber banned from operating in Indian capital after rape accusation

#66

Post by tdsamardzhiev »

yummyfajitas wrote: post #27
RealGeek wrote: post #10

Uber is not being banned just because of this rape incident. Uber did not following Indian laws & Delhi transport regulations, and operated illegally under the radar. Before this incident, Delhi Government was not aware about how Uber operated. This incident prompted Indian authorities to investigate the operations of Uber. Uber's stance is that we are not a taxi company, we are an app company; so we do not need to f…

Very true. If the Indian government were to shut down modes of transportation because of drivers engaging in rape, then you'd never see a rickshaw on the streets. http://indianexpress.com/article/cities/kolkata/woman-gangra... http://www.ndtv.com/article/cities/delhi-13-year-old-girl-al... I've spoken with one woman since this incident. She stills considers radio cabs (taxi4sure, specifically) safer than rickshaws or…

Legalizing weapons will lead to more women being raped. AND then shot. Which group do you think will be using arms more - 20-30yo uneducated, poor and agressive men or 13yo children and mothers of two.

Re: Uber banned from operating in Indian capital after rape accusation

#67

Post by dreamweapon »

From the very beginning, Uber has been fiercely proud of its eschewance of local regulations; and it's business model has always been, in a nutshell, about maximizing profit while offloading risk. So while I have no doubt that Travis is genuinely horrified by what happened, he shouldn't be in the least bit surprised, either.

Re: Uber banned from operating in Indian capital after rape accusation

#68

Post by bdcravens »

markogrady wrote: post #3

Ive recently been in Cape Town and people recommended using Uber because you can see the feed back info about the driver and the official cabs were quite dodgy.

Often the driver is someone other than the official Uber driver, so you lose that advantage.

Re: Uber banned from operating in Indian capital after rape accusation

#69

Post by snlacks »

atonse wrote: post #12
TheHypnotist wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed. It's also not as if these sexual assault cases are not well documented already. I wonder what Uber will say about this.

So what then, an Uber customer would have to just say "yeah ok rapes happen so let me keep taking Uber"? The point is, Uber is claiming to be better than cabbies in that they screen drivers, etc. Clearly they aren't doing anything of the sort. So they are as unsafe as taking any other cab.

I did not say that Uber doesn't have issues to address, I said that the Indian government has underlying issues, and can't scapegoat forever.

Not every situation in life has clear sides of "good guys" and "bad guys" or who's "to blame." Cause is a moving bar, and has different value depending what we are talking about causing.

Uber causes it's passengers to be in danger by not ensuring the people behind the wheel.

India on the other hand has a history of not punishing rapists. The guy gets acquitted of rape, because rape is too hard to prove under Indian law and because the juries are biased. edit: updated spelling

Re: Uber banned from operating in Indian capital after rape accusation

#70

Post by yummyfajitas »

adrianN wrote: post #51
yummyfajitas wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which do you think will reduce rape right now ? A bunch of rapists showing up at hospitals with holes in them, or some sort of education campaign to change the culture? If things can get better in 10 years that's great. I'd also like the women I care about to be safe tomorrow. A few dead rapists is a small price to pay for that.

If you want to reduce rape right now, you should start by putting more effort into getting rapists in jail. Currently three fourths of the rapists get away scot free. Get the police to do their job, don't force everybody to be their own police.

Getting the police to do their job would be great. How do you do it? Before answering that, ask yourself "why aren't they currently doing it?"

Currently three fourths of the rapists get away scot free.

Unless I'm failing to understand something, this statistic is almost unknowable. Can you explain?

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