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Microsoft takes .NET open source and cross-platform

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Re: Microsoft takes .NET open source and cross-platform

#831

Post by drdaeman »

sytelus wrote: post #655

Here's Github repo: https://github.com/dotnet . Wow, these things are being released under MIT licence - who would have thought .Net would be more "free-er" than Java? In other news: * Visual Studio 2015 and ASP.NET 5 will support gulp, grunt, bower and npm for front end developers. * OmniSharp is a family of Open Source projects, each with one goal - To enable great .NET development in YOUR editor of choice - http:/…

Given that the primary issue with .NET/CLR ecosystem adoption was not lack of implementations but unclear situation with software patents, I don't think MIT is a wise option. It's certainly up to Microsoft, but anything with an explicit patent grant would be a much better idea.

Re: Microsoft takes .NET open source and cross-platform

#832

Post by itsboring »

jpgvm wrote: post #61

I'm a hardcore *nix guy but boy do I love me some C#. Up until now it's been the best language I have worked with but the worst platform due to it's lack of 'nice things' that we just expect from languages/ecosystems these days. Where 'nice things' is defined as being open-source, having open-source ecosystem of developer tools etc. This isn't so much the beginning (as good stuff has been happening for a couple of ye…

I'm so onboard with what you're saying. I've been using mono for the last couple years, so much so that I call myself a "mono developer" and not a ".NET developer".

I worked at Microsoft for a couple years and I could already smell this brewing. The devs I respected the most were also the most unhappy with the platform tie-in. This is a desperately needed political shift for the organization, and I think it will actually boost morale as well.

Re: Microsoft takes .NET open source and cross-platform

#833

Post by Paradigma11 »

Rapzid wrote: post #768
useerup wrote: post #527

Earlier quoted context omitted.

async/await is HUGE. It opens an almost frictionless asynchronous pathway from your code all the way down to asynchronous capabilities of the underlying platform. Which was always the problem with leveraging async/overlapped IO: It was too complex and it turned your application logic inside-out because everything had to be performed in callbacks. async/await takes that on directly: You get everything executed in call…

Tasks are pretty awesome and just about as convenient as Go-routines. Now if we could just get typed channels in .Net >:]

Doesn't rx fill that role?

Re: Microsoft takes .NET open source and cross-platform

#834

Post by kbart »

edwinnathaniel wrote: post #307
elchief wrote: post #301

"Oh, shit", said Oracle.

Good, hopefully this pushes Oracle to refocus, reinvest in Java. Competition is good. Microsoft still have megatons of work to do to catch up Java (mindshare or tooling wise).

Good, hopefully this pushes Oracle to refocus, reinvest in Java.

I just hope they simply let it die at last. Of course, that's a subjective opinion, but Java is so ugly, that it's enough to keep me away from getting more into Android development.

Re: Microsoft takes .NET open source and cross-platform

#835

Post by Paradigma11 »

Pxtl wrote: post #727
EdwardDiego wrote: post #678

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is my main grudge with .NET development, a culture of preferring The One True Way. It (among other things) leads to a lack of .NET FOSS diversity.

The biggest problem with this culture is that it means that when the One True Way is wrong , we suck it up and use it anyways. I mean, Entity Framework is great, WebAPI is slick, and MVC has its moments, but there are some real trainswrecks. I've used all three XML serializers in the .NET framework and they're all cringeworthy. ASP.Net WebForms could have been something spectacular with open development instead of th…

Dont mock msbuild.

i never slept as much or as well than when i tried to work through the documentation.

Re: Microsoft takes .NET open source and cross-platform

#836

Post by itsboring »

frozenport wrote: post #773
Pxtl wrote: post #316

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Microsoft has been playing catch-up on developing that "nice things" like trying to build an open-source community. NuGet, open-sourcing the ASP.Net and EF stacks, etc. A long way to go, but they've recognized their big failing and are moving on it. MS makes some great technology and some terrible tech... but the problem is the terrible tech gets the same blessing as the great tech. An open-source community is the be…

The power of OSS is often overstated when it comes to writing user friendly software and the sorry state of the *nix GUIs, where setting up a multi motor setup like you do in Windows 98 is still a few years away. The reality is that best practices often conflict with the need to ship resulting is wasted time refactoring, and redesigning.

When my dad's laptop broke, he picked up my spare Ubuntu laptop and has been using it for the last two years. I know it's just one anecdote, but when it saves me a crap-ton of money and time, it seems very real to me. He could have asked me to buy Windows and Office for him... too bad for Microsoft he hasn't needed either. Game over.

Re: Microsoft takes .NET open source and cross-platform

#837

Post by Matthias247 »

Rapzid wrote: post #768
useerup wrote: post #527

Earlier quoted context omitted.

async/await is HUGE. It opens an almost frictionless asynchronous pathway from your code all the way down to asynchronous capabilities of the underlying platform. Which was always the problem with leveraging async/overlapped IO: It was too complex and it turned your application logic inside-out because everything had to be performed in callbacks. async/await takes that on directly: You get everything executed in call…

Tasks are pretty awesome and just about as convenient as Go-routines. Now if we could just get typed channels in .Net >:]

How about BlockingCollection? If I understand it correctly you can even have select like sementics with BlockingCollection.TakeFromAny(...)

Edit: Sorry, messed it up a little bit. BlockingCollection will block your current thread for any other computation and does not allow to await on it.

But there seem to be alternatives: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/21225361/is-there-anythin... http://blog.stephencleary.com/2012/12/async-producer-consume...

Re: Microsoft takes .NET open source and cross-platform

#838

Post by nmeofthestate »

fit2rule wrote: post #763
daigoba66 wrote: post #361

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair, the source code for most of the core .NET libraries has been freely available under a "reference source license" for a very long time now. You could look behind the curtain, you just can't modify or redistribute.

So it was not really 'open' then, was it? More like "sources available for reading only" ..

Yes, but this open-ness is irrelevant to your point - "developers still want to know whats going on behind the curtain"

Re: Microsoft takes .NET open source and cross-platform

#839

Post by koyote »

Pxtl wrote: post #727
EdwardDiego wrote: post #678

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is my main grudge with .NET development, a culture of preferring The One True Way. It (among other things) leads to a lack of .NET FOSS diversity.

The biggest problem with this culture is that it means that when the One True Way is wrong , we suck it up and use it anyways. I mean, Entity Framework is great, WebAPI is slick, and MVC has its moments, but there are some real trainswrecks. I've used all three XML serializers in the .NET framework and they're all cringeworthy. ASP.Net WebForms could have been something spectacular with open development instead of th…

>I've used all three XML serializers in the .NET framework and they're all cringeworthy.

XmlSerializer, DataContractSerializer, and what is the third? I agree and was about to point out the same thing though; XML serializers in .NET are a joke but because they exist in the core libraries there is not really a compelling open source alternative.

That being said, it seems like the Asp.Net Web API is actually using Json.Net instead of the built-in serializer.

Re: Microsoft takes .NET open source and cross-platform

#840

Post by tkubacki »

alkonaut wrote: post #585
jacquesm wrote: post #542

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So who is? Linus Torvalds, RMS, Guido van Rossum, and a very long list of other open source contributors who were writing open source code before it was 'hip' or good PR.

Those guys do (did) some great things. However, I wasn't asking about who was a cool developer or great OSS personality (Or a crazy person or obnoxius mailing list asshat for that matter :) ) I meant, when it comes to choosing a platform/language/IDE for enterprise dev or mobile/cloud dev, there are lots of options but most of the "big" ones also come from megacorps (Oracle, Google...) What scared people most about .…

I think people didn't trust MS because of Android patent extortion fees (which they still do BTW) and Mono was covered only partially by patent promise. I still don't know if every part of Mono is "patent promise" covered (by MS).

I don't believe MS would sue some random ISV but let's assume Google today forks Mono - will this be safe for them to use ?

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