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The Meditations by Marcus Aurelius

classics.mit.edu

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Re: The Meditations by Marcus Aurelius

#81

Post by super_mario »

michaelsbradley wrote: post #75
Luc wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can see from your profile that it's your thing to pipe up with Christian literature at every occasion. Don't get the impression you are providing a wonderful service here; it's very annoying to see Christianity dragged into otherwise pleasant subjects.

I try to cheerfully bring Christ and the Christian Faith into every dimension of my life, public and private, because I believe it is a good thing to do, regardless of what others may think of me and my words and actions, or whatever consequences may ensue. Of course, I try to practice good manners in every circumstance and to give due regard to the Savior's words: "Behold, I send you out as sheep in the midst of wol…

Except Christianity is now a debunked lie, a failed hypothesis. So you mindlessly repeating the same old lies over and over again, like no one ever heard of them before, gets really tiring really fast.

Perhaps instead of giving up to the mind virus so readily, you should try and read up on why Christianity is false and try to learn something we do know about the universe we live in.

Re: The Meditations by Marcus Aurelius

#82

Post by Luc »

geofft wrote: post #80
Luc wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> One of the things people do when discussing HN topics is share other resources that they feel have some bearing on the topic at hand; it also seems to be a common practice to offer alternative perspectives, complementary ideas and criticisms related to the OP or comments on it. However, one of the things most people here don't do is use HN as a convenient platform to push their beliefs at every possible occasion. >…

> However, one of the things most people here don't do is use HN as a convenient platform to push their beliefs at every possible occasion. I find that claim implausible... I see a lot of beliefs being pushed, like "Startup culture is great" or "Startup culture is awful" or "Those people should have a better security response story" or "Don't use tables for layout" or "MAC-then-encrypt is a mistake". I would expect t…

Perhaps I wasn't 100% clear. 'Pushing beliefs' is, I'm quite sure, commonly understood to be about religious beliefs, which are of a different class than 'belief' in CSS being superior to HTML tables.

Proselytism on HN should not be okay. This is not something you'd want to leave to up and down votes, in my opinion.

Re: The Meditations by Marcus Aurelius

#84

Post by super_mario »

super_mario wrote: post #81
michaelsbradley wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I try to cheerfully bring Christ and the Christian Faith into every dimension of my life, public and private, because I believe it is a good thing to do, regardless of what others may think of me and my words and actions, or whatever consequences may ensue. Of course, I try to practice good manners in every circumstance and to give due regard to the Savior's words: "Behold, I send you out as sheep in the midst of wol…

Except Christianity is now a debunked lie, a failed hypothesis. So you mindlessly repeating the same old lies over and over again, like no one ever heard of them before, gets really tiring really fast. Perhaps instead of giving up to the mind virus so readily, you should try and read up on why Christianity is false and try to learn something we do know about the universe we live in.

Amazing how every single time Christian sheep just downvote any dissenting view, but no one ever has the curiosity to ask "how do you know that" and what evidence is there to debunk Christianity, yet again confirming this whole "evidence based reasoning" business is completely foreign to them, which is why they are religious in the first place.

Re: The Meditations by Marcus Aurelius

#85

Post by jonstewart »

michaelsbradley wrote: post #66
jonstewart wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I, too, keep a copy on the nightstand. It's the stoic's bible.

Those interested in Stoicism, and who are curious if and how its ideals might be "baptized" and employed in a Christian philosophy of life, ought to look into the writings of Fr. Alphonsus Rodriguez, who has been described by some as a "Christian Seneca": Practice of Perfection and Christian Virtues https://archive.org/details/PPCV-Manresa

Thanks, I'm not.

Re: The Meditations by Marcus Aurelius

#86

Post by randallsquared »

tjradcliffe wrote: post #70
randallsquared wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately, looking at what other entities do doesn't provide any answer to what you ought to do. Is vs ought is a serious problem, unsolved and (as far as I can see) unsolvable. We end up doing things for no reason other than that we feel like it. But, if your philosophy suggests that you should do things in spite of how you feel, that's going to be a problem.

What is it about you that makes you think the is-ought problem is a problem you ought to be worried about? Advocates of the importance of the is-ought problem want us to be deeply concerned about it, but they never explain why we ought to be. And in fact, we ought not be worried about it whether it is solved, unsolved or unsolvable: Once we identify what it is in our nature that makes solving the is-ought problem a p…

> What is it about you that makes you think the is-ought problem is a problem you ought to be worried about?

If it turns out that there is an ultimate ought, then finding that out seems very likely to contribute to doing what I ought to do. If there isn't, then by thinking about it I am wasting no resources that I ought to be spending elsewhere. :)

We don't necessarily disagree on whether ultimate moral justifications exist, I think.

Re: The Meditations by Marcus Aurelius

#87

Post by eli_gottlieb »

tjradcliffe wrote: post #70
randallsquared wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately, looking at what other entities do doesn't provide any answer to what you ought to do. Is vs ought is a serious problem, unsolved and (as far as I can see) unsolvable. We end up doing things for no reason other than that we feel like it. But, if your philosophy suggests that you should do things in spite of how you feel, that's going to be a problem.

What is it about you that makes you think the is-ought problem is a problem you ought to be worried about? Advocates of the importance of the is-ought problem want us to be deeply concerned about it, but they never explain why we ought to be. And in fact, we ought not be worried about it whether it is solved, unsolved or unsolvable: Once we identify what it is in our nature that makes solving the is-ought problem a p…

Don't be silly: of course there's such a thing as ultimate moral justification. It just doesn't come from the meta-ethical theories most people were raised with, these being divine command (deontological, duty-based) and divine blessing (consequentialist, value-based), both of which indoctrinate people to believe morality requires metaphysical magic sauce be poured over normal things to turn them from normal (is) to normatively relevant (ought).

Re: The Meditations by Marcus Aurelius

#88

Post by eli_gottlieb »

super_mario wrote: post #84
super_mario wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except Christianity is now a debunked lie, a failed hypothesis. So you mindlessly repeating the same old lies over and over again, like no one ever heard of them before, gets really tiring really fast. Perhaps instead of giving up to the mind virus so readily, you should try and read up on why Christianity is false and try to learn something we do know about the universe we live in.

Amazing how every single time Christian sheep just downvote any dissenting view, but no one ever has the curiosity to ask "how do you know that" and what evidence is there to debunk Christianity, yet again confirming this whole "evidence based reasoning" business is completely foreign to them, which is why they are religious in the first place.

Actually, I'm downvoting both you and Mr Online Evangelist. You know, people who really believe in naturalism and science don't feel the need to wave flags for "ATHEISM(TM)" or yack about "Christian sheep". You know why? Because we know damn well how the world is, so we don't have to BELIEVE(TM) in it. It's just how the world is.

And one of the things about how the world really is, is that you can't change people's minds about the universe by calling them "sheep" or "sharing the Light of the Redeemer" or any such methods. None of this engages anyone in the intellectual and emotional calm needed to actually change their views based on reasoned discussion, nor does any of it provide evidence for, well, anything in particular.

So please, just head off to /r/DebateReligion or something.

Re: The Meditations by Marcus Aurelius

#89

Post by super_mario »

eli_gottlieb wrote: post #88
super_mario wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Amazing how every single time Christian sheep just downvote any dissenting view, but no one ever has the curiosity to ask "how do you know that" and what evidence is there to debunk Christianity, yet again confirming this whole "evidence based reasoning" business is completely foreign to them, which is why they are religious in the first place.

Actually, I'm downvoting both you and Mr Online Evangelist. You know, people who really believe in naturalism and science don't feel the need to wave flags for "ATHEISM(TM)" or yack about "Christian sheep". You know why? Because we know damn well how the world is, so we don't have to BELIEVE(TM) in it. It's just how the world is. And one of the things about how the world really is , is that you can't change people's…

What an incredibly stupid thing to say. Yes, we do know how the natural world works but it is tenet of Abrahamic religions (and Christianity in particular) that naturalism is not true. And I would not really care about it if these people left it at that.

But these people get to vote too you know. What person believes influences strongly what they do and what they want. There is no such thing as a private belief. What you believe about the physical world and what you base your beliefs on determines how you behave, what policies you support, if you will deny scientific facts, what you want your kids taught in schools, etc.

If that weren't enough some of these people find it irresistible temptation to "share" their delusions to the point they want their brand of belief instituted in laws and constitution of the country, and things like commandments displayed in schools and courtrooms almost like graven images.

This is why they must be engaged in debate, discussion and idiocy of their beliefs pointed out. There is no polite way to tell someone that what they hold as most precious and dearest thing is false, and debunked. But it has to be done, esp. now that we live in times when we do know, are free to say so.

And the only reason we are having this discussion is precisely because these people feel the need to discuss and share their beliefs, because they can't be happy until you believe it too, and until every knee bows. The stipulation to proselytize is in the holy books.

Re: The Meditations by Marcus Aurelius

#90

Post by shitehawk »

michaelsbradley wrote: post #75
Luc wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can see from your profile that it's your thing to pipe up with Christian literature at every occasion. Don't get the impression you are providing a wonderful service here; it's very annoying to see Christianity dragged into otherwise pleasant subjects.

I try to cheerfully bring Christ and the Christian Faith into every dimension of my life, public and private, because I believe it is a good thing to do, regardless of what others may think of me and my words and actions, or whatever consequences may ensue. Of course, I try to practice good manners in every circumstance and to give due regard to the Savior's words: "Behold, I send you out as sheep in the midst of wol…

Do you consider a Rastafarian's religious beliefs just as valid as yours? If not kindly piss off.
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