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Police allow car break-ins to become a Seattle growth industry

seattletimes.com

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Re: Police allow car break-ins to become a Seattle growth industry

#131

Post by DanBC »

Kalium wrote: post #129
DanBC wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"don't stigmatise people with a mental illness" is the call to action. Stigma prevents people getting help, even for mild MH problems that respond well to talking therapy. Stigma increases social isolation and reduces opportunities for work. We know that both of these make mental illness worse.

I disagree. It's a negative step - don't do X, for some value of X. OK. Fine. What's next? I asked in search of positive steps.

Tackling stigma is a positive step. I don't know why you don't get that. It is more than just "don't do x".

You're just arguing about words.

"Don't discriminate against people with a mental illness when recruiting for a job" becomes "give people with a mental illness the same treatment at job interviews".

But if you want a bigger list:

Reform the broken healthcare model in the US

Push for evidence based treatment. This will usually be a short course of CBT; sometimes it'll be a talking therapy and meds. Sometimes it'll be meds and talking therapies and weekly / monthly visits from a nurse or an occupational therapist. Rarely it'll be a stay in hospital. Even more rarely it'll be a forced stay in hospital against the patient's wishes. Even more rarely it'll be a forensic hospitalisation - a forced stay in hospital ordered by the courts instead of a prison stay.

Push for employment programmes to get people with a mental illness back into employment. See for example the Sainsbury Centre for Mental Health documents http://www.centreformentalhealth.org.uk/pdfs/dwp_commissioni...

Push for social inclusion programmes; volunteer for those programmes;

San Francisco has a death by suicide rate of 9.8 per 100,000. There is probably some work to do around funding suicide prevention work (which happens earlier than a suicide attempt) and funding suicide intervention (which happens around the time of an attempt). http://www.sfhip.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=NS-Indicato...

Re: Police allow car break-ins to become a Seattle growth industry

#132

Post by Chronic29 »

mikeyouse wrote: post #128
Mandatum wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

$10,000 per person? That's more than a third of the annual income per person for that state. Wow.

But not for people in the city.. SF County is the 2nd wealthiest in the state and gets significant tax revenue from tourists (via Sales taxes, Hotel taxes, etc.).

The trolling in posts below is top notch.

Re: Police allow car break-ins to become a Seattle growth industry

#133

Post by barry-cotter »

BadassFractal wrote: post #38
panarky wrote: post #24

Take care of the small stuff and the big stuff will take care of itself. The broken windows theory is a criminological theory of the norm-setting and signaling effect of urban disorder and vandalism on additional crime and anti-social behavior. The theory states that maintaining and monitoring urban environments in a well-ordered condition may stop further vandalism and escalation into more serious crime[1]. From the…

Just yesterday in the civic center area here in SF I'm getting a sandwich and this mentally ill (or really high, or both) bum lady walks into the shop and proceeds to howl at the top of her lungs for 10 minutes, dance around the shop, kick down a bunch of seats. Right next to her is a hole in the wall punched by some other mentally infirm person that same day. Nothing. The staff is used to it, I'm used to it, the oth…

You live in San Francisco, what do you expect? When was it last a normal city?

Re: Police allow car break-ins to become a Seattle growth industry

#134

Post by WildUtah »

GabrielF00 wrote: post #106
WildUtah wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not true at all. California cops can make $200k a year cash just with overtime and incentives. Including pension schemes and other benefits, it's common for mid-career CA cops to make upwards of $500k. Consider that 25 year CHP officers can collect lifetime pensions at the highest pay, including overtime accumulated from previous years and cashed out. At a US inflation adjusted bond discount rate of 0-1% typic…

>Including pension schemes and other benefits, it's common for mid-career CA cops to make upwards of $500k. Could you provide a source for this? I checked the salary database for the city and county of San Francisco and, while there were 2099 people in the police department with total pay over $100,000, nobody had total pay of $500,000 - and the maximum was $345,000. http://www.sfgate.com/news/databases/?appSession=4…

Base salaries are often only $100k but then generous vacation compensation, incentives, 2x and 3x overtime, and such bring it close to $200k. Gold plated health and other benefits often bring current compensation for CA cops (CHP, BART, SF, &c) over $200k.

Then generous pensions kick in. CA cops and firemen usually get full pensions after 20-25 years but the pension is paid not just on salary but a multiple of final year vacation and comp time. Pensions can be 2x-3.5x final 'base' salary and higher than any overtime adjusted salary. CalPERS is hoping for 5% above inflation returns but for a decade has made about 1%. At 1%, you essentially have to save or take on future liability for the whole pension during working life. No private employer provides these benefits after 20-25 years or on this basis at all because it would mean bankruptcy.

Public finance allows it so the total compensation of a cop getting $200k in salary, adjustments, and benefits is often over $500k all in. Some of that will be the bankruptcy and bailout.

Google "Vallejo firefighter bankruptcy" for details of CA's future public safety service.

Re: Police allow car break-ins to become a Seattle growth industry

#135

Post by nroets »

iramiller wrote: post #47

Perhaps this is a also a growth opportunity for a private security firm. Call us, we will use our trained armed personnel to confront the suspects and return your stuff. I would hope that it would not take too many incidents of private security 'resolving' issues to see that a police force doing its job is a far more preferred solution.

Individuals contracting private security firms is rarely cost effective: For armed response to be effective, they need to be fast. So the firm needs a high geographic concentration. If they achieve that, they have a monopoly and can charge what they want.

Paying collectively for security is much better.

Re: Police allow car break-ins to become a Seattle growth industry

#136

Post by orbifold »

WildUtah wrote: post #98
richard_cubano wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not funding. It's the relative power of unions. In California, a cop costs $200k a year, when pensions and health care are factored in.

That's not true at all. California cops can make $200k a year cash just with overtime and incentives. Including pension schemes and other benefits, it's common for mid-career CA cops to make upwards of $500k. Consider that 25 year CHP officers can collect lifetime pensions at the highest pay, including overtime accumulated from previous years and cashed out. At a US inflation adjusted bond discount rate of 0-1% typic…

Those figures made me realize how incredibly skewed the income distribution in the US must be, police in Germany is payed pretty much the same everywhere and nowhere near that much, especially patrol officers.

Re: Police allow car break-ins to become a Seattle growth industry

#137

Post by wozniacki »

Kalium wrote: post #125
wozniacki wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whatever you do in manner of becoming vocal about such dysfunctions, attending SFPD meetings, building support for ballot measures by getting the community involved and other efforts to address dysfunction, graft and full blown corruption in the city's affairs ... whatever else you do Please Do Not Leave The City Set down roots here if you want to change the way this city functions and lives. If you can, own a home (…

As I understand current SF politics, trying to change things makes you the subject of hatred and protests. Not an encouraging set of results.

How can this possibly be?

How is it possible for the leftists to have an absolute stranglehold on San Francisco politics, especially for so long?

Is there not even a moderate wing, here?

Re: Police allow car break-ins to become a Seattle growth industry

#138

Post by ck2 »

So 911 honestly believed the thieves were armed and dangerous and refused to dispatch? There's a lawsuit right there.

If they thought the victim was going to get shot, then you should have said, I am going right over there now to 123 Main Street to confront them in so-and-so colored car.

Then you wait and when the police show up at that car THEN you go over and make the theft claim.

Victim was entirely too polite with dispatch.

Re: Police allow car break-ins to become a Seattle growth industry

#139

Post by [deleted] »

randallsquared wrote: post #27
Sonicmouse wrote: post #19

If it were a celebrity or any other high-profile citizen, you know they would bring out the SWAT team and the criminals would be locked up for 20 years. But, when it's a "nobody important" tax paying citizen, then go f-yourself. Congrats goes out to everyone who voted in the current representatives. Wonderful job.

Do you really believe that voting in team A instead of team B would have helped ordinary citizens?

[deleted]
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