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I’m Terrified of My New TV

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Re: I’m Terrified of My New TV

#121

Post by forgottenacc56 »

tedks wrote: post #47

We need a Butlerian Jihad against surveillance. You know what will never stop this? Posts on hacker news. Letters to your congressman (LG can donate a fuqton more to his re-election campaign than you can). Voting with your dollar (people who know what a privacy policy is are few and far between). You know what will? Taking these TVs into the street, smashing and burning them. Mobs storming Best Buy and smashing the s…

You're clearly a terrorist. Or whatever the correct synonym is for an American who disagrees with authority.

Re: I’m Terrified of My New TV

#122

Post by jamesjyu »

spiritplumber wrote: post #91
tempestn wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find Netflix and YouTube built into the TV extremely useful. Also the fact that it has a half-decent DLNA client (which I connect to Plex on my home server), and can accept screencasting from my phone. I considered building a HTPC, but realized these features cover 99% of what I would use it for, and for the rest I can just use a laptop.

I've had all these features for years thanks to a netbook with a busted battery and a projector I got off some business or other closing up shop. The netbook runs linux mint and runs what I wants it to, and no more. This stuff doesn't need a butlerian jihad, it needs a DIY surge.

Normal folks are simply going to want this stuff integrated into the TV. It's convenient and doesn't require any more assembly.

Heck, I can DIY it myself but I don't, because smart TVs have the apps and features that are baseline useful. And because it's integrated, I don't need to make sure to turn on some other device to get access.

Re: I’m Terrified of My New TV

#123

Post by me_again »

diminoten wrote: post #94
tedks wrote: post #47

We need a Butlerian Jihad against surveillance. You know what will never stop this? Posts on hacker news. Letters to your congressman (LG can donate a fuqton more to his re-election campaign than you can). Voting with your dollar (people who know what a privacy policy is are few and far between). You know what will? Taking these TVs into the street, smashing and burning them. Mobs storming Best Buy and smashing the s…

I just don't understand why I'm not allowed to give away my privacy for convenience, in your eyes. I think you'd be surprised at a) how many people realize they're having their data collected and b) how few people care. Is it a risk? Yes. So is driving a car, but I'm not willing to put up with the inconvenience of not being able to drive somewhere.

There may be a slightly-strained analogy to be made here with vaccinations and herd immunity. Just as refusing vaccinations makes others in more danger of contracting infections, willfully allowing yourself to be surveilled makes it more difficult for others to avoid surveillance.

Anyway, are you saying that you personally have no problem with a TV that listens to you, or that you don't like it but other people might not object?

Re: I’m Terrified of My New TV

#124

Post by nl »

click170 wrote: post #35
kibwen wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you recommend any resources for getting started?

Every time I say this I feel like a shill because I worked for them briefly, but Sophos has a Home version of their UTM firewall (0). It has pros and cons, but overall I think it's pretty good (even after working there). Some other options include Sonicwall and pfsense, and I encourage others to post their suggestions as well. I haven't used SonicWall, though I have used pfsense strictly as a firewall. (0) http://www…

Any hardware solution recommendations - or things that will run on a RPi/router?

I don't like the idea of having to keep a desktop/laptop computer on 24/7.

Re: I’m Terrified of My New TV

#125

Post by hibiscus »

Realistically the only thing that will ever change the evolving IOT industry (which is what is breeding the surveillance) is people actively choosing to buy privacy-enhancing or privacy protective products. Do we really need internet connected TV's? Does this author ever plan on using these features or is he just keeping up with the Jones? More importantly -- what does the average user think? Would they ever even bother to find the privacy policy (if you can even call it that at 46 pages) let alone read it?

To the author: if you have a problem with your TV, especially if you are actually 'terrified' of it, perhaps consider returning it and buying a normal one?

Re: I’m Terrified of My New TV

#126

Post by millstone »

bruce511 wrote: post #19

I'm probably not normal, but frankly I would just leave it unplugged from the Internet. At the end of the day my current tv does what I need to do (ie act as a big monitor) without an internet connection. Given the number of devices already floating around here for browsing the web, I don't really need my tv to do that. For streaming I have Chromecast or whatever. I get that tv makers want to sell me something, but t…

I think you are the rule, not the exception. Most people won't bother connecting their TV to the Internet, if for no other reason than it's a huge hassle. Ever tried to type a WiFi password with a remote?

But if TVs start phoning home on their own terms, without my WiFi password or Ethernet cable, then it becomes terrifying.

Re: I’m Terrified of My New TV

#127

Post by neurobro »

hibiscus wrote: post #125

Realistically the only thing that will ever change the evolving IOT industry (which is what is breeding the surveillance) is people actively choosing to buy privacy-enhancing or privacy protective products. Do we really need internet connected TV's? Does this author ever plan on using these features or is he just keeping up with the Jones? More importantly -- what does the average user think? Would they ever even bot…

I wonder if there are enough privacy advocates to convince stores to stop carrying invasive products by buying the product and then returning it, citing the privacy policy. Question is whether the store would actually stop selling the products or just change the return policy.

Re: I’m Terrified of My New TV

#128

Post by jamesaguilar »

d23 wrote: post #79
tedks wrote: post #47

We need a Butlerian Jihad against surveillance. You know what will never stop this? Posts on hacker news. Letters to your congressman (LG can donate a fuqton more to his re-election campaign than you can). Voting with your dollar (people who know what a privacy policy is are few and far between). You know what will? Taking these TVs into the street, smashing and burning them. Mobs storming Best Buy and smashing the s…

If you don't think you're going to be able to get people riled up enough to stop purchasing the TVs, what makes you think you're going to have them vandalizing private property?

That would be a little thing called wishful thinking.

Personally, I think the reason people aren't up in arms is pretty clear. People get up in arms about things that harm them -- oppressive governments (Arab Spring), desperate economic conditions (Ukraine), etc. Real stuff.

People don't get up in arms about tracking because it does not hurt them. Not: does not hurt them except in subtle ways they don't even notice. It doesn't hurt them at all, with very few exceptions. That's all there is to it.

Re: I’m Terrified of My New TV

#129

Post by millstone »

pmoriarty wrote: post #68

The author is afraid of his smart TV, but probably doesn't think twice about carrying around a smartphone. Smartphones have virtually all of the capabilities that make the author fear his smart TV, only the smartphone is, if anything, even more dangerous because it is more ubiquitous. People carry their phones around everywhere, and the phones are usually constantly on and equally capable of monitoring your every wor…

Your point about a smartphone's capabilities is well taken. But the TV straight-up says that your personal information will be captured and transmitted to a third party.

I value my privacy, and trust (hope?) that my phone isn't transmitting that sort of stuff. If it did, I think it would be discovered and made public very quickly, and I would switch phones! But since the TV straight out says that it transmits my personal information, and I have no reason to doubt it, I'll be sure to not use that TV, or at least not connect it to the Internet.

We can trust others to safeguard our privacy, as a sort of calculated risk. But this TV is just saying out loud that it won't do that, so I'll avoid that model.

Re: I’m Terrified of My New TV

#130

Post by curiouscats »

lurchpop wrote: post #24

Went through this recently at Best Buy. The salesperson said by next year they may no longer carry any "dumb" tvs. Currently, those options are almost gone. I didn't see any dumb tvs over 40" and there were no 4Ks without "smart" features. I plan on just blocking it in my router, but who knows if the TV scans around for open hotspots. If I were a "smart" developer Id store everything locally if offline, then dump to…

The market would produce privacy TVs if people would not buy spy TVs. I would think there is enough of a market to produce such TVs and advertise them that way.

But what matters is if someone that is in a position to actually provide such TVs (and do a decent enough job producing and marketing them) to let the market decide. I know the HackerNews community has much more awareness of this issue than most people but it is something a fairly large number of people care about.

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