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Tim Cook Speaks Up

businessweek.com

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Re: Tim Cook Speaks Up

#711

Post by theseoafs »

downandout wrote: post #611
thenmar wrote: post #600

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please don't respond to me with disrespectful and disruptive snark. Nobody was fired. Nobody went to jail. There was no "stifled discourse". If you'd like to elaborate specifically, then please do.

Ok, forced out. Is that more palatable? He was, for all intents and purposes, fired. For expressing a political opinion. In a country that prides itself on being a democracy. If that isn't stifling political discourse, what exactly is it?

Murdering someone or throwing them in a prison because they spoke out against the regime is stifling political discourse. Having to step down as CEO of a company because your unpopular political opinions resulted in a vast number of people boycotting your company's products is just a consequence of the way the free market works.

Re: Tim Cook Speaks Up

#712

Post by [deleted] »

downandout wrote: post #611
thenmar wrote: post #600

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please don't respond to me with disrespectful and disruptive snark. Nobody was fired. Nobody went to jail. There was no "stifled discourse". If you'd like to elaborate specifically, then please do.

Ok, forced out. Is that more palatable? He was, for all intents and purposes, fired. For expressing a political opinion. In a country that prides itself on being a democracy. If that isn't stifling political discourse, what exactly is it?

[deleted]

Re: Tim Cook Speaks Up

#713

Post by phaemon »

benihana wrote: post #511
angersock wrote: post #380

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eich participated in a public system in an approved way at a political level, did so without letting his politics get in the way of his personal or professional life, and made functional programming ubiquitous. There's nothing wrong with what he did given that he didn't let that view (in the abstract) color his personal interactions. And, let us note, it's all speculation on this point as to what or why he did it, be…

>By contrast, Tim Cook continued contracts with Foxconn with the sole goal of minimizing production costs by using underpaid overworked labor Do you have any proof of this or citations on it? Everything I've seen about Apple regarding its supply chain is that it goes above and beyond the minimum needed to be in compliance, and they seem to genuinely care about the well being of their employees in China.

> goes above and beyond the minimum needed to be in compliance

Awesome. I need that line added to my CV. Something like: "Conscientious worker, who often goes above and beyond the minimum needed to be in compliance."

Re: Tim Cook Speaks Up

#714

Post by castis »

Throwaway1224 wrote: post #597

I'm prepared to get negative points for this, but who really cares if he is gay or straight?

There are a lot of people that care, in both directions. One day in humanity's future, sexual orientation will be a non-issue. However, this day and age, there is still a fight to be fought.

I don't care that he's gay, and it's nice that people can be who they are and not be persecuted for it. However, other countries do far worse than vent their frustrations about the morality and social pioneering of it all on messageboards. You're not wrong for asking who really cares in the least bit. It's actually kind of nice that you don't care. Not from an apathetic standpoint, but that it's so little of a deal to you that you remain wholly unaffected.

As weird as this may sound, I wish more people were like you.

Re: Tim Cook Speaks Up

#715

Post by notjackma »

jackmaney wrote: post #689
downandout wrote: post #608

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He was forced out, as everyone is well aware. You are advocating for a society where political intimidation is acceptable. There are many examples of such countries around the world. None have worked out well.

> He was forced out, as everyone is well aware. No, he was not. https://blog.mozilla.org/blog/2014/04/05/faq-on-ceo-resignat... Brendan was not fired and was not asked by the Board to resign. Brendan voluntarily submitted his resignation. The Board acted in response by inviting him to remain at Mozilla in another C-level position. Brendan declined that offer. The Board respects his decision.

I can't believe that anybody would be so naive to believe that Brendan wasn't forced out.

Every single day, there is an employee going to work in a hostile environment, shunned by co-workers or left to sit in an empty room with no work to perform. Eventually they'll be forced to resign in order to save their own sanity.

Re: Tim Cook Speaks Up

#716

Post by V-2 »

oneeyedpigeon wrote: post #145
meowface wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I actually think he makes a reasonable point, if you read his last sentence carefully. Realistically, it doesn't make much sense to be "proud" of being gay, just like it doesn't make sense to be "proud" of being white. It makes sense to be proud for staying strong in the face of discrimination and hate speech, but being gay itself is not worthy of any pride.

In this context, when someone says they are "proud to be gay", I think they are strongly inferring the "staying strong in the face of discrimination" aspect since, unfortunately, that's pretty much a given. Also, historically, people have thought being gay is something to be 'ashamed' of, and I think this use of 'proud' is in contrast to that - cf. gay pride marches. No one ever thought being white was something to b…

    No one ever thought being white was something to be ashamed of.
Really? Quite a lot of people think so.

Re: Tim Cook Speaks Up

#717

Post by notjackma »

vor_ wrote: post #489
notjackma wrote: post #418

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Semantics. The fact is, of registered voters in California, more people voted against same-sex marriage than for it. Of course, that was 6 years ago... so why should Brendan Eich be ostracised in 2014 for donating money to a campaign which was quite popular back then? At what point did Mozilla's mission for a free and open internet turn into one about social justice and identity politics?

> Of course, that was 6 years ago... so why should Brendan Eich be ostracised in 2014 for donating money to a campaign which was quite popular back then? It's wrong regardless of when it occurred. > At what point did Mozilla's mission for a free and open internet turn into one about social justice and identity politics? This lame attempt to dismiss equality won't fly.

> It's wrong regardless of when it occurred.

The world is a big place with different cultures and different opinions.

You are making a giant assumption that your world-view is the correct one.

Re: Tim Cook Speaks Up

#718

Post by oldmanjay »

general_failure wrote: post #455
stephenr wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The most dangerous company of all time?

Yes, dangerous because of it's reach. I am not very excited to live in a walled garden. A massive one as that.

Do you fear that the world gov't will pass the "everyone must use apple act" soon?

Re: Tim Cook Speaks Up

#719

Post by oneeyedpigeon »

V-2 wrote: post #716
oneeyedpigeon wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In this context, when someone says they are "proud to be gay", I think they are strongly inferring the "staying strong in the face of discrimination" aspect since, unfortunately, that's pretty much a given. Also, historically, people have thought being gay is something to be 'ashamed' of, and I think this use of 'proud' is in contrast to that - cf. gay pride marches. No one ever thought being white was something to b…

No one ever thought being white was something to be ashamed of. Really? Quite a lot of people think so.

Maybe, but only out of guilt, as a reaction to what has occurred throughout history. Not 'just because' they're white.

Re: Tim Cook Speaks Up

#720

Post by icebraining »

downandout wrote: post #608
smtddr wrote: post #592

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>I don't believe in the cause that Eich donated to. But taking away someone's job over a political donation is preposterous and disturbing. Let's keep in mind nobody legally kicked him out. He left because he couldn't deal with the consequences of his actions. The law protects your free speech, but does not protect you from the consequences of it. http://xkcd.com/1357/ Also, let's not forget how nasty the whole prop…

He was forced out, as everyone is well aware. You are advocating for a society where political intimidation is acceptable. There are many examples of such countries around the world. None have worked out well.

You are advocating for a society where political intimidation is acceptable. There are many examples of such countries around the world. None have worked out well.

All countries have some level of acceptable political intimidation; that you think otherwise just means your views are sufficiently mainstream. Try embracing more fringe ideologies in a public way.

I suggest supporting and donating to Wahhabist movements and seeing how it goes for you.

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