Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Spain is trying to get rid of Uber: drivers will face fines up to €18K

novobrief.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

91–100 of 102 posts

Re: Spain is trying to get rid of Uber: drivers will face fines up to €18K

#91

Post by alkonaut »

james1071 wrote: post #85
xamolxix wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> My guess: taxi license/medallions are a relic that is bound to disappear pretty quickly. Since in some places people have to BUY these things, it's obviously not going to be done overnight. I agree, however until they lawfully become a thing of the past is not fair to people who have bought them (or followed the possibly lengthy procedure of getting licensed)

It will be hard to maintain the current structure when Uber can offer a better, cheaper service.

I can't see how they can offer a cheaper service once all major companies have decent apps, dynamic pricing etc. At least here decent apps are standard for all major companies on the market (no live tracking or pre payment but at least very good booking and price info up front). Given that a lot of the income for the major taxi companies come from major deals (school rides, elderly, large corporations) that uber won't take, I don't even think they need to adopt all of ubers' practices to compete with them. As a matter of fact I don't think Uber is any cheaper!

Re: Spain is trying to get rid of Uber: drivers will face fines up to €18K

#92

Post by netcan »

pron wrote: post #86
netcan wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand this approach. It's as if we'd never seen politics or economics in action and therefore our best guess comes from musings. Democracy does not equal the will or the good of the people in some hermetically perfect way. The reality is that in both economics and democracy entrenched culture, institutions and interest groups gain power. They guard it and enlarge it. They quickly develop the belief that…

Yeah, democracy sucks, but being ruled by VCs carrying the BS banner of "innovation" is far worse. What you see as corrupt institutions, I see as the possibly outdated results of many years of political bargaining, which -- like everything else -- requires the occasional shakeup. But I'd much rather this shakeup happen as a result of new , better, interest groups forming, than as a result of companies who have zero i…

How about people who would like to drive uber taxis and people who would like to ride in them?

Re: Spain is trying to get rid of Uber: drivers will face fines up to €18K

#94

Post by samlown »

RBerenguel wrote: post #29
oldspiceman wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can't agree with your point here. It's extremely common to get ripped off by taxis in Spain. There is no incentive for them to be agreeable with foreigners.

Not in Barcelona, at least, since fare prices are shown in the windows (IIRC this is also the norm in the UK, and I thought this was also done Spain-wide, but it's been a while since I took a taxi outside of Barcelona.) Of course, nothing prevents the taxi from driving around needlessly. But this can happen anywhere, Uber or no Uber.

At Cabify we actually get around this issue by calculating the price from the distance of the optimal route between pick-up and destination using Open Street Maps. This incentivises drivers to take the most efficient route and attempt to avoid traffic jams.

Works great! You just sit back and relax while the driver figures out how to get to the destination. Totally avoids the usual stress when a taxi driver takes a wrong turn.

Re: Spain is trying to get rid of Uber: drivers will face fines up to €18K

#95

Post by slowmotiony »

lgieron wrote: post #75
slowmotiony wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know what taxi services are you using, but I live in a major Polish city and the taxis are horrible, for a couple of reasons: - You always get a different price - You never get a receipt (if you request one, you often get yelled at) - Drivers drive like madmen - Sometimes it takes 30+ minutes for a taxi, other times no taxi picks up the damn phone - Sometimes they tell you 20 minutes, and then don't come at a…

Are you a non-native? The culture of overcharging foreigners is probably still pretty strong in many places (it was born during the communist time, where every westerner was perceived as a walking wallet).

I'm native. They don't appear to discriminate, they rip everyone off the same way. ;-)

Re: Spain is trying to get rid of Uber: drivers will face fines up to €18K

#96

Post by pron »

netcan wrote: post #92
pron wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, democracy sucks, but being ruled by VCs carrying the BS banner of "innovation" is far worse. What you see as corrupt institutions, I see as the possibly outdated results of many years of political bargaining, which -- like everything else -- requires the occasional shakeup. But I'd much rather this shakeup happen as a result of new , better, interest groups forming, than as a result of companies who have zero i…

How about people who would like to drive uber taxis and people who would like to ride in them?

I don't know -- that's up to society to decide. If the people think Uber is harmful, they have a right to ban it. At the end of the day, it's up to the people to come up with some bargain that will direct their society in the direction they want. And if society decides one way, but some people prefer it another, well in this case the choice is easy: if riding or driving Uber is so important to them, they can try and move to another country/state/region where Uber is welcome. It's a bit like asking, but what about people who would really like to pay less taxes?

If we don't like our civilization, we're free to rebel. It would be sad, though -- at least in my opinion -- if the cause for rebellion would be a "ride-sharing" app that's become so synonymous with spoiled consumerism.

Re: Spain is trying to get rid of Uber: drivers will face fines up to €18K

#97

Post by pfortuny »

oldspiceman wrote: post #15
pfortuny wrote: post #9

You have to bear in mind that Amazon was not in Spain until just a couple of years ago because you know, the law here is very much pro-publishers. This move is not a surprise for us Spaniards. A real pity. On the other hand, taxis here in Spain are nowhere near the chaos they seem to be in Manhattan or SF. They are usually rather clean (not necessarily shiny but decently clean) and drivers tend to be agreeable (there…

Can't agree with your point here. It's extremely common to get ripped off by taxis in Spain. There is no incentive for them to be agreeable with foreigners.

Well, yes, I not being a foreigner, I have no experience in what you tell so you are probably right there.

Re: Spain is trying to get rid of Uber: drivers will face fines up to €18K

#98

Post by Shorel »

piokoch wrote: post #17

As far as I can see, Uber is the problem in countries, where taxi industry is heavily regularized. Recently Uber started its operation in Poland, in Warsaw. For 2 days that was a news, but later nobody paid much attention on it. In Poland in order to become taxi driver one needs to fulfill a number of conditions (only people who never comitted a crime are allowed a licence, must be physically and mentally healthy) a…

Here in Colombia Uber is AMAZINGLY better than any taxi company. The difference is simply too big.

A normal taxi will not go where I want, or refuse to take me for any other reason. And payment has to be cash only. And there's always some risk the driver will try to take advantage of you.

Re: Spain is trying to get rid of Uber: drivers will face fines up to €18K

#99

Post by Houshalter »

pron wrote: post #23
txutxu wrote: post #11

Well, a taxi license in Spain costs as much as a good new house. Maybe even two houses depending on the area. Historically, people needed to take big credits to start a taxi career. I'm not sure what is my position, but I've empathy for those who did pay such license and special insurances. Also I've empathy for those who want to make use of Uber services. It's not easy to make justice to all of them at the same time…

> Also I've empathy for those who want to make use of Uber services. It's not easy to make justice to all of them at the same time. Well, it depends on your culture and perspective, of course. To me, the answer is almost always clear and obvious: when there's a conflict between the worker's happiness and the consumer's happiness, the worker comes first. Society's role is to ensure its members can make a respectable l…

This position makes no economic sense. Consumers are the end goal of an economy. Workers are just a means to meet consumer demand. Eventually, through automation, we may not even need any workers at all. You can artificially raise wages up to a certain point, but it's not at all clear that this is good for the economy as a whole. E.g. unemployment for workers whose labor isn't worth that much, higher prices for consumers, etc.

A better alternative is something like a basic income. Something that helps all people, not just people who have jobs with high demand. And is payed for by taxing the entire economy, not just businesses that coincidentally employ a lot of workers (or indirectly, their consumers.)

Re: Spain is trying to get rid of Uber: drivers will face fines up to €18K

#100

Post by omonra »

pron wrote: post #51
omonra wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But clearly the issue here is not compensation for the workers. The issue is cost of license. Consider this hypothetical: 1. Country A - taxi license costs $300,000. Average ride costs $30, driver keeps $10 after paying off the license mortgage. 2. Country B - taxi license costs $100. Average ride costs $15, driver keeps $15 since he doesn't have to pay it off.

The structure of the arrangement between taxi companies and the government is different in each area, and is subject both to particular deals struck (and I don't mean that in a bad way, though sometimes it is) and to whatever extra safety procedures the government wants to enforce. For example, a country should be free to require an expensive insurance from taxi drivers, as well as background checks as means to preve…

Color me cynical, but I think that most of opposition to Uber stems not from desire for safety but simple desire to protect the incumbent profits.

Moreover - the 'community' isn't really choosing anything. Instead it's some crony local politicians in the pocket of taxi lobby. If you want to do a referendum on whether Uber should be operating - I'll agree on the 'community' stance. Otherwise it's the minority who have the most to lose advocating against it.

Post reply on HN