Ebola: The tolling bell • Hacker News Board

Re: Ebola: The tolling bell

#41

Post by RVuRnvbM2e » Sat, Oct 04, 2014, 8:57 AM UTC

tomjen3 wrote: post #31

startupfounder wrote: post #14

“No man is an island, entire of itself; every man is a piece of the continent, a part of the main. If a clod be washed away by the sea, Europe is the less, as well as if promontory were, as well as if a manor of thy friends or thine own were. Any man’s death diminishes me, for I am involved in mankind; and therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls; it tolls for thee.” - John Donne, Meditation XVII, Devotio…

I don't really care about what they are as long as they are a treat to my family, which they can are if they move out of Africa. I want a good counter argument to this feeling because it is morally wrong but seems logically sound: between terrorist threatening us at home (they just murdered another british aid worker), ugandas death penalty for homosexuality, out of control ebola in Africa (made a lot worse because t…

> I don't see how we can let these people govern themselves any more.

Many thought the same of Germany in 1945. Be glad that they didn't get their way.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morgenthau_Plan

Re: Ebola: The tolling bell

#42

Post by 616c » Sat, Oct 04, 2014, 8:59 AM UTC

tomjen3 wrote: post #33

jostmey wrote: post #15

Stopping Ebola now could be one of the single most important decisions the world makes this century. Just imagine what would happen if Ebola emerged in lets say India . It doesn't sound so far fetched now that we have seen a case in America. Exponential growth tends to catch people off-guard. Just like Moore's Law lead to a rapid emergence of the home computer, a deadly disease could reshape the world overnight.

The viral factor of ebola is 1.7, but it is also is the place in the world where there is the least amount of medical staff. In addition it would be a lot easier to ban plane travel out of Africa than it would be to end the ebola outbreak. Both options would prevent ebola getting into India. In addition I am not that terrified of India - the kind of people who live about the airline are the kind of people who have ac…

Unfortunately, with all do respect, you do not know the current plight of Indian and South Asian population.

Many of them work in the Persian Gulf in labor camps. ANd I do not mean a couple thousand. In Qatar, there is 10 million plus population, the population is overwhelmingly male, and the Qataris are less one million of that population. Male South Asian laborers are the largest demographic group in the whole country. This is an increasingly common pattern in the region.

There is little or no medical care, and despite first class medical care for expats, it would be way too late for the unprepared MoH units, which receive basically minimal training from the CDC to react in time. This area, specifically Qatar, has become a major transportation for hub internationa flights, hence the real underlying panic for MERS (Middle East Respiratory Syndrome).

If South Asia (India, Pakistan, Nepal, etc.) were hit in any real way, the world would be fucked ... probably in the course of weeks.

Re: Ebola: The tolling bell

#43

Post by robomartin » Sat, Oct 04, 2014, 9:42 AM UTC

adventured wrote: post #10

"The current Ebola epidemic may well become the worst human disaster in this century. And we are not doing enough about it." Ok, I think anyone here generally understands how dangerous Ebola is and could become if it continues to spread. That being said, already this century: Smoking has killed roughly 60 million people HIV / AIDS has killed 20 to 25 million Malaria has killed eight million Diarrhoea has killed perha…

And this is the problem I have with a lot of the bullshit back and forth idiotic arguments you can read every day on HN.

Hey, moron, let me spell it out for you. If my little five year old girl gets ebola she will be in horrible pain crying out for Mommy and Daddy and her siblings, anyone, really, to comfort her. And if Mommy and Daddy do comfort her mommy and Daddy FUCKING DIE. And Mommy and Daddy will probably kill themselves if they watch their little girl die without comforting her. Parent, sibling, families, neighborhoods would be ripped to shreads. I don't know about you, but I would gladly die hugging my little girl until she goes if she has to.

I am almost crying as I write this because I can imagine it and it hurts. A parent's worst nightmare. How dare you compare it to smoking and AIDS. How FUCKING CLUELESS can you possibly be? This IS different. Very different.

Sorry for the emotion and the language. I suggest readers place themselves in the above scenario before posting stupid fucking comments.

And please, donate some money to organizations that can help the people in Africa going through this horrible problem. You know, the Mom and Dad choosing to hug and kiss their little girl and die with her rather than watch her die while she cries out for their love.

Enough said.

Re: Ebola: The tolling bell

#44

Post by yxhuvud » Sat, Oct 04, 2014, 9:53 AM UTC

adventured wrote: post #10

"The current Ebola epidemic may well become the worst human disaster in this century. And we are not doing enough about it." Ok, I think anyone here generally understands how dangerous Ebola is and could become if it continues to spread. That being said, already this century: Smoking has killed roughly 60 million people HIV / AIDS has killed 20 to 25 million Malaria has killed eight million Diarrhoea has killed perha…

And a hundred years ago 50-100 million people died in the Spanish flu in the space of a few years. A pandemic, which Ebola definitely has a quite high possibility to become, has the ability to do home runs that really blow the ball out of the court when it comes to death tolls.

Re: Ebola: The tolling bell

#45

Post by thegreatness » Sat, Oct 04, 2014, 9:53 AM UTC

Havoc wrote: post #2

While the situation is serious - it will be contained eventually in my view. As cynical as it sounds I think there are many positive effects being overlooked here. People need a good wake-up every now and again. We suddenly realized that there is zero global coordination. There is just no global immediate response mechanism in place to deal with this type of stuff. In the Hollywood movies you see the American tanks r…

"We suddenly realized that there is zero global coordination. There is just no global immediate response mechanism in place to deal with this type of stuff.

In the Hollywood movies you see the American tanks roll in as a show of force to contain an area...but where are the American tanks in Nigeria?"

This is why I have to apologize on behalf of Americans when I meet foreigners from any of the dozens of countries the US has recently invaded.

They know not what they do.

Re: Ebola: The tolling bell

#46

Post by newuser88273 » Sat, Oct 04, 2014, 9:55 AM UTC

goldfeld wrote: post #28

lotsofmangos wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have we double booked the Ebola thread with the support group for "Arseholes Anonymous"? Anyone from Europe or America who likes to sit in sneering judgment over the wide variety of cultures in Africa either has no education in their own history or hasn't the strength of character to face up to it.

I'm unsure what's more terrifying going forward, Ebola or the fact that at least three users on this Hacker News story--as opposed to a mainstream newspaper's website comment section where bigotry and ignorant patriotism is the order of the day--have seen no issue in declaring their views unanomymously. Much like death tolls go, how many more wanted to have made similar comments but still had a minimum sense to restr…

Lemmesee. Catch Ebola... or have to read three interweb comments seriously lacking in sensitivity? Tough choice.

Good luck, Ebola-Chan.

Re: Ebola: The tolling bell

#47

Post by ivanca » Sat, Oct 04, 2014, 10:05 AM UTC

The fact that this article has been flagged (is no longer in the front page despite being way up there minutes a go) and the lack of upvotes (compared to other less important articles) makes me fear for the future of humanity. Because despite being made of fairly smart people not even the HN crowd still realizes the gravity of the situation.

Re: Ebola: The tolling bell

#48

Post by bjornsing » Sat, Oct 04, 2014, 10:09 AM UTC

Does anybody know how the (immune) survivors are engaged in the health care system of the affected countries? The treatment itself doesn't seem so advanced, it's main challenge being not getting infected. Being immune would be a huge advantage.

Re: Ebola: The tolling bell

#49

Post by ivanca » Sat, Oct 04, 2014, 10:12 AM UTC

anigbrowl wrote: post #30

jliptzin wrote: post #11

I read somewhere about a black market for ebola survivor blood. At first I misread the title and thought it meant a black market for ebola-infected blood (or ebola-infected cadavers). Now that is a truly scary possibility - terrorists intentionally infecting themselves with ebola, then going into airports and other high density areas, infecting surfaces and as many people as they can before succumbing (or maybe even…

Terrorists could have done that years ago with AIDS or Hepatitis C but they never have - it's not obviously an effective propaganda tool and religious terrorists are likely to have hangups about dying in an unclean fashion.

Why you are being down voted is a mystery to me.

(I upvoted you but I have been vote-banned AKA my votes do nothing at all)

Re: Ebola: The tolling bell

#50

Post by tomjen3 » Sat, Oct 04, 2014, 11:15 AM UTC

lotsofmangos wrote: post #38

tomjen3 wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't really care about what they are as long as they are a treat to my family, which they can are if they move out of Africa. I want a good counter argument to this feeling because it is morally wrong but seems logically sound: between terrorist threatening us at home (they just murdered another british aid worker), ugandas death penalty for homosexuality, out of control ebola in Africa (made a lot worse because t…

Not letting others govern themselves has largely been the problem. If my country had been fucked around by foreign empires for several hundred years rather than being the one doing the fucking, I'd probably trust my local witch more than outside doctors too. Also, the distance between the groups you are treating as some sort of homogeneous lump is 4000 miles, or about the same as Washington State to Northern Japan.

Thanks, that is a pretty good argument.