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How Hong Kong Protesters Are Connecting, Without Cell or Wi-Fi Networks

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Re: How Hong Kong Protesters Are Connecting, Without Cell or Wi-Fi Networks

#111

Post by tnuocca »

portstarboard wrote: post #86

It’s good that the weather is really gentle now in Hong Kong. Here in Ukraine this past winter the “designed in California” didn’t last too long during -13C..-18C nights, even with an external battery, so walkie-talkies were helpful at times. However, the cellular networks did work in the downtown, perhaps with just minor outages, even during the most violent crackdowns. And to address some of the either Russian trol…

The first two paragraphs are useful contribution to discussion. The rest is... well, useless.

"...when people found out that their “radicalism” is only in words, but not in action."

So, you ditched them because they were not radical? If you're gonna rant, at least do it right. We get it, you're being fucked from all sides. Welcome to reality. Other than that, you forgot to mention over 30 volunteer battalions like Aidar that, according to Amnesty International, "have been involved in widespread abuses, including abductions, unlawful detention, ill-treatment, theft, extortion, and possible executions."

http://www.amnesty.org/en/library/asset/EUR50/040/2014/en/bb...

Re: How Hong Kong Protesters Are Connecting, Without Cell or Wi-Fi Networks

#112

Post by Florin_Andrei »

LeoPanthera wrote: post #17

I wanted to like FireChat, as it was previously possible to use it entirely offline, in a purely P2P fashion. While this is still possible, you are now forced to first create an account online, and subscribe to a bunch of internet-based channels, before the app will let you use the P2P portion. This is frustrating. The market is wide open for someone to make a pure P2P communications app that doesn't require internet…

> you are now forced to first create an account online, and subscribe to a bunch of internet-based channels, before the app will let you use the P2P portion.

Hm, I don't know. I've unsubscribed from all internet-based channels, and the P2P still seems available.

Re: How Hong Kong Protesters Are Connecting, Without Cell or Wi-Fi Networks

#113

Post by trhway »

ydevnow wrote: post #83
trhway wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

if you know the centuries old history of that region and in particular of relations between Crimean Tatars and the rest of the population there, Russians included - you wouldn't be that surprised. Of course, Russia has a bunch of territories/ethnicities that wish (and have a lot of valid reasons to) they could go free like Estonia, Ukraine, Uzbekistan, ... did. Chechnya would be among the first coming to mind, and if…

I agree with your point of view. Except, I disagree with your statement on oppression. Russians are not oppressed in any case given. Oppressed are the non-Russians. Most of the Ukrainian soldiers are Russian speaking. Almost anywhere in the country you can find a Russian-taught school (yes, perhaps you need to drive some extra miles). But how many schools are there in Russia that teach Ukrainian? How many schools are…

man, you don't need to tell me how bad Russia is - there is a reason i live in US now :). What i'm saying is that oppression of Russians has forced them to choose Putin's Russia - the situation when Putin's Russia is the better alternative speaks for itself. While oppression and discrimination before Euromaidan was below pain threshold, the Euromaidan brought to power the forces which were clearly intended and now, with the power of the state behind them, capable to perform another tutsi-hutu situation. Of course nobody is going to wait for 1M to be killed before acting this time. Language law and "trains/buses of friendship" was enough for even the stupid ones to understand that it is time to go, that ethnic Russian can hope for any protection from Ukrainian government because the government became the main assailant. The anti-terrorist operation (indiscriminate shelling of civilian cities) only confirmed that the choice was right. New "lustration" law toward ethnic Russians is basically the same as Germans laws 80 years ago prohibiting Jews from all government, education, etc... positions.

When Estonia, Latvia, Litva did similar things to Russians 20+ years ago (with very significant exception - there wasn't violence there) it was at least understandable as a payback for the "occupation". When Ukraine started to do this and let right wing nationalists to escalate violence - what was at least half valid foundation for that? This is why many Russians are pissed off, because Ukraine instead of solving its problems allowed the new oligarchy regime to basically scapegoat ethnic Russians for all the problems. Ukraine people allowed the initial social unrest to be channeled into ethnic dimension.

Re: How Hong Kong Protesters Are Connecting, Without Cell or Wi-Fi Networks

#114

Post by trhway »

teekert wrote: post #92
portstarboard wrote: post #86

It’s good that the weather is really gentle now in Hong Kong. Here in Ukraine this past winter the “designed in California” didn’t last too long during -13C..-18C nights, even with an external battery, so walkie-talkies were helpful at times. However, the cellular networks did work in the downtown, perhaps with just minor outages, even during the most violent crackdowns. And to address some of the either Russian trol…

Thanx for your reply! You know, it is very hard here to form an opinion on these things (Netherlands), we never ever see anything Putin says, we just have conflicting messages in and outside of the news (like http://www.elsevier.nl/Cultuur--Televisie/achtergrond/2014/9... ), the article is about how our news organizations manipulated Putins words. We also hear 30 min after a plane is shot down that the Russians did i…

>So I highly appreciate your insights in these matters.

it isn't an insight. It is propaganda.

Re: How Hong Kong Protesters Are Connecting, Without Cell or Wi-Fi Networks

#115

Post by LeoPanthera »

Florin_Andrei wrote: post #112
LeoPanthera wrote: post #17

I wanted to like FireChat, as it was previously possible to use it entirely offline, in a purely P2P fashion. While this is still possible, you are now forced to first create an account online, and subscribe to a bunch of internet-based channels, before the app will let you use the P2P portion. This is frustrating. The market is wide open for someone to make a pure P2P communications app that doesn't require internet…

> you are now forced to first create an account online, and subscribe to a bunch of internet-based channels, before the app will let you use the P2P portion. Hm, I don't know. I've unsubscribed from all internet-based channels, and the P2P still seems available.

Right, but you're still forced to sign up in the first place.

Re: How Hong Kong Protesters Are Connecting, Without Cell or Wi-Fi Networks

#116

Post by Swannie »

vog wrote: post #73

I find it interesting that here in Berlin (and other cities in Europe, mostly in Germany), we have this for many years - not just for protesters, but for anyone. However, it's not a smartphone app (the network predates smartphones), but a mesh network of WLAN access points. The name of this project is Freifunk: http://freifunk.net/en/

IIRC a number of the contributors to the downstream projects of Serval were some of the early contributors to freifunk.net.

My understanding is that freifunk was a pretty major testbed for peer-to-peer mesh network protocols in Linux, and it's that heritage that's made it into things like Serval and the Mesh Potato.

Whilst Serval has moved on to its own OSLR variant, its roots are firmly embedded in the B.A.T.M.A.N. protocol.

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