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Failing the startup game at Unbabel

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Re: Failing the startup game at Unbabel

#31

That's why I'm very suspicious when it comes to stories about "wonderful work environment" at startups. I'm sure there are quite few startups where people really like to work, but I've a feeling most startups are chaotic, unorganised and ego-driven by the founders. To me it's the extreme opposite of big corporations, where everything is over-managed and run by well-defined processes, whicih may be sometimes irritaing…

I started ignoring most of those "my workplace is so great!" posts after having had a few startups under my belt. It typically is a giant clusterfuck, but if you believe in the business, enjoy your responsibilities, and can handle the nonsense thrown at you, you'll be fine.

Every workplace has its ups and downs, would be weird if it were 100% perfect, eh?

Re: Failing the startup game at Unbabel

#32
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or maybe just not a lot of savings.

Or maybe he wants his story to sound more dramatic >So here I am, back where I started with barely enough money to eat. Come on, you're 37 years old Java professional from Sweden (which is not Nigeria or something). Even unemployed people there get more money which I used to make being programmer. > When I informed my landlord that I wouldn't be able to stay as long as planned she kicked me out of the apartment What,…

Yes, we should all toughen up and so on. But shit still does happen and it does not always happen to the right people.

I've seen people be treated in a very coarse manner by their employers and this story does not read 'off the scale' in any way to me, it could very easily have happened as described. I've seen far worse than this.

Yes, the poster has a partial responsibility in how this all happened and turned out, I'm certainly not denying that. But as an employer, before asking someone to move halfway across Europe (which I would cover with a signing bonus) I'd be much more critical about fit before letting them commit to the move. Maybe a few weeks trial staying in a hotel before finalizing things.

Re: Failing the startup game at Unbabel

#33
post #29
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or maybe he wants his story to sound more dramatic >So here I am, back where I started with barely enough money to eat. Come on, you're 37 years old Java professional from Sweden (which is not Nigeria or something). Even unemployed people there get more money which I used to make being programmer. > When I informed my landlord that I wouldn't be able to stay as long as planned she kicked me out of the apartment What,…

Completely agree, where are all the money you earned in the last 16 years?

Knowing Sweden... in taxes

Re: Failing the startup game at Unbabel

#34

Ok. I have been hacking in startups for 10 years or so. A few rules to note. 1) Startups almost always fail. Pretty much assume at any point you can be let go for any reason. If you can't afford to blow 3 months of salary and be paid in "promise" - don't do it. 2) Startups are not for everyone. Enjoy good code? Like a peaceful atmosphere? Need comments? Love structure and strategy? Welp - you will fail at a startup.…

> Future employers will avoid you like the plague.

What do they know about it, outside of cases that actually end up in the news?

Re: Failing the startup game at Unbabel

#37
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> there's still a lesson in it for every startup founder - developers are necessary and important to your success so being nice (especially if the relationship isn't going well) is a Good Idea. If a founder is only being nice to someone because it's a good idea and in their interest, they are an asshole. It's not a lesson you should need to teach anyone.

>It's not a lesson you should need to teach anyone. Perhaps most of us (the non-assholes?) learn this at such a young age that we don't even remember learning it. But I do believe, because I've seen it happen and done it myself, to varying degrees, that people CAN learn this later in life and change bad behavior (even if it's initially for superficial reasons like a desire to see a venture succeed).

Best to teach people to not be assholes with empathy, not through furthering of their own personal goals and ambitions.

Re: Failing the startup game at Unbabel

#38

Ok. I have been hacking in startups for 10 years or so. A few rules to note. 1) Startups almost always fail. Pretty much assume at any point you can be let go for any reason. If you can't afford to blow 3 months of salary and be paid in "promise" - don't do it. 2) Startups are not for everyone. Enjoy good code? Like a peaceful atmosphere? Need comments? Love structure and strategy? Welp - you will fail at a startup.…

"Legal. You are going to sue a former employer? What a great way of ruining your future."

Could say the same thing to Unbabel if this story is as OP has written it up. Not going to pay out the contract? What a great way of ruining your future. Future employees will avoid you like the plague.

Re: Failing the startup game at Unbabel

#39
I feel for you.

I made a similar leap from an OK-paying regional job at an established niche cashcow to a London start-up. The perks: a coffee machine, senior pay cheque.

The reality: a shit coffee machine, low moral, no realistic prospect of a profit and no willingness to pivot. 80% of costs have been sunk on a Facebook clone 'with a spin' while the owners try to sell snake oil to investors. We operate like the bad slides of 'Good vs Bad Startup' are a blueprint for success. The owners, almost weekly, come up with an idea someone has to coach them away from - a long ironically drawn out confrontational meeting of: "we don't have the resources". The bit I expected to pay off (medical monitoring hardware) turn out to be crappy I2C/SPI bridges any e.eng graduate could whip out in a month :(

I've had long look at myself: how could I turn down other offers yet accept this?! I'm still unsure why. For a while I feared that I deserved this - I'm one of them, one of the guys who decided to create their own header based HTTP authentication system key by a timestamp: a crap programmer.

It's been 4 months. Poor tests are still committed despite my best efforts to teach the one doing it that they should test a result not implementation (only 1 test damn it!). We don't use any JS frameworks on the front-end (yet alone my other true love: Typescript) because the last lead dev couldn't understand the immeasurable benefits of model binding. I've done - by no means single handedly - an incremental rewrite of the entire code base (front, middle and back). Although they're paying me on time, they missed my post probation increase :( I could go on but this is probably not the right forum.

In short: it's not worked out for me either. Thankfully I've got an excellent track record so I'm off in 3 days to a proper PLC. I heard large companies, like the BBC have 15 (FIFTEEN) designers in their News division alone... I can't wait to have just one designer unencumbered, available and talented.

The whole saga has left me with the strong suspicion most startups are a joke (no I don't want to be a DBA/CSS/JS and C# guru who maintains the iOS codebase!).

Inept owners who're unwilling to pivot, often trapped by the sunk cost fallacy, or owners expect to create a market with their 'one true solution [to a problem you no-one has]' plague the startup scene. No product should ever be a Facebook clone :(

For what it's worth, if I was hiring now I'd interview you solely on your written language skills (which are better than most native English speakers, myself included).

Re: Failing the startup game at Unbabel

#40
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> there's still a lesson in it for every startup founder - developers are necessary and important to your success so being nice (especially if the relationship isn't going well) is a Good Idea. If a founder is only being nice to someone because it's a good idea and in their interest, they are an asshole. It's not a lesson you should need to teach anyone.

The lesson is that it's hard to find good developers. More generally, it's quite hard to find good . People assume that available talent fits some sort of bell curve, with lots of 'average' people out there, but really it's more like an inverse square curve - there's a lot more people at the bottom end than the top. When you find the good ones you're nice to them because it's in everyone's interest.

> When you find the good ones you're nice to them because it's in everyone's interest.

Why do you have to differentiate being nice to people based on their abilities in any way at all?

Perhaps I'm misunderstanding your point?

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