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The new land of opportunity for immigrants is Germany

washingtonpost.com

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Re: The new land of opportunity for immigrants is Germany

#41

Post by kghose »

arethuza wrote: post #25
mkaziz wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there something wrong with self-governance, as long as your rules don't violate the laws of the land?

We get a lot of daft Muslim scare stories in some parts of the press here in the UK, "sharia law" being one of the favourites - this article in the Guardian tries to point out the reality: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/may/12/muslim-scare-st... On closer inspection, it is clear sharia courts only have jurisdiction on civil matters and everyone must opt in to a sharia court. They only have an advisory capacity…

There are important issues that crop up when the dispute resolution claims a higher authority. The societal pressure to accept such judgements are a lot higher and the arbitrariness and biases (against women, for example) of such judgements are also higher.

Re: The new land of opportunity for immigrants is Germany

#42

Post by facepalm »

krebby wrote: post #34
Mz wrote: post #16

Excerpt: “Berlin is different than other parts of Germany, and that’s why I think I can make it here,” he said. “It is more relaxed, more accepting than other German cities, and there is no pressure to behave a certain way.” As I understand it, that would be something of a holdover from the cold war days when the culture there was unique due to it's odd political situation.

Largely due to the high numbers of young counterculturalists who moved to West Berlin in the 70s and 80s. (Unlike the rest of West Germany West Berlin didn't have conscription.)

That sounds unlikely, because I think counterculturalists have very strict ideas of how you should be.

Re: The new land of opportunity for immigrants is Germany

#43

Post by facepalm »

DasIch wrote: post #5
aaron-lebo wrote: post #2

Berlin has been talked a lot about on HN, but what is the situation like now? I know for awhile it was relatively cheap which was one of the big perks, but housing costs have gone up due to people moving there. What level of experience would you need as an American programmer to move to Berlin and find work? Is it a realistic option? An example of a past thread: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3221799

Rent prices have definitely exploded and there are no signs that the upwards trend will stop anytime soon. Nevertheless they are still low compared to cities like London or Paris. Furthermore software developers in Berlin are in very high demand. If you speak English fluently and are a good software developer, getting a job in Berlin should be no problem.

Software developers are in demand, but the pay is not that great compared to other places (like Munich of Frankfurt). I think the influx of young developers from all over the world might have something to do with that. Also the lack of big companies, so it's mostly startups with limited money supply who employ developers.

Re: The new land of opportunity for immigrants is Germany

#44

Post by [deleted] »

facepalm wrote: post #42
krebby wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Largely due to the high numbers of young counterculturalists who moved to West Berlin in the 70s and 80s. (Unlike the rest of West Germany West Berlin didn't have conscription.)

That sounds unlikely, because I think counterculturalists have very strict ideas of how you should be.

[deleted]

Re: The new land of opportunity for immigrants is Germany

#45

Post by learc83 »

mkaziz wrote: post #20
rayiner wrote: post #3

The various sides of the immigration debate are talking past each other. This article describes a German program that takes high skill people like the architect profiled in the article, while those opposed to immigration are mainly concerned about the large numbers of low-skill people who are not interested in assimilating. The anti-immigrant folks in Britain and France aren't worried about Mr. Pinol. They're worried…

Is there something wrong with self-governance, as long as your rules don't violate the laws of the land?

I think the fear is that having seen the countries these immigrants come from--in many cases, not liberal democracies--the native population is afraid that the immigrants want to make the country more like the old country, and local sharia courts are just the first step.

Re: The new land of opportunity for immigrants is Germany

#46

Post by danohuiginn »

learc83 wrote: post #38
legulere wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The "issue" with the turkish really cooled down in the last maybe 20 years. Over 50% of young people in Germany already say that Islam belongs to Germany.

>Over 50% of young people in Germany already say that Islam belongs to Germany. What does that mean?

the phrase in German is "Der Islam gehört zu Deutschland" -- which means something like Islam has a place in Germany.

Re: The new land of opportunity for immigrants is Germany

#47

Post by jiggy2011 »

rayiner wrote: post #3

The various sides of the immigration debate are talking past each other. This article describes a German program that takes high skill people like the architect profiled in the article, while those opposed to immigration are mainly concerned about the large numbers of low-skill people who are not interested in assimilating. The anti-immigrant folks in Britain and France aren't worried about Mr. Pinol. They're worried…

In the UK there are definitely worries about low-skill migrants , mainly because of EU right to work rules which allow workers from any EU member country to live and work in the UK. Most of the concern is about migrants from poor countries which are recent EU entries like Romania taking low paying jobs and exerting downward pressure on the wage market.

Re: The new land of opportunity for immigrants is Germany

#48

Post by rayiner »

arethuza wrote: post #25
mkaziz wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there something wrong with self-governance, as long as your rules don't violate the laws of the land?

We get a lot of daft Muslim scare stories in some parts of the press here in the UK, "sharia law" being one of the favourites - this article in the Guardian tries to point out the reality: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/may/12/muslim-scare-st... On closer inspection, it is clear sharia courts only have jurisdiction on civil matters and everyone must opt in to a sharia court. They only have an advisory capacity…

The judgments of arbitration proceedings, etc, are enforceable in regular courts. Its not purely independent of the state.

Re: The new land of opportunity for immigrants is Germany

#49

Post by vincentellis »

chhantyal wrote: post #23
vpdn wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As far as I can tell, you need to have a degree. "Who can apply for the EU Blue Card: ...he or she has a German or an accredited foreign or a university degree that is comparable to a German one" http://www.bluecard-eu.de/eu-blue-card-germany/ http://www.apply.eu/BlueCard/

Degree is required, but not for IT

Not really. I'm a senior software engineer, without a CS degree, and had my permit declined two times, for the same company. I was going to be the CTO, btw. Government does not allow people without a degree.

Re: The new land of opportunity for immigrants is Germany

#50

Post by krebby »

facepalm wrote: post #42
krebby wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Largely due to the high numbers of young counterculturalists who moved to West Berlin in the 70s and 80s. (Unlike the rest of West Germany West Berlin didn't have conscription.)

That sounds unlikely, because I think counterculturalists have very strict ideas of how you should be.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conscription_in_Germany#Conscie...
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