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The Google career path, Part 3: Performance reviews and promotions

matt-welsh.blogspot.com

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Re: The Google career path, Part 3: Performance reviews and promotions

#51
post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But that can kill all innovations. Especially, when junior can't report or discuss ideas with the manager, who can make decisions

> Especially, when junior can't report or discuss ideas with the manager, who can make decisions Why do you think having levels prevents junior people from discussing ideas with their managers? Everybody has the chance to discuss anything with their manager at the weekly one-on-one meetings which are being held with people of all levels. Also, like the post says, your level determines your compensation, but not the p…

Some cultures have much more obsession with hierarchy and status and import this to the work place unfortunately.

Re: The Google career path, Part 3: Performance reviews and promotions

#52
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Speaking from experience, I see everyone from the team leader to the interns tackling bugs on my team at Google. Furthermore, the engineer with the highest level on my team has done a tremendous amount of refactoring and maintenance work over the course of the past year. Clearly this is just anecdotal, but from what I've seen an engineer who took the initiative to improve performance/stability or significantly refact…

Former employee here. I had a very opposite experience. New features were key for promotion. Performance/stability tweaks or bug fixes would only add to your promotion chances if they had a demonstrably large impact. I wasn't at that level but this was super true for L5-L6ish engineers or above. Yes they had to tackle bugs, but they weren't getting to L6 unless they led an effort for a big feature within a project, o…

The stack ranking element is also open to abuse and capture by outsiders i.e. only so many L3 to L4 slots available in any cycle as some hr been counter is getting a bonus for reducing the pay quanta.

It was even worse at British telecom where there might be only 20-25 MPG 4 (L4 or r 5 in google terms) slots every 18 months or so for all of Systems Engineering (a division with more employees that goggle has now) - competition to just get past the paper sift to an actual interview as brutal.

Its interesting my boss said well if you get an interview we think you can do the job its just deciding who gets a promotion or not

Re: The Google career path, Part 3: Performance reviews and promotions

#53
post #50
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That explains. I guess the key to the promotion this year is to integrate your project with G+ (bonus points if user face no choice).

I see you're getting downvoted for this, but the only thing that's wrong with it is that you're a bit late on the schedule. If you go back to the 2011 era it was absolutely true.

I wanted to say "As someone who got promoted in 2011, I can concur", but technically I got promoted about 3 months before I integrated my project with G+.

Re: The Google career path, Part 3: Performance reviews and promotions

#54
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is why the supposed meritocracy, promotions, and market economy of effort is a sham at corporations. In the real marketplace, support makes income happen. If a person is the owner of the company and does the necessary support, they reap the profits. But employees are not owners and corporations are not fair. The idealized marketplace is where everyone is their own corporation and the real marketplace determines…

Totally agree with you Plus the game is further rigged in favor of the corporation >If you want to get promoted, just start acting like someone at the next level up. Imagine 5 people working their ass off to go to the next level only 1 gets promoted But company gets more throughput for free

FWIW, the entrepreneurial market is the same. Just s/company/customer/. You have lots of firms all competing for the customer's business, but only one will get the contract.

Re: The Google career path, Part 3: Performance reviews and promotions

#55
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my experience it helps if you can demonstrate the impact of your maintenance work. "Cleaned up the configuration" is worth something. "Improved the configuration to make a certain class of misconfiguration, which has caused several outages in the past, impossible" is worth much more. IMHO impact is really what matters most. I think where some people go astray is they rewrite a block of code but fail to convince th…

It would be fantastic if customer reviews were included in the peer review process, because there have been a number of times where things were launched for Google Apps customers that became a major cluster, or which actively strove to remove heavily used features, or which otherwise broke many companies' processes & use cases.

This would be challenging to do fairly. Visual redesigns are almost always received negatively because they force users to learn a new UI, but they are very necessary because otherwise your product starts looking very dated compared to competitors, which prevents non-consumers from adopting it. On the other side, niche features are usually received very positively because it's easy to make a product that suits every user's needs when you only have a few users. (This is behind YC's advice to "do things that don't scale" when you're small.) Internal refactorings and cost/performance improvements aren't user-visible at all.

What's good for the customer isn't always what's good for Google as a company. Usually when Google has done things that piss off a lot of users they've been alerted by significant internal feedback that users will be pissed off, and done it anyways for other reasons. (The one exception I can think of was Buzz, which was beloved internally and reviled externally.)

Re: The Google career path, Part 3: Performance reviews and promotions

#56
post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just the need not to be homeless. EDIT: I'm not trying to be snarky. I literally work to pay for rent and food. Sorry if this bums you out.

>I literally work to pay for rent and food. Sorry if this bums you out. You spend a third of your life working, if you're only doing it for the money then I feel you're quite literally wasting your life. It doesn't particularly "bum me out", but I do feel sorry for people like you.

Please consider the following scenarios, all of which are things that really happen.

1. The best-paid job you can get pays just barely enough to keep your family in decent conditions. So you take that job, for the money. It costs 1/3 of your life, but the benefit is that your spouse and children get not to starve or live in squalor. Wasted?

2. You give a substantial fraction of your income to charities that save the lives of desperately poor people in Africa. You take a well-paid job, for the money. It costs 1/3 of your life, but the benefit is that every year you're working one more poor African gets to live instead of dying.

3. You have a choice between a job you like pretty well, and a job that's merely OK but pays a lot more. You take the well-paid job, for the money. It costs 1/3 of your life (or, more precisely, 1/3 of your life is somewhat less satisfying than it could have been), but the benefit is that you retire at 50 instead of 60 and have an extra decade of (according to taste) leisure, or working for the public good rather than for money, or starting your own business with the security of knowing you won't starve if it fails, or whatever.

All of these involve working "for the money". The only one of these people I'd feel sorry for is the first -- and not (as in your remark) because s/he is making a tragic mistake, but because s/he is in a difficult situation where no course of action is satisfactory.

Re: The Google career path, Part 3: Performance reviews and promotions

#57
post #3

>If you want to get promoted, just start acting like someone at the next level up. Not at Google, but this is how I've always treated my career. Kind of a step beyond "dress for the job you want."

This is a very risky strategy if your boss is easily threatened by talent.

Re: The Google career path, Part 3: Performance reviews and promotions

#58
That is, nobody is going to say, "You're only an L4, therefore you can't work on this project."

Someone said exactly that to me when I was at Google. That's kinda how closed allocation works.

What I always tell people: If you want to get promoted, just start acting like someone at the next level up.

At any company, that's the quickest way to get fired. Getting into a turf war with someone with a much higher title? Not a good idea. To be honest, if I were to do Google again, I'd have kept my head down and said "Yes, sir". It can do a lot for your career to work there, but it's not a place where you can safely overperform.

However, there is a way to provide private feedback that can only be seen by your manager; in my experience this backchannel is rarely used.

"Yes, I realize that a murder count of 2,500 in a city of 1 million is horrifying. But look on the bright side. That means there were 997,500 people who were not murdered last year."

Managers take all of your reviews as input and determine a performance rating, which is a score in one of five buckets to indicate how well you're doing overall.

As of 2011, you actually get a score between 1.0 and 5.0. Almost everyone is between 3.0 and 4.0. The buckets are very large. "Meets Expectations" is everything from a 3.0 (acceptable for new hires, but damning if you've been there for a while) to 3.4 (slightly above average). If you're in this bucket, you don't know if you've been marked as a loser (and rendered unable to transfer) or are getting 65th-percentile ratings. You can literally waste 18 months on a loser project only to find you can't transfer because your boss gave you 3.0's.

These scores are also calibrated against other managers across the organization, to prevent managers from biasing their scores -- an individual manager can't game the system.

That's a nice way to present stack ranking. Each boss gets a finite number of calibration points and has to pick who does well and who doesn't. If he gets a crappy allotment and desperately needs to use all his points to promote the guy who'll do a startup unless bumped, you could get stuck with a (career-ending) 2.9.

----

The important thing to remember about Google's promotion process is that it's bicameral. Manager-assigned calibration scores are one component. Peer reviews are another. You need both to advance at Google. Google provides multiple paths to failure, not multiple paths to success. If your manager likes you and gives you 4.0+, you can still get dinged for lack of visibility. On the other hand, if your manager is giving you shit for calibration scores, all the peer review in the world won't get you out of the muck. I've known many Googlers to damage their careers by playing their manager but not the crowd, or vice versa. You need to play both games at the same time.

For a better analysis of Google's promotion/review system, read Piaw Na's essays, such as this one: http://piaw.blogspot.com/2010/04/promotion-systems.html

This is also worth reading: http://valleywag.gawker.com/eric-schmidt-personally-ruined-g...

Re: The Google career path, Part 3: Performance reviews and promotions

#59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Former employee here. I had a very opposite experience. New features were key for promotion. Performance/stability tweaks or bug fixes would only add to your promotion chances if they had a demonstrably large impact. I wasn't at that level but this was super true for L5-L6ish engineers or above. Yes they had to tackle bugs, but they weren't getting to L6 unless they led an effort for a big feature within a project, o…

The stack ranking element is also open to abuse and capture by outsiders i.e. only so many L3 to L4 slots available in any cycle as some hr been counter is getting a bonus for reducing the pay quanta. It was even worse at British telecom where there might be only 20-25 MPG 4 (L4 or r 5 in google terms) slots every 18 months or so for all of Systems Engineering (a division with more employees that goggle has now) - co…

Regarding the bean counters, keeping promos down doesn't help their budgets as much as you might think. The bonus you get for "exceeds expectations" brings you approximately to the "meets expectations" total compensation of the next level up.

Or so I've been told anecdotally ... personally I have yet to be promoted or experience a bonus cycle where I hit exceeds...

Re: The Google career path, Part 3: Performance reviews and promotions

#60

That is, nobody is going to say, "You're only an L4, therefore you can't work on this project." Someone said exactly that to me when I was at Google. That's kinda how closed allocation works. What I always tell people: If you want to get promoted, just start acting like someone at the next level up. At any company, that's the quickest way to get fired. Getting into a turf war with someone with a much higher title? No…

The 1.0 to 5.0 system doesn't exist any more. What is in the OP's blog post is how it's done as of 2014. (Very recent Xoogler here).
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