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The Google career path, Part 3: Performance reviews and promotions

matt-welsh.blogspot.com

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Re: The Google career path, Part 3: Performance reviews and promotions

#21

Post by nostrademons »

Afforess wrote: post #2

No wonder Google lets many services languish. With a system of promotion based on launches of new products/services/features there is no personal incentive to make things work long term. It seems like the person who redesigns the gmail categories for the nth time would get a promotion, but someone who followed up on bug reports, maintenance and stability patches years later wouldn't. Support is just as important as i…

This was true and a very big problem for a while. I started seeing improvement around 2011/2012, when promo committees started valuing grungy maintenance & refactoring tasks more. It is still harder to get promoted doing maintenance work than high-profile launches, but the gap has narrowed significantly.

Possibly not coincidentally, this was also the beginning of Larry's "More wood behind fewer arrows" push.

Re: The Google career path, Part 3: Performance reviews and promotions

#22

Post by mendicantB »

typpo wrote: post #16
Afforess wrote: post #2

No wonder Google lets many services languish. With a system of promotion based on launches of new products/services/features there is no personal incentive to make things work long term. It seems like the person who redesigns the gmail categories for the nth time would get a promotion, but someone who followed up on bug reports, maintenance and stability patches years later wouldn't. Support is just as important as i…

Is there any company where churning through a list of bugs and maintenance projects will get you further in the long term than launching new things? Hacker News generally praises "ship it" culture, where experimentation and measurement is prioritized as the way to succeed. This is considered a good thing in most places and the incentives are not unique to Google.

Facebook. See http://www.quora.com/For-top-technology-companies-what-of-th...

Re: The Google career path, Part 3: Performance reviews and promotions

#23

Post by sid- »

codeonfire wrote: post #5
Afforess wrote: post #2

No wonder Google lets many services languish. With a system of promotion based on launches of new products/services/features there is no personal incentive to make things work long term. It seems like the person who redesigns the gmail categories for the nth time would get a promotion, but someone who followed up on bug reports, maintenance and stability patches years later wouldn't. Support is just as important as i…

This is why the supposed meritocracy, promotions, and market economy of effort is a sham at corporations. In the real marketplace, support makes income happen. If a person is the owner of the company and does the necessary support, they reap the profits. But employees are not owners and corporations are not fair. The idealized marketplace is where everyone is their own corporation and the real marketplace determines…

Totally agree with you Plus the game is further rigged in favor of the corporation >If you want to get promoted, just start acting like someone at the next level up. Imagine 5 people working their ass off to go to the next level only 1 gets promoted But company gets more throughput for free

Re: The Google career path, Part 3: Performance reviews and promotions

#24

Post by yen223 »

Afforess wrote: post #2

No wonder Google lets many services languish. With a system of promotion based on launches of new products/services/features there is no personal incentive to make things work long term. It seems like the person who redesigns the gmail categories for the nth time would get a promotion, but someone who followed up on bug reports, maintenance and stability patches years later wouldn't. Support is just as important as i…

This problem isn't limited to Google. Everyone remembers the creator, nobody cares about the maintainer. There's a reason why software developers in general earn more than QA.

Re: The Google career path, Part 3: Performance reviews and promotions

#25

Post by ChuckMcM »

sid- wrote: post #13

>If you want to get promoted, just start acting like someone at the next level up. This is the most ridiculous thing companies make u do I start acting and working like a CEO will I become one ?

No I didn't down vote you, but in my experience that is exactly correct. If you start acting like the CEO you will eventually become the CEO. The tricky bit though is that often times people don't really know why the CEO acts as they do. And that is partly because there is information available to the CEO that isn't available to just anyone, and partly because the CEO is often balancing problems and opportunities that aren't necessarily visible to those outside their direct reports.

One of the first things I try to impress upon new managers is that their job is not about telling people what to do, rather their job is about getting the most done with the people they have on the most important parts of the problem. They have to take the whole set of possible things that could be worked on, and figure out the important ones to invest in. Sometimes the importance comes from being or staying competitive, sometimes the importance comes from keeping things alive long enough to get to the next milestone.

Re: The Google career path, Part 3: Performance reviews and promotions

#27

Post by ChuckMcM »

patio11 wrote: post #15
sliverstorm wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you think of a better argument to give your boss for why you should be promoted than, "I am already doing the work of one grade above me"?

"I am already doing the work of one grade above me... at Facebook." I'm joking, but not by much.

"I [think] I am already doing the work of one grade above me... at Facebook."

Is more often the case. It's interesting to see folks who act on that thought and find out they were mistaken. A manager of mine once quipped "The grass is always greener somewhere else, but sometimes that is because it's astroturf."

Re: The Google career path, Part 3: Performance reviews and promotions

#28

Post by codeonfire »

amaks wrote: post #7
codeonfire wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is why the supposed meritocracy, promotions, and market economy of effort is a sham at corporations. In the real marketplace, support makes income happen. If a person is the owner of the company and does the necessary support, they reap the profits. But employees are not owners and corporations are not fair. The idealized marketplace is where everyone is their own corporation and the real marketplace determines…

But no one holds you at that job though, right?

Just the need not to be homeless.

EDIT: I'm not trying to be snarky. I literally work to pay for rent and food. Sorry if this bums you out.

Re: The Google career path, Part 3: Performance reviews and promotions

#29

Post by quest88 »

dsplatonov wrote: post #19
mynameisvlad wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pretty much all companies have levels. Even if it's not something as set in stone as Google's 1-11, or Microsoft's 59+, there's almost always some sort of differentiator, from something as small as "Senior" or "Junior" to denote experience.

But that can kill all innovations. Especially, when junior can't report or discuss ideas with the manager, who can make decisions

If you work at a company like this you should leave immediately.

Re: The Google career path, Part 3: Performance reviews and promotions

#30

Post by yid »

kentonv wrote: post #11

Google's system is promotion-by-committee. It ends up having the same pros and cons as any committee-based system. On one hand, it avoids the kind of egregious mistakes and crimes that occur when too much power (i.e. to promote others) is vested in individual people (e.g. managers). On the other hand, committees are risk-adverse and will shy away from controversial actions. People who do good work following expected…

> or who don't fit into an obvious mold,

Genuine question: is that why you went in a completely different direction with Capn'proto than protobufs?

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